• Welcome to Phoenix Rising!

    Created in 2008, Phoenix Rising is the largest and oldest forum dedicated to furthering the understanding of and finding treatments for complex chronic illnesses such as chronic fatigue syndrome (ME/CFS), fibromyalgia (FM), long COVID, postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome (POTS), mast cell activation syndrome (MCAS), and allied diseases.

    To become a member, simply click the Register button at the top right.

Thiamine, endothelial cells and nitric oxide

Gondwanaland

Senior Member
Messages
5,092
encouraging to hear your plaque were resorbed
The clots resorbed but the plaque is a new addition.
What dosage of Omega 3 were you using and what was omega 6 omega 3 ration. What was dosage and brand for Gamma E.
NOW Foods Omega 3 and NOW Foods Gamma E (half dosage since full dosage caused bruising). 1 capsule of each with dinner. However the Gamma E dark capsule destroys B1, so I had to chew it and spit the capsule out.

In the reviews I see they changed the formula, so the exact one I took is no longer available

Here is the old label:
GammaE.jpg
 
Last edited:

prioris

Senior Member
Messages
622
So does vit E

it is technically a blood thinner but the gamma e gets absorbed into the tissues and most beneficial part

It doesn't effect vitamin K2 nor prevent taking vitamin K1. Also vitamin K1 will be stored and used as needed. One can experiment and adjust it especially if bruising. once a day dose at largest meal probably good.
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,384
Location
Austria
Here is the old label:
View attachment 21572

Be aware of a glitch in labeling 'mixed tocopherol' products. If the separate γ-, δ- and β-tocopherol content isn't specified, it probably is mainly regular alpha-tocopherol with a few miligram of the other tocopherols drown in the mix for being able to market an inexpensive 'mixed tocopherol' product.

Personally used this poduct, with 300 mg of Gamma-Tocopherols.

(corrected)
 

prioris

Senior Member
Messages
622
clot can be both calcium and plaque.

because increasing nitric oxide doesn't help, i think one has to approach it to quenching nitric oxide radicals to prevent inflammation process in arteries from beginning whichbegin the plaque and calcium accumulation. SOD has that function too.
 

prioris

Senior Member
Messages
622
The use of aspirin to prevent heart attack is wide spread due to blood thinning effect but unlike vitamin E, it's benefits stop there. maybe i can test it to see if it changes how often I need to take my natto-serra.
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,384
Location
Austria
The use of aspirin to prevent heart attack is wide spread due to blood thinning effect but unlike vitamin E, it's benefits stop there...

Take most natural blood thinner in high doses. However, whenever I tried 1 additional baby aspirin, the next stuhl always is mixed with blood. Of course, all the naturals are confounding, but on them alone no bad side-effects.
 

Gondwanaland

Senior Member
Messages
5,092
Be aware of a glitch in labeling 'mixed tocopherol' products. If the separate γ-, δ- and β-tocopherol content isn't specified, it probably is mainly regular alpha-tocopherol with a few miligram of the other tocopherols drown in the mix for being able to market an inexpensive 'mixed tocopherol' product.

Personally used this poduct, with 300 mg of Gamma-Tocopherols.
How about tocotrienols?
300mg of Gamma-tocopherols (PER 1 SERVING = 2 caps) is exactly what the Gamma E by NOW used to have as per the label I posted.
Tested my serum vitamin K1 one time, came back at 9.9 µg/l (0.22 - 2.28 normal range). At that time on about 2 mg of K1, 360 mg alpha-tocopherol, 350 mg other tocopherols and 110 mg tocotrienols per day.
What do these results say about K2?
The use of aspirin to prevent heart attack is wide spread due to blood thinning effect but unlike vitamin E, it's benefits stop there.
As a salicylate intolerant perrson I consider Pycnogenol as an expensive aspirin.
 
Last edited:

prioris

Senior Member
Messages
622
Pycnogenol has a lot of studies behind it. I consider grape seed extract a cheaper alternative. They seem like the same thing. Did you compare these two.

K2 does not have any anticoagulant related function. The problem with many supplements and tests is that they can't seem to measure the tissue concentration from a practical point.

The Now brand I looked at said Gamma E was 200 mg.
 

Gondwanaland

Senior Member
Messages
5,092
Pycnogenol has a lot of studies behind it. I consider grape seed extract a cheaper alternative. They seem like the same thing. Did you compare these two.
I know Pycnogenol is a potent anti-inflammatory and it makes me sad that I don't tolerate it. Grape seed feels even worse- seeds usually contain cyanide and I have something wrong in my kidneys that I don't tolerate cyanide at all (cyanocobalamin makes my right kidney really hurt).
K2 does not have any anticoagulant related function.
I know, I meant that vit E hinders k1-k2 conversion in the body, doesn't it?
 

pamojja

Senior Member
Messages
2,384
Location
Austria
I know, I meant that vit E hinders k1-k2 conversion in the body, doesn't it?

According to textbooks high dose vitamin E allegedly could hinder the absorption of vitamin K1, and add to the anticoagulation effect, for example of warfarin. That doesn't mean it would hinder the conversion to K2, nor did even that antagonism show in my blood test results at all.

It's a bid like with high dose vitamin E ability to hinder the absorption of gamma-tocopherol, and studies showing that vitamin E supplemented alone does deplete serum gamma-tocopherol levels. As soon as one supplements both - like vitamin E and K1 and gammas - one can't assume these antagonisms would occur.

How about tocotrienols?

Till now mostly used these. But wow, they just increased its price by 1/3!

What do these results say about K2?

Exactly nothing. There isn't any test available testing K2. However, there would be an approximation for K2 status by testing undercarboxylated Osteocalcin not available where I live. The lower would be the better (<1.5 normal range).

I know Pycnogenol is a potent anti-inflammatory and it makes me sad that I don't tolerate it.

Have you tried different generic pine bark extracts too? For example purebulk.com carries one without additives, if I remember it right.
 
Last edited:

Gondwanaland

Senior Member
Messages
5,092
Have you tried different generic pine bark extracts too? For example purebulk.com carries one without additives, if I remember it right.
It is not the additives since I get it from the local compounding pharmacy with excipients picked by myself (and it IS the original Pycnogenol ®). I do not tolerate salicylates and pine bark, just like willow bark (aspirin source) are very high in these anti-inflammatory chemicals.