True Effectiveness of Cutler Style Chelation

[bjl218]

@Learner1, would you mind posting your SNPs (specifically detox pathway-related) so we can see how yours compares to ours? No problem if that's information you'd prefer not to share.

 

[aquariusgirl]

@Learner1 are you saying you get better results with the PolyMVA? that's kinda interesting.

 

[caledonia]

I think it's also important to note that Cutler's protocol is used to primarily (exclusively?) address mercury toxicity. If you've accumulated multiple toxic metals, it might not be the most appropriate protocol.

In @Learner1's case, it seem like there's a need to get the multiple metals out as quickly as possible despite any possible risk of redistribution.

I'm not promoting any protocol over any other and I have no issue with Cutler's protocol.

As far as I know, Cutler's protocol will get out all metals. You would have to use several types of chelators. Some of the metals can't be directly chelated out, but will come out once you get mercury out of the way, and the body's detoxification system works well enough to handle it.

 

[garyfritz]

I think it's also important to note that Cutler's protocol is used to primarily (exclusively?) address mercury toxicity. If you've accumulated multiple toxic metals, it might not be the most appropriate protocol.

It's primarily aimed at mercury, but not exclusively. As @caledonia said (while I was tying this response ), the chelators work on other metals too. I'm no expert but I remember ALA also chelates arsenic, and DMSA is an effective chelator for lead. (Though you use a different schedule for lead, doing only one DMSA round per month. Lead is stored primarily in the bones, and they release the lead very slowly.). And your body is supposed to be more efficient at removing aluminum once the mercury is gone.

@Learner1, I'm not saying that IV chelation is a third rate protocol. I'm just stating the fact that we've seen a lot of people damaged by it. As you said, most medical practitioners are not well informed on safe chelation practices, and improper chelation practices can definitely hurt people. If you manage to find a properly trained medical practitioner (though I don't know how you do that) then as you say it's probably safe. (However by my understanding of the pharmacokinetics, the huge isolated spike of chelator levels from an IV is inherently dangerous.) The additional monitoring and lab work you mentioned is probably a very good idea.

But I believe Cutler chelation is also safe and effective, without the spike-level risks, and at a small fraction of the cost. I haven't seen anyone harmed by it in the last two years and I've seen many people get dramatically better. So, for me, I believe it's a better choice. You choose what you're comfortable with.

 

[Learner1]

...And the support for detoxification is critical. Supporting both Phase I and II pathways and replenishing minerals. It's when these essential steps get skipped or are done haphazardly that people run into trouble.

 

[Learner1]

@Learner1, would you mind posting your SNPs (specifically detox pathway-related) so we can see how yours compares to ours? No problem if that's information you'd prefer not to share.

Not sure I want them posted publicly, but I have my fair share.

@Learner1 are you saying you get better results with the PolyMVA? that's kinda interesting.

I'm getting what I'd call extra results with PolyMVA. I'd chelated extensively with conventional chelators - DMSA, DMPS, EDTA, and had reached a point of diminishing returns. The PolyMVA pulled a LOT of stuff out that had been deeply sequestered in my system, that hadn't measured on tests but showed up at high levels when I started the PolyMVA. Having seen this, this is why I think people are a lot more toxic than they realize. It took 9 months of PolyMVA before I experienced its touted energy benefits.

 

[bjl218]

@Learner1, could you expand on what additional testing/lab work your practitioner is doing to monitor those "other" systems you referred to? E.g. phase I/II detox, digestion, etc? How often do you do these labs?

 

[bjl218]

Thank you for the clarifications @caledonia and @garyfritz. I stand corrected!

 

[aquariusgirl]

I wonder if the POLYMVA is pulling oxalate and that is pulling metals?

also wondering why palladium is part of the recipe? isn't that a toxic heavy metal?

 

[Learner1]

I wonder if the POLYMVA is pulling oxalate and that is pulling metals?

No. From what I understand, ALA won't do much with oxalates. B6 will reduce oxalates, and gall bladder support will, though.

ALA is a known heavy metal chelator, which is especially effective as it works with both fat and water soluble substances.

It also boosts glutathione production, needed for detoxification.

also wondering why palladium is part of the recipe? isn't that a toxic heavy metal?

I was a bit worried at first. My doctor produced a letter discussing how the palladium is locked in the polymer, similar to how the cobalt, a toxic element, is locked into the B12 molecule, and will not come out.

PolyMVA is the product of years of research, to create a molecule with the needed properties.

Poly-MVA is unique because of the special, proprietary manufacturing process by which lipoic acid is bonded to Palladium (LAPd).

No other company produces any product similar to Poly-MVA because of the patented preparation and bonding process through which LAPd is manufactured.

The proprietary formulation of LAPd with other vitamins, minerals, and amino acids provides considerable nutritional support and may assist in boosting the body’s immune response and in healing damaged cells.

Poly-MVA provides the following nutritional support to the body as it:

• Helps the body to produce energy.
• Supports the liver in removing harmful substances from the body.
• Assists in preventing cell damage.
• Assists the body in removing heavy metals from the bloodstream.
• Provides the body with a powerful antioxidant and detoxifier.
• Prevents B12 deficiency - related mental disturbances in the elderly.
• Supports nerve and neurotransmitter function.
• Enhances white blood cell function.
• Supports pH balance, helping to maintain oxygenation of cells and tissues.

See attached for more info.

It has been used extensively for cancer treatment, which is how I originally learned about it. (I wish there were more info, but as it is a nutritional supplement it doesn't have the expensive trials of big pharmaceutical company chemotherapy trials...)

 

[bjl218]

Very interesting. Looks like you can buy PolyMVA (oral) from a number of places including Amazon. Lots of rave reviews (if you can trust them) on Amazon. I wonder if many of the people using it on themselves (as opposed to their pets) are benefiting from the chelation of toxic metals they didn't know they had or the increased glutathione production or both.

 

[garyfritz]

My doctor produced a letter discussing how the palladium is locked in the polymer,

That is uncomfortably reminiscent of "the mercury is locked in the amalgam"...

B12 is a molecule and is held together by molecular forces. I really don't know – is the same true for a polymer?

 

[Learner1]

Your mercury analogy is not the same.

 

[garyfritz]

Didn't say it was. But can you say with absolute certainty that the palladium is locked into the polymer? There have been plenty of "letters" that claimed mercury can't escape from the amalgam.

 

[bjl218]

I think that what @Learner1 is saying is that in the absence of definitive data on this therapy, she trusts the doctor she's working with. There's very little you can be sure about especially when it comes to what might currently be considered "alternative" therapies. Just about any chelation therapy you can find has its detractors nowadays. So whom do you trust?

 

[Learner1]

Thanks, @bjl218

I have been working with very experienced doctors who have been doing this for many years, have done NIH funded research and other research themselves, have reached out to other researchers to be sure of what they are doing, and teach doctors internationally on how to do this. Plus, it's not just me, I've witnessed many other patients successfully chelating under their supervision for the past 8 years.

I'll take that over generic web advice that is not attuned to my situation, my exposures, my genetics, and my nutrient and digestive status any day. Even in the same person, conditions change over time, as I've seen by my lab tests and those of family members and fellow patients. It is not, in my mind, a do it yourself project, lacking medical supervision.

The Cutler protocol is designed to be as safe as it can be for the do-it-yourself, but as I've stated, with a heavy burden of unknown quantity of several metals, it runs the risk of being either too slow before something nasty crops up, or can blow up with mistakes by those who follow it blindly and may miss some of the nuances.

In a perfect world, what I've experienced would be cheaper and more readily available, and I understand that each patient had to make their own choices given the resources they have.

 

[garyfritz]

Sounds like you're doing this as carefully as you can. I hope it works out well for you.

I wonder what function the palladium serves? A quick search turns up organopalladium and related fields. Maybe it catalyzes some reaction in the cell?

 

[Tuskentank]

Thanks, @bjl218

I have been working with very experienced doctors who have been doing this for many years, have done NIH funded research and other research themselves, have reached out to other researchers to be sure of what they are doing, and teach doctors internationally on how to do this. Plus, it's not just me, I've witnessed many other patients successfully chelating under their supervision for the past 8 years.

I'll take that over generic web advice that is not attuned to my situation, my exposures, my genetics, and my nutrient and digestive status any day. Even in the same person, conditions change over time, as I've seen by my lab tests and those of family members and fellow patients. It is not, in my mind, a do it yourself project, lacking medical supervision.

The Cutler protocol is designed to be as safe as it can be for the do-it-yourself, but as I've stated, with a heavy burden of unknown quantity of several metals, it runs the risk of being either too slow before something nasty crops up, or can blow up with mistakes by those who follow it blindly and may miss some of the nuances.

In a perfect world, what I've experienced would be cheaper and more readily available, and I understand that each patient had to make their own choices given the resources they have.

Hi Learner 1,

Can you tell me a bit more about how you were given mineral replenishment? This is my big issue. I can take a full bottle of HMD heavy metal detox in a week now, and barely feel the mercury moving, but when I tried ALA as per Cutler my mineral levels plummeted, especially potassium. I'm also methylating though and this definitely moves metals out, as I can feel it.

In your experience as well, of the metals you chelated, can you point to any that you felt physically moving? I can literally feel the metals moving through my head, into what I'm presuming is the portal vein, and it burns as it moves through.

Another thing that I've found to detox my brain is sustained release melatonin but it does so at an incredible rate, so much so that I was toxic sick yesterday and had to take Shade's IMD to clear it out.

Sorry, I'm rambling, but really curious as to how to go about mineral replenishment and how it was done, how often for you, etc.

Thanks in advance.