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Extreme anxiety? from methyl B12

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by QuantumMechanics, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. QuantumMechanics

    QuantumMechanics

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    Few months ago, I woke up feeling like I was drugged. I was extremely dissociated, felt like I was on the verge of passing out, rapid heart rate, rapid reflexes, facial numbness, extremely agitated, numb tongue, facial burning, head pressure, panic attacks, paranoid, waking up with my head feeling weird (like water was cold water was being poured down my head to my neck, like my brain was empty/numb, heard to read/focus). I was taking 2-3x/day 1000mcg methyl b12 for 5-6 days before this. Before this I had very little anxiety if any, I had some social anxiety.

    I couldn't take it anymore so I went to the ER, the doctor thought it was just a B12 defiency causing this so he injected me with B12. Felt the same the first day, couldn't sleep at all the 2nd, so I went back to the ER. I had the same doctor he injected me with another b12 shot and tried to have me mentally evaluated. I was losing my mind for about a week and then it somewhat calmed down. Few weeks went by I was OK, but by no means back to normal. Facial burning/agitation/weird head sensations came back, so I went in for another b12 shot. All symptoms were really bad + head pressure for a week and then I was normalish for a bit. I started having the agitation again, so I went in for another shot. I've gotten evaluated by a psychiatrist, he seems to think I don't have any anxiety issues. This time It didn't really help much with the agitation. Less than 2 weeks later I had this weird episode - like I was going into shock or something. You know that feeling when someone jumps out and scares you? That x 100, my body got really jittery/vibrating, it got really quiet and then my ears started ringing, lost my senses, my head felt really weird, felt jolted, and my legs were really weak. I was about to call an ambulance. It slightly happened the day before too. I'm not sure if it was just a panic attack or something like a partial seizure. It was the worse feeling I've ever had. I've been really panicky the last couple of days, feeling like i'm gonna pass out, heart sinking feeling/chest tightness, and my neck is really stiff. I can't seem to calm the feeling down. What do you guys think I should do? I have access to a few benzos, should I take one of those?
     
  2. Judee

    Judee Senior Member

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    Just my opinion but I don't think you should take the benzos.

    Here is a >>link<< by Dr Ben Lynch that seems to relate to your situation a bit. If you have any niacin, I would try a pinch (just a pinch) to see if it levels things out a bit. It's hard to learn but as pwME/CFS we have to be oh so careful about overdoing a supplement. The pendulum can swing back the other way very quickly with us.

    Others here might have better wisdom to offer on your situation and perhaps a functional medicine doctor or one trained in methylation issues might be even more help.

    Dr. Lynch has a doctor look up here.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2018
    Mary and Learner1 like this.
  3. LINE

    LINE

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    There are a number of constituents in the B family, obviously B12 is one of those. B vitamins are generally considered synergistic meaning they compliment one another. If one becomes dominant, then others can be subordinate. What I mean by the last statement, I seldom take a large amount of single vitamin, mineral or amino acid without considering the remaining ones.

    B vitamins work largely as co-factors, meaning they participate in cell functions and each will work in different areas of the cell or different cells. B12 is a stimulating b vitamin while others serve as a calming (Judee mentions niacin, B2 etc).
     
  4. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    For a while, B12 (tablets) would induce strong suicidal moods in me. I can certainly believe that it can cause other neurological effects. I should also point out that niacin also induces strong suicidal moods in me, so be careful there. I nearly gave into those moods before I realized that they were artificially induced.

    Others here can offer better advice on cofactors, methylation, and other B12 issues. My simple guess is that you weren't suffering from B12 deficiency (that's not the cause of ME fatigue) and need to avoid large doses. Maybe go off it for a while and try again (carefully, and with appropriate cofactors) and see if the same problems occur.
     
    LINE likes this.
  5. QuantumMechanics

    QuantumMechanics

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    @Judee @LINE @Wishful

    I had an episode lastnight where I woke up and I started getting this intense niacin flush down my head, neck, to my chest. It was a cold, intense burning. My face still burns now. I had to take a benzo to go to sleep.

    I was reading about withdrawals on benzos and the burning face is a side effect? Do you think the b12 somehow messed with GABA receptors, glutamate, or glutathione?
     
  6. prioris

    prioris Senior Member

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    methylated b12 and methylated folate causes jittery nervousness anxiety etc in many people who become over methylated (MTHFR)... lithium orotate (5mg to 10 mg per day) may help you. Yasko gives that to many of her patients. Many people are deficient in lithium which is important brain nutrient.

    Taurine and threonate magnesium also help with the NMDA hence will help the GABA, glutamate etc,
     
    Mary likes this.
  7. Judee

    Judee Senior Member

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    I'm sorry you're going through all that.

    I do think it might be helpful to consult with a doctor familiar with the pathways and how the body processes those things especially the neurotransmitters as I think it can be very easy to mess things up pretty quickly.

    Hope you can get some answers.

    Edit: Have you been trying to wean yourself off of the benzos? I would definitely work with the prescribing doctor on that and avoid trying any thing else before you do.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2018
  8. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    All I know about benzos is that Benadryl makes me groggy (very unpleasant feeling), but not at all sleepy. I tried it both for ME relief and insomnia, and it worked for neither, so the remainder is sitting in a box somewhere...
     
  9. QuantumMechanics

    QuantumMechanics

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    I just started on them because the anxiety/panic attacks were too extreme.
     
  10. QuantumMechanics

    QuantumMechanics

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    @Freddd Can you offer any insight?
     
  11. QuantumMechanics

    QuantumMechanics

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    Got some bloodwork done:

    Ferritin was slightly high
    Iron was normal
    Folate was fine
    Homocysteine in the upper range 14 (5-15)
    Potassium 4.1 (3.6-5.0)
    Cortisol slightly high
    Differential WBC's came back abnormal with low eosinphils 0.2 (0.0-6.0) and low basophils 0.3 (0-1.0)
    MPV came back high 11.5 (7.4-10.4)
    B12 came back as 230, (lower than when I had it checked after experiencing these symptoms). I've had 5 b12 cyano injections since then. After one my b12 was 400ish. Not sure if I should up the injections or what, I'm scared to at this point.
     
  12. Mary

    Mary Moderator

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    Did you take niacin last night? I've been taking niacin at night for several years for sleep. I rarely get the flush any more, but when I do, it can last for close to an hour; however, afterwards I usually fall asleep pretty easily, so I wait it out. I actually started to look forward to the flush because it usually meant I would fall asleep afterwards.

    I took a benzo - lorazepam - for 10 years in the middle of the night for sleep and tapered off over many months a few years ago. I never had a burning face as a side effect of withdrawal. What I did have was much more trouble sleeping.

    From your first post above, it sounds like you've just started taking benzos - is that right? If you've just started, then I don't think you would have much in the way of withdrawal symptoms. And I don't recommend taking them. They've been linked to Alzheimer's and there are safer ways of getting to sleep.

    Your anxiety symptoms might be from overmethylation from the B12. But it sounds like several times you had a B12 shot when you had those symptoms, which would just make it worse.

    Did you ever try taking niacin - in a small dose to start - to see if it would help calm you down? It's unclear if you ever tried it. If you do try it, start low and go slow.

    I have not heard of B12 messing with GABA receptors, glutamate and glutathione. And I'm very sensitive to glutamate and MSG, etc. But B12 can cause overmethylation - for symptoms see https://www.jillcarnahan.com/2018/06/25/is-overmethylation-the-cause-of-your-anxiety/
    and look at the links @Judee provided above.
     
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  13. QuantumMechanics

    QuantumMechanics

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    No, I just woke up and it happened. I assume it was a panic attack, but I'm not 100% sure. I was freaking out. I took a benzo after to calm me down.

    I definitely don't have withdrawals. I was just relating the symptoms.

    I tried Niacin awhile ago 1-2 times. I had a very intense flush from just having 25mg. My arms started swelling up and it just made me more panicky.

    Its been over 3 months, is it even possible to be overmethylated for this long? My b12 is only at 230. I'm not sure if I should stop the injections or increase them to fix the problems.
     
  14. Mary

    Mary Moderator

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    Yeah, the flush can be very intense. You might try 1/4 or even less of what you took before. The flush is your capillaries dilating. It can be alarming, but I've never heard of it harming anyone, and if you are overmethylating, the niacin can help a lot.

    I don't know if you could be overmethylating for this long. However, it doesn't sound like you gave the niacin a fair shot, only taking it 2 times. And you did say that all these symptoms started when you started taking methyl B12, and then several times you got even more B12 in the form of injections, which seemed to only make it worse. So I wouldn't try throwing even more B12 at the problem until you sort it out.

    You may need more B12 but you may need more co-factors. It can get complex. Look at prioris' post above. Lithium orotate might help as well in calming you down.

    And look at Ben Lynch's site, linked by Judee.

    And best of all of course would be if you had a knowledgeable doctor you were working with, but unfortunately that's an impossibility for many of us.
     

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