NYT Article -- Levy Study

[slayadragon]

This article in the NYT includes the section below.

Would anyone want to give a stab at guessing what kinds of toxins he's positing that the body pours out to stop the hypothesized infectious agent?

Thanks much for your help.

Best, Lisa

*


Dr. Jay Levy, a professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco, and the senior author of one of the new studies, said he nonetheless believed that many or most people with chronic fatigue syndrome are suffering from a disease initiated by one or more viruses.

Many of the diseases symptoms are likely caused by the immune systems response to an infection, rather than to the pathogens themselves, he said.

The immune system pours out its toxins to stop this agent, and then the immune system doesnt calm down, he said, adding that environmental toxins could also play a role in the illness.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/01/health/research/01fatigue.html?_r=3

 

[Hope123]

When I read it, I thought he meant cytokines and interleukins and other factors the immune system activates to counter foreign invaders to the human body. It's similar to what Komaroff talked about during his NIH talks -- e.g. it's not the bug that's causing us the main issue (although it is the final cause) but rather our immune systems' overreaction to it. Good in the short-term, not so good long-term.

Similar to why young otherwise healthy folks had a high death rate during the 1918 flu pandemic; their bodies has a stronger immune system so their systems overreacted and killed them.

 

[justinreilly]

I thought this was a good, accurate article. Wrote Tuller a short thank you note.

Hope, I agree.

 

[dannybex]

I liked it too, mainly because it was one of the rare mentions that environmental poisons/toxins can and do play a role in this illness. Perhaps it's the overload (in some cases) of chemical, heavy metal or toxic mold exposures -- or all three -- that cause the immune system to become dysfunctional?

???

 

[slayadragon]

Interesting that he refers to these things as "toxins," and then immediately mentioned environmental toxins as problematic.

It makes it sound like he thinks those things work together. I think that they do too, but I wish I knew how he is looking at it.

Interesting that David Tuller included that. He has a really good feel for what the hot buttons of the illness are. Sort of amazing.

I wish that Levy had used the WPI's assays, so that we would know one way or another more for sure about the retrovirus. But it doesn't sound like he's not taking the illness seriously or necessarily on the wrong track either.

 

[WillowJ]

Tuller did a good job, as always.

One thing that wasn't mentioned (not Tuller's fault) that I heard at the SoK conference is that one of the kinds of inflammation they find in the brains of PWME indicates ongoing infection. One kind of inflammation can be produced by "kindling," or the immune system continuing to be upset after the infectious insult is gone, but the other kind cannot; it requires ongoing/reactivated infection.

 

[slayadragon]

Willow, do you recall what the two different kinds of inflammation are?

Thanks for your help.

 

[WillowJ]

I'm sorry, I don't... I only heard an NIH lady (I came on too late to hear her identified)--who sounded very excited, which was encouraging to me--giving a summary of one of the sessions and she discussed this briefly, how one of the talks had mentioned kindling and she was interested in that. And the other talk mentioned a different kind of inflammation (but I don't remember what words she used to describe it exactly) which could only be caused by ongoing inflammation, and she was maybe even more interested in that (so was I!)