Hi
alex3619Do you know offhand if there is actual evidence that the flu vaccines are effective, that is, do they reduce deaths or sick days?
Hi jimells, I have not seen the actual studies. However in my immunology lectures (around 2001) such studies were cited. One claim was that the single cheapest way to save lives was the flu vaccine. Dollar for dollar its has a huge impact on public health. I think this is probably right, but ignores several issues. First is that when you do such studies, it has to be considered that each vaccine formulation is different. Some are probably more effective, some less. Second, while there is general benefit in the population, is this true for every population subgroup?
As for sickdays, I am not aware of evidence the flu vaccine will reduce days off work, but I think it probably does. Just because I am not aware of it does not mean such evidence does not exist either.
The case in point, of course, is whether it is good for those with CFS or ME. For most people, most of the time, I think a flu vaccine is a great idea. For all people, all of the time ... no. We need more research to screen out those who are likely to have adverse effects. This is being largely ignored, and manufacturers sometimes have special legislative protection to reduce legal liability. I think this can only be justified if such protection goes hand in hand with research funds to identify and solve vaccine related problems. Otherwise its very morally questionable to protect an industry that can do so much harm. Its the old moral debate: is it justified to allow harm to a few to protect the many? I think it is, but only if you do everything reasonable to mitigate harm to the few. If you ignore that harm, the moral justification disappears.
The argument that the tiny amount of flu protein etc. in a vaccine is less dangerous than the flu itself is correct. Its also only part of the story. The issue with vaccines is adjuvants. These are immune boosting chemicals in the vaccine. They stimulate the immune system. My suspicion is that there are subgroups in the population for whom this is a very bad idea.
Those who are harmed are very vocal and often very angry. This fuels the anti-vaccine debate. My current position on this is that they are sending the wrong message. Its not that vaccines are good, or vaccines are bad. Its that
some vaccines and uses of vaccines are bad, and both victims and future victims are being ignored. They should be demanding recognition of the issues, screening tests, identification of biomarkers, treatments .. a whole research program. That would have a much stronger moral position. A similar argument can be applied to ME and CFS research, including CBT/GET.
We now have the technology for adjuvant-free vaccines. I do not know how the clinical trials and other research on this is going however. If such vaccines are both safe and effective in clinical trials, then the use of adjuvants can be abandoned, and so potentially greatly reduce side effects.
Bye, Alex
PS A second issues with vaccines is live vaccines. In some the attenuated virus might lead to a real infection. Its only a small percentage, but to those affected it is not a minor issue.
