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Gut Tests

Discussion in 'The Gut: De Meirleir & Maes; H2S; Leaky Gut' started by paul80, Jun 6, 2016.

  1. paul80

    paul80 Senior Member

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    I wanted to get a gut test for stomach pain, i had one a few years ago from metametrix and it was good. It found i had a parasite and treating that helped me a lot.
    The metametrix test isn't available now, and the other one in the uk i found (genova i think) you cant use without some id number from a practitioner.

    So where is the best place to tested now that doesn't require a referral? I want one that tests for candida, parasites, stomach ulcer and anything else that could cause pain.
     
  2. Mij

    Mij Senior Member

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    Ask you GP to test you for h.pylori. You could rule that one out first.

    I had a CDSA test done years ago, it showed an imbalance in gut flora that might have been caused by a parasite or bacteria but didn't identify what exactly it was.
     
  3. tinacarroll27

    tinacarroll27 Senior Member

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  4. paul80

    paul80 Senior Member

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    Yes, i'm going to do that first, but i don't have much faith in gp tests so i want to get prepared to order something to get it quickly.
    Didn't know about that one, thanks. Has anyone else used this one? it doesn't have very much info.
     
  5. tinacarroll27

    tinacarroll27 Senior Member

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    I have used blue Horizon before but I have never had the stool test. I also found this about getting tests with out a doctor:
    http://www.healthrising.org/forums/resources/order-your-own-lab-tests-online.164/

    and Directlabs do international shipping and according to the article on healthrising you don't need a doctor for their tests and you can get the genova stool test through them I think. You may have to check that out I am not sure

    https://www.directlabs.com/Default.aspx?&catid=84&language=en-US&tabid=55
     
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  6. paul80

    paul80 Senior Member

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    That's great, thanks Tina.
     
  7. kangaSue

    kangaSue Senior Member

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    What are the pain symptoms you are having, is it made worse or better by food, any other GI symptoms with it such as no appetite, easily filled, nausea etc. There's a wide scope here of things that can cause gut pain.
     
  8. paul80

    paul80 Senior Member

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    I get different pain in different parts of my stomach. Sometimes it's a burning pain, sometimes milder. It's usually at the top of the stomach in the middle just below the ribs.( is that the oesophagus?), but sometimes in the left part of the stomach also.

    I get nausea with it most of the time. Eating can make it worse sometimes, eating or exertion can trigger it. I have a good appetite but do get easily filled up.
     
  9. paul80

    paul80 Senior Member

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    I read people on other threads talking about uBiome and American Gut Project. Do these people do the same tests as blue horizon and direct labs and do you need a doctor for them?
     
  10. kangaSue

    kangaSue Senior Member

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    I get pain in the same spot, top of the stomach in the middle just below the ribs which is the celiac (or solar) plexus where a complex network of abdominal nerves branch from the abdominal aorta. I have complicated chronic GI dysfunction going on including Gastroparesis and Chronic Mesenteric Ischemia (CMI) and putting pressure in that area causes me serious discomfort. I get pain at this point from intestinal ischemia, the blood flow to the bowel is insufficient for the increased demand of the digestive process.

    I don't have ME/CFS but with preserving skeletal muscle being a higher order function in human physiology, I wouldn't be surprised to learn that exertion causing intestinal ischemia is more prevalent than is thought in ME/CFS with many having a reduced blood volume.

    That said, there are a number of things that have early satiety, mild nausea and worsening of symptoms with eating as a symptom set, it can be early signs of gastroparesis but things like SIBO and IBS will do it too.
     
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  11. alicec

    alicec Senior Member

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    These are very different tests from the standard CDSA that you are referring to.

    uBiome, American Gut (both US based) and RedLabs in Belgium sequence the DNA of all your gut bacteria (uBiome seem to be including Archaea and Eukaryota also though I'm not sure how extensive the latter is). In other words they give a comprehensive picture of all the bacteria in your gut, not just the few that can be cultured.

    uBiome and American gut are crowd-funded initiatives and you can order them directly from the website. You receive the results. There is information on the websites, including plenty of comparison to results from the community being tested, but no interpretation.

    RedLabs requires a doctor's name on the order form and results are sent to the doctor. They are a research-based lab and don't interpret the results. They say you should discuss them with your doctor. However I doubt that many doctors would have any clue. KDM uses this test and works closely with the lab. He does have a clue about what results mean but he is definitely an exception.

    Traditional CDSA tests look at several things. This include different measures of digestive efficiency, short chain fatty acid production (these are produced by your gut bacteria and give an idea of the balance of the flora), some parasitology and culture of some bacterial and fungal species.

    The first part of the test can give some useful information (though it is a lot of money to pay for what you end up with), but in my opinion, the parasitology and culture results are usually not particularly valuable and may be downright misleading.

    The problem is that many fragile parasites are missed because the stool is not usually preserved. There are some tests that do include preservation (samples of stool are immediately placed into preservative) so you would need to check that you have this type of test. The parasites are then identified by observation. It has the potential to detect anything present but lacks sensitivity.

    A more sensitive type of parasitology test is PCR based, but this can detect only the species it is directed against. If you had something else, it would be missed.

    As for the bacterial and fungal culture, these are the bread and butter tests that have been around for years and have given us a completely distorted idea of what is in the gut. The problem is that they select for aerotolerant species and the vast majority of the gut constituents are anaerobes. Almost all of the flora is missed by such tests.

    The DNA based tests will give you the compete picture of what is really in your gut. However they are essentially research-based. You need to work hard at understanding what the results mean. It's a bit like doing a 23andme test.
     
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  12. paul80

    paul80 Senior Member

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    Ok thanks for the info. This is pretty complicated, not really sure what to do. I think i'll just go through my GP first and see if they can find anything. If i can't get it sorted through the NHS would you recommend i get one of the tests?

    Someone told me you can viruses living in your gut too, do you think it could be that causing the pain. If so, I have some oregano oil which i think can kill the viruses.
     
  13. tinacarroll27

    tinacarroll27 Senior Member

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    I have just checked out the uBiome website.
    http://ubiome.com
    They look pretty good and I think I am going to try out one of their tests because I have gut problems as well. I have had Genova stool analysis through Dr Myhill. It did pick up the candida I was having trouble with and I was put onto Nystatin by her and I felt a lot better from taking that, so I think the Genova stool test has some merit but yes I agree that it does not pick up everything. You don't need a doctor to sign for uBiome either which is good. The only draw back is making sense of the result but It's a start and I am sure the information must be out there somewhere to interpret it. I would like to know if uBiome checks for viruses as well because I am convince my ME started with an enterovirus.
     
  14. paul80

    paul80 Senior Member

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    I forgot to mention, a lot of the time when i get pain beneath my ribs i get it in the same position in my back too. Anyone else had this?
     
  15. alicec

    alicec Senior Member

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    They don't.

    American Gut do a very expensive test where they sequence the entire microbiome - ie bacteria, archaea, eukaryotes, viruses.
     
  16. alicec

    alicec Senior Member

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    Unfortunately it is. There is no single ideal gut test. It may be necessary to get several.
     
  17. Hilary

    Hilary Senior Member

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    @paul80 There is an equivalent of the American Gut Project namely the British Gut Project - you may already know this.
    H
     
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  18. kangaSue

    kangaSue Senior Member

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    @paul80 Here's a recent thread on Enterovirus, some recent small studies have found a high proportion of those with ME/CFS and/or Gastroparesis to have Enterovirus infection.
     
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  19. Art Vandelay

    Art Vandelay Senior Member

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  20. paul80

    paul80 Senior Member

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    My gut is not too bad just now after trying to eat more often smaller portions, so i'm focussing on other symptoms just now. But thanks for the info.
     

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