High Dosage methylfolate users

[Johnmac]

@Johnmac I always have some residue left. Maybe the alcohol is making it dry out faster. Do you use butter or coconut oil? You might try that. Ghee would be fine. Or just the lotion. I've used a very solid mixture of cocoa butter, I've also used more liquidy lotion, coconut oil alone. All of them have absorbed. It's just been a matter of finding which is most convenient and least messy. Coconut oil plain irritated my skin.

Thanks @ahmo. I'll have a look for some of the above - sure to find at least some.

Currently it seems to take about 6 hours for all the pink to disappear. The paste dries out & needs to be re-wetted after about 3 hours. A bit of a nuisance & a good argument for the oils. The Australian oil guy that @garyfritz communicates with (Dr Greg) says he might make up some m-folate oils for me to try. He isn't entirely sure that m-folate will work TD; however I think it might, as I got a big lift from it almost immediately - perhaps 95% functioning.

Yesterday 80%, & today down to 65%. So it's slipping. Maybe Greg is right, & I was just getting a B12 hit? Time will tell. I'll up the dose tomorrow & see what happens.

Greg, who presumably hasn't read Freddd's writing, says that you need a fair bit of B2 (which makes FAD) to make the m-folate work - especially if you're in a non-dairy country as I am, or don't eat dairy. Naturally this goes against what Fred says about keeping Bs 1, 2 & 3 low.

NB: I also am reasonably sure I have a copper deficiency, as I have developed many of the listed symptoms, & have been taking tons of zinc for months, for pyroluria. Now taking little zinc, & taking copper daily.

 

[heyitisjustin]

If interested send me a message and we can discuss details of how we did payment / shipping etc.

Thanks!

I might be interested. I assume this will be a powder, right? How would one take it?
If I'd need to put it in capsules myself I'll probably wait to the second round.

 

[ahmo]

Greg, who presumably hasn't read Freddd's writing, says that you need a fair bit of B2 (which makes FAD) to make the m-folate work - especially if you're in a non-dairy country as I am, or don't eat dairy. Naturally this goes against what Fred says about keeping Bs 1, 2 & 3 low.

I found that adding activated B2 was very useful. There's 25mg in my B comp, and I added 18mg from FMN. When I started taking this FMN also transdermally, I've been able to decrease dose by half.

 

[Johnmac]

Thanks - I guess I'd better give it a shot.

The TD folate/B12 has been an improvement, but according to Greg I am probably B2-deficient (no dairy for 20 years), & rectifying that will improve the protocol's effectiveness further. No idea, but worth a try. He says 2-4 times the RDA for a while.

 

[heyitisjustin]

I found that adding activated B2 was very useful. There's 25mg in my B comp, and I added 18mg from FMN. When I started taking this FMN also transdermally, I've been able to decrease dose by half.

How do you take FMN transdermally? What dosage/time do you take it?
I have homozygous MAO-A so I'd assume FMN'd be helpful, but it doesn't seem to be doing much. I'm wondering if I am not taking enough to make a difference or if I take it too early in the day.

 

[ahmo]

@heyitisjustin I'm using 1/2 FMN tablet (Source Naturals, 18.5mg) per day. I use 1/4 tab early AM and midday. I'm crushing it onto a piece of cloth, adding a blob of body lotion, then wrapping it onto my forearm or calf.

 

[aquariusgirl]

Is l carnitine tartrate useless??
Yes many of us Are particularly deficient inB2
You have to be careful combining potassium and zinc one doctor told me .. It's late and I'm too tired to Google it but if you're taking both of those things maybe you should ?!

 

[ahmo]

Is l carnitine tartrate useless??

It was for me. Along w/ ALCAR. LCF was noticeable within minutes. Later, I used ALCAR from time to time as antioxidant.

 

[zzz0r]

I have not been around for a long time. However I have been collecting knowledge from other sources. So regarding the recent posts:

IF you take methylfolate regardless of the dosage and you experience problems falling asleep or staying asleep then your adrenals are exhausted for whatever reason. There are many reasons that can lead to adrenal exhaustion and you need to look deeper into that and stop ushing methylfolate and spinning the methylation cycle.

In order for methylation to work and detox to occur you need to have healthy adrenal function. Otherwise you will crash.

@Freddd mentioned leg cramps. Leg cramps are not only related to potassium but to low magnesium as well. Generally for anyone reading this you should know that magnesium is a potassium regulator. IF you are low in magnesium you will never be able to retain healthy potassium levels in your body. Thats a fact!.

For people that are supplementing with potassium and magnesium and it never seems to be enough, you must have in mind that I was receving orally magnesium for more than 3 years in order to be able to stop it for a a few days.

It is not the same for ever person ofcourse. Also there are certain reasons why your body is wasting magnesium or can not store adaquate quantites of magnesium. Inflammation could be a factor and cell membrain fluidity could be another factor. Also for some people magnesium dosage of 200mg daily is just a maintanace dosage. In order to resotre magnesium to a chronically depleted body you may need to go higher.

 

[skwag]

@AlmostEasy and I are putting together another group buy. This time it is for pure methylcobalamin powder. Please see this thread for more information.

Just to follow up, the last group buy we took part in appears to have been a success. The methylfolate definitely produces a noticeable reaction. I've only had it for less than a week, so longer term testing still needs to be done, but so far so good.

 

[Athene*]

I found hydrocortisone pretty good. Taking 20mg or less means you can't compromise your adrenal performance long term, according to the guy who wrote the book on this.

Liquorice helped, but then sent me over the top with too much cortisol (lots of anxiety). I think it causes you to hang onto it more.

But to answer your question, the @Freddd Protocol has had a better & quicker effect on my adrenals than anything. I have dropped my hydrocortisone doses down to near-nothing, from 20mg/day.

Hi @Johnmac, Hope I'm posting correctly here. I'm a newbie on this site. Can I ask how long it took you to lower your 20mg Hydrocortisone dose on @Freddd Protocol? I'm on 20mg Hydrocortisone daily and would love to get off it some day. Am on Freddd protocol too. So far 23mg mfolate; 8mg Dibenscozide; mB12 (3x5mg sublinguals and 1x3mg subcutaneous injection) daily. Feeling a lot better after only two weeks but have a long way to go (mostly bed/couch ridden last 15 years). Stayed too long on low dose mfolate, but glad I went for high dose just recently. How much of all this did you need before your adrenals healed? Any thoughts appreciated

 

[Johnmac]

Hi @Johnmac, Hope I'm posting correctly here. I'm a newbie on this site. Can I ask how long it took you to lower your 20mg Hydrocortisone dose on @Freddd Protocol? I'm on 20mg Hydrocortisone daily and would love to get off it some day. Am on Freddd protocol too. So far 23mg mfolate; 8mg Dibenscozide; mB12 (3x5mg sublinguals and 1x3mg subcutaneous injection) daily. Feeling a lot better after only two weeks but have a long way to go (mostly bed/couch ridden last 15 years). Stayed too long on low dose mfolate, but glad I went for high dose just recently. How much of all this did you need before your adrenals healed? Any thoughts appreciated

Hi Athene,

I'd halved it to 10mg in 3 months, then went off it altogether after 4.5 months.

I also try to think out of the FP box as much as I can, so energy has also been much helped by diagnosing & treating D3, copper & recently iron deficiencies.

Something(s) caused the chronic fatigue, so I reasoned that fixing those things could un-cause it. Which seems to have proven correct.

 

[Athene*]

Hi Athene,

I'd halved it to 10mg in 3 months, then went off it altogether after 4.5 months.

I also try to think out of the FP box as much as I can, so energy has also been much helped by diagnosing & treating D3, copper & recently iron deficiencies.

Something(s) caused the chronic fatigue, so I reasoned that fixing those things could un-cause it. Which seems to have proven correct.

Thanks for that @Johnmac. That's great for you, and gives me hope. Will keep an eye on those other levels too. Can I ask how long you were on hydrocortisone for before you started the FP? I've been on it eighteen months now (diagnosed with 'some sort of adrenal insufficiency' by a kindly endocrinologist (though he was puzzled at inconsistent results and at how adrenals are still producing at times.) He agreed to treat so I could get out of bed at least part of the day! (It's not Addisons, he says). The HC is so hard on stomach...would be so happy to dump it!

 

[Freddd]

Hi @Johnmac, Hope I'm posting correctly here. I'm a newbie on this site. Can I ask how long it took you to lower your 20mg Hydrocortisone dose on @Freddd Protocol? I'm on 20mg Hydrocortisone daily and would love to get off it some day. Am on Freddd protocol too. So far 23mg mfolate; 8mg Dibenscozide; mB12 (3x5mg sublinguals and 1x3mg subcutaneous injection) daily. Feeling a lot better after only two weeks but have a long way to go (mostly bed/couch ridden last 15 years). Stayed too long on low dose mfolate, but glad I went for high dose just recently. How much of all this did you need before your adrenals healed? Any thoughts appreciated

@Athene*

Going way back to Adelle Davis who I have found quite good on the whole, she would suggest pantethine as an additional supplement (pantethenic acid back when she was writing in the 50s and 60s.). It's not anything that makes a difference for me but I have heard high praise from some who do need it. I've tried it several times, because there may be times I need it and don't know how to recognize it. She also would have advised a lot of liver with a high protein diet. That is something that is easy to slip by the wayside when you don't feel like eating because of feeling lousy. A type of anorexia is caused by B12 deficiencies. In me it was frequent if not constant nausea and zero appetite.

 

[Johnmac]

Thanks for that @Johnmac. That's great for you, and gives me hope. Will keep an eye on those other levels too. Can I ask how long you were on hydrocortisone for before you started the FP? I've been on it eighteen months now (diagnosed with 'some sort of adrenal insufficiency' by a kindly endocrinologist (though he was puzzled at inconsistent results and at how adrenals are still producing at times.) He agreed to treat so I could get out of bed at least part of the day! (It's not Addisons, he says). The HC is so hard on stomach...would be so happy to dump it!

I was on HC for maybe 3 years. Never had any side effects from it: indeed I think fondly of it, as it allowed me to function.

 

[Athene*]

That's good to know, Johnmac. I've been dealing with low cortisol for about 15 yrs before using HC. Yes, I must try Pantetheine, thanks. I find HC good too - I can get out of bed for a while with it, though I seem to get very high cortisol every night (still awake here at 3.40am). I had a great couple of weeks since beginning @Freddd protocol, but now unfortunately I've had a huge hormone surge and ovulation (which is occasional and always crashes my adrenals) and I'm barely functional today. Does the protocol help all the hormone chaos eventually? I guess we don't methylate hormones properly?(both men & women). I worry it might be too late having had endocrine glands with stuttering output then finally crashing 15 yrs ago, though I read about Freddd getting his testosterone back etc after years, so never say die!..

 

[Freddd]

That's good to know, Johnmac. I've been dealing with low cortisol for about 15 yrs before using HC. Yes, I must try Pantetheine, thanks. I find HC good too - I can get out of bed for a while with it, though I seem to get very high cortisol every night (still awake here at 3.40am). I had a great couple of weeks since beginning @Freddd protocol, but now unfortunately I've had a huge hormone surge and ovulation (which is occasional and always crashes my adrenals) and I'm barely functional today. Does the protocol help all the hormone chaos eventually? I guess we don't methylate hormones properly?(both men & women). I worry it might be too late having had endocrine glands with stuttering output then finally crashing 15 yrs ago, though I read about Freddd getting his testosterone back etc after years, so never say die!..

@Athene*,

The methylation and ATP nutrients when lacking can wreak havoc on our hormones. My doctor and I monitor my hormones carefully because too much can cause too much red blood cells and cause clots and heart attacks and such. I had to drop P5P to bring my hematacrit down to normal when my testosterone went up. Then we had to down titrate my dose. Unstable is no fun.

 

[Athene*]

@Athene*,

The methylation and ATP nutrients when lacking can wreak havoc on our hormones. My doctor and I monitor my hormones carefully because too much can cause too much red blood cells and cause clots and heart attacks and such. I had to drop P5P to bring my hematacrit down to normal when my testosterone went up. Then we had to down titrate my dose. Unstable is no fun.

Glad you sorted that out, @Freddd. Just realised it was you here not @Johnmac - still learning the format of these threads...I did much better today after reading some of your posts again, so thank you!!. Am now on more mb!2 in relation to folate and I've gone to weekly AdCobl instead of daily. Also took small dose LCF (100mg). Took my first 50mg AdCobl once weekly dose today. If you have time, can you tell me if it's only CNS penetrative dose if taken in one lot of 50mg (over four hours), or is it CNS penetrating if taken daily too (8.5mg daily)?

 

[Athene*]

@Johnmac or @Freddd - I've come back to this thread because I can't get a response when i post a question. Can you tell me why my RBC (red blood cell count) and haematocrit and iron has got lower than last November tests, since starting the methylation protocol four weeks ago? My doctor says low RBC is usually because a person has not enough b12 to make red blood cells, but I'm on 40mg b12 and 20mg Folate the last four weeks, and have been on lower doses mb12 and mFolate for a year before the protocol. Iron seems low (transferrin saturation rate), but I don't know for sure how to interpret these tests. Please could somebody take a look? I have had awful neuropathy in feet and lower legs the last few days and am on Potassium 3000mcgs daily which was helping but not anymore. MCV has come down from 99. Is that good?

WBC: 8.2 (4.0-11.0)

neutrophils: 3.8 (2.0-7.5)

lymphocytes: 3.1 (1.5-3.5)

monocytes: 0.8 (0.2-0.8)

eosinophils: 0.4 (0.0-0.4)

basophils: 0.1 (0.0-0.1)

RBC: 3.76 (4.00-5.20)

haemoglobin: 12.0 g/dL (11.5-16.4)

haematocrit: 0.355 (Ratio 0.370-0.460)

MCV: 94.4 fL (83.0-98.0)

MCH: 31.9 pg (26.7-32.5)

MCHC: 33.8 g/dL (30.8-34.6)

Red Cell Distribution Width [RDW]: 12.4 (11.0-15.0)

platelets: 296 (140-450)

Iron Studies Biochem:

sample type: Blood

iron: 16 umol/L (10-30)

UIBC : 43 umol/L (20-66)

Calculated TIBC: 59 umol/L (50-80)

Transferrin Sat (Transferrin Saturation Rate): 27% (30-40)

 

[Athene*]

Could above be anything to do with copper? (I take low zinc 11mg daily because zinc tends to lower my cortisol). I don't take copper. I'm stabbing in the dark here. Worried I am doing something wrong now...
@ahmo - could I trouble you to take a look at my blood tests if you're around?