Thinking about starting a methylation protocol, is this a good one?

[Critterina]

If you eat soy you can easily get that amount from the from diet. It's highly unlikely it will kill anyone.

Sure, PS lowers cortisol significantly when taken at high doses (600mg) and it can control stress at lower doses (400mg).

Yep, I avoid soy, too. But the PS nearly landed me in the emergency room in just a few days.

 

[picante]

This might help. Posted Monday by sheclimber:
http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?entries/my-understanding-of-freddds-protocol.1697/

 

[drob31]

Yep, I avoid soy, too. But the PS nearly landed me in the emergency room in just a few days.

I wonder if it was a coincidence? I guess if your cortisol was already extremely low this could be possible, but soy derivied PS hasn't been shown to have the same impact on the HPA-axis that bovine derivied has, at least, studies haven't shown this.

 

[Critterina]

I wonder if it was a coincidence? I guess if your cortisol was already extremely low this could be possible, but soy derivied PS hasn't been shown to have the same impact on the HPA-axis that bovine derivied has, at least, studies haven't shown this.

After the ill-advised experiment with PS, as my cortisol dropped lower and lower, I had more and more symptoms of adrenal crisis. I almost landed in the emergency room again about 3 months later, same symptoms, without the PS. I am now on prednisone for almost one year and functioning well. No more: nausea, dizziness, stress-induced fainting, hypoglycemia several times a day, hypersensitivity to chemicals, vertigo, extreme fatigue, extreme weakness, nightly insomnia, dull pain in the kidney area during the insomnia, and buzzy arms and legs upon waking. But the PS had been a preview of coming attractions. Yes, low cortisol: undetectable saliva (free) cortisol, low ACTH stim response. I have utter confidence that this was no coincidence.
Be careful..."studies haven't shown" doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Sometimes it means the studies weren't designed to show it or no studies have been done.

 

[Sherpa]

@andre79 Based on my experience, I would start with Rich's Simplified Methylation Protocol first. If it's not strong enough, then you could try Freddd's.



Simplified Methylation Protocol - October 2014 modification

Some of the recommended supplements in the final update of Rich's SMP no longer exist (Neurological Health Formula , Smart Youthful Energy). Some brands, like Perque & Metagenics, are still around but expensive.

Here is a "modern" version of the SMP that I was able to to put together:

1. All-in-One Multivitamin / Mineral - (1 to 4 capsules per day) - http://www.holisticheal.com/all-in-one-multi-vitamin-mineral-120-capsules.html

2. Swanson Ultra Supplemelts Sublingual Vitamin B12 (hydroxycobalmin) - 2 tablets per day under tounge - http://www.swansonvitamins.com/swanson-ultra-supplemelt-sublingual-vitamin-b-12-1000-mcg-60-tabs

3. Solgar Metafolin 400mcg (1/2 tablet per day) - http://www.iherb.com/Solgar-Folate-As-Metafolin-400-mcg-100-Tablets/14274#

4. Source Naturals MegaFolinic 800mcg (1/4 tablet per day) http://www.iherb.com/Source-Naturals-MegaFolinic-800-mcg-120-Tablets/7735#

or

Kirkman Labs Folinic Acid 400mcg (1/2 capsule) - http://www.amazon.com/Folinic-Acid-400-mcg-Capsules/dp/B008BOSMC0

5. NT Factor EnergyLipids Powder (1/8 to 1/4 teaspoon, once or twice a day) - http://www.pureformulas.com/nt-factors-energy-lipid-powder-150-grams-by-nutricology.html#.


If you are on a budget, #5 can be replaced by sunflower lecithin but the NT Factor seems to have a much more potent effect.

 

[Freddd]

@Sherpa,

Here is the problem I have, intellectually, with many protocols. They make too many assumption. They assume HyCbl is a fully functional b12, assume folinic acid is a fully functional folate. The multi has folic acid. This is for a group with widespread folate polymorphisms. Then when a person has "detox" it is a wild goose chase as to whether the "detox" is worsened partial methylation block or induced deficiency of folate and/or potassium due to successful methylation startup.

 

[Sherpa]

@Freddd Rich's protocol is too weak for me, the hydroxyB12 barely has any effect. but if someone is brain fogged, as the original poster is, and wants to try methylation without being able to do proper research... I say start weak, slow and low first!

Methylfolate and potassium have both caused severe, unsettling side effects for me... and i believe they deserve a good deal of research and understanding before partaking...

 

[Freddd]

@Freddd Rich's protocol is too weak for me, the hydroxyB12 barely has any effect. but if someone is brain fogged, as the original poster is, and wants to try methylation without being able to do proper research... I say start weak, slow and low first!

Methylfolate and potassium have both caused severe, unsettling side effects for me... and i believe they deserve a good deal of research and understanding before partaking...

Choose your assumptions wisely, your life and health depends on them. Mine sure do. Methylfolate is what evolution of mammals has settled on. Folic acid is to methylfolate as linoleum is to fresh veggie oil, highly oxidized. It is fortunate for most that they can used veggie folates too (also an assumption) but demonstrated pretty well for those not sick with folate and b12 problems as demonstrated in ME, CFS and FMS. Happy searching and researching.

 

[aturtles]

Folinic acid can be as bad or worse than folic acid for some people. Not all methylfolate forms are as effective as Metafolin. Personally, until I had succeeded in getting methylation started up with MeCbl and Metafolin, then a person can do a comparison. Until they have succeeded in getting methylation going, and are taking folinic acid and/or HyCbl the person will never know whether those are causing them to spin their tires in the dark or if something else is the problem.

@Freddd, I didn't know that folinic acid was problematic as well as folic acid. Having been burned by folic acid (never again -- three days was a hell), I use only l-methylfolate (deplin), but I have a friend in the medical community who might think that folinic acid is okay, even if folic acid is not. Can you say more about folinic acid being a problem?

 

[aerobic1]

Does anyone like the holistic health all in one? It seems like a multivitamin with extremely low doses of vitamins/minerals.

Hello. I am a new poster here but have been lurking in the background for several months. I enjoy the many views and high level of participation by many members on Phoenix Rising.

I started using All-In-One two months ago for its low B6 and like it a lot. I was taking LEF Two-Per-Day capsules but found it too strong. It pushed my sulfites up to 1,600 which is likely due to the 75 MG of B6. I have 3 CBS ++ and +- mutations along with 3 BHMT++ ones.

At last count I have 72 mutations, 22 which are homozygous. I cannot detox very well at all and am loaded with mercury and lead as well as having Lyme, Epstein-Barr, leaky gut, parasites and a bunch of other projects to work on. I have made many mistakes in methylation protocols but am making progress. So many efforts to correct a given methylation block turn out to negatively impact another block. Damned if you do and dammed if you don't as they say.

Along with All-In-One I have been able to very slowly ramp up methyl donors to get methylation moving. My dipstick for progress is how my brain fog and muscle pain responds and by the level of my homocysteine. I knocked out the Lyme totally, chelated out the majority of metals, killed of the parasites and healed my gut.