Does Anyone Have Math-Only Brain Fog?

[Art Vandelay]

For similar reasons, I can no longer play scrabble. Pre-ME I was second in a championship, but now find not only can I not spell, but I cannot total the score. It is so humiliating, I no longer play.

If you decide that you might like to try a similar game, I recommend Words with Friends (you can play it on Facebook or get an app for your phone/tablet) as it does all the adding and spell-checking for you. I'm not terribly good at it and I struggle with it on my worst days but at least you can choose to play your turn when you feel up to it. https://www.zynga.com/games/words-friends

Brain fog is my worst symptom, perhaps because my former career and most of my interests involved some sort of thinking. It's so hard to give up the things that you love.

 

[2kidswithME]

When my son was at his worst (aged about 12) he found he struggled to add and subtract. He could still understand the concepts, but the computation was beyond him, and he'd ask me (the least mathematical person in the household!) to do simple calculations for him (I can't do anything complex anyway). This was the child whose tutor called him 'genius' at maths, even when he was ill. When he was finally in recovery mode, he taught himself to program in order to do Project Euler problems, which helped win him a place at Oxford to read computer science. He is among the lucky few to have recovered (as far as we can tell), and is now starting his final year there.

 

[ebethc]

When my son was at his worst (aged about 12) he found he struggled to add and subtract. He could still understand the concepts, but the computation was beyond him, and he'd ask me (the least mathematical person in the household!) to do simple calculations for him (I can't do anything complex anyway). This was the child whose tutor called him 'genius' at maths, even when he was ill. When he was finally in recovery mode, he taught himself to program in order to do Project Euler problems, which helped win him a place at Oxford to read computer science. He is among the lucky few to have recovered (as far as we can tell), and is now starting his final year there.

do you know what caused his brain fog? ie, did he have viruses? etc

 

[taniaaust1]

Ive seen this thread around for a while now but wasnt going to post in it but today Im so frustrated over my issues with doing maths and how it stops me from being able to do things that I thought I'd post.

My brain ME issues are not just maths but can involve anything at all, the simpliest thing i may suddenly get like a brain drop out with, I like alex's example of forgetting how to open a plastic bag, I once got stuck in a room as I forgot rooms had things placed into the walls - doors and was studying a ceiling trying to find a way out when I couldnt see openings in the walls.

I've had a few incidences like countrygirls where I go to pay for something and found I was unable to understand money and just couldnt count it to pay a shop person (fortunately a support worker was able to step in after seeing me try to count the money out and fail 3 times to help me get correct money),

another time I just handed a whole handful of money over to a shop person (which felt horrible as I didnt know if the person would keep too much, things like this make one feel very vulnerable) and had them hand back to me what was over the amount I was supposed to pay. I do not go go shopping nowdays without a support worker.

Today Im feeling very frustrated as I cant do the ME research study I want to join as Im unable to do maths even witht the online calculator, I must have the concept of how to add the numbers together to work out the figure I need wrong. You see see from my posts how confused I am at figuring at the maths http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...mptoms-experienced-by-pwme.47398/#post-775363 (and I have a high education too beyond highschool).

I have an elderly friend that when he's around he helps me with things like bank stuff cause I struggle so much so often with maths and working out accounts and that (and I seem to be delexic at times with numbers and struggle with numbers far more then I do with words).

 

[frog_in_the_fog]

Trouble doing math isn't the half of it, just trying to dial a phone number can be a real challenge at times.

 

[2kidswithME]

do you know what caused his brain fog? ie, did he have viruses? etc

When he fell ill for the long haul (age 11) he went down with a nasty virus from which he never recovered (it took 6 years before he was back to some semblance of normal). However, the blood tests showed he'd previously had glandular fever (some years earlier, it wasn't the immediate trigger). (Also previously, ages 9-10 he'd had chronic & severe headaches along with being intermittently unwell -- this was classic boom & bust, but we, and the paediatrician, missed it as we were so focused on resolving the headaches.) He was too poorly to be in school at all for about 3 years, and it was during this stage that he had trouble with computation. As I recall it was only on his worst days, otherwise he was okay with it, and was one of the things I noticed when trying to track where he was energy-wise for diary purposes.

It's odd things like that, that only someone very close to the child (or adult with ME) will notice -- no one else sees them after one lesson in school when they can scarcely string a sentence together (this happened to my daughter regularly), or unable to stand long enough to make a sandwich (we bought her a high stool so she could sit to do this). No one else sees these 'little' symptoms, they only see when they are well enough to manage a lesson in school or have an outing (with a wheelchair to ease the energy demands). It's part of what makes the illness so frustrating to deal with, and must fuel some of the disbelief that people can be that poorly and yet look 'fine'.

 

[Dufresne]

For me it's the other way round: sometimes expressing myself in writing is so frustrating I just have to give up, while I never have a problem with math, chess, sudoku, etc. I'm actually still better than average at the latter.

Also something I find really interesting is that I can focus for a couple hours playing chess but can't even read a single page of text without developing PEM.

 

[Undisclosed]

I have had math brain fog all my life because maths have always been difficult for me -- total idiot at maths. I have global fog affecting everything but I think difficulty retrieving words is where I have the most problems. Sometimes I really struggle finding simple words. It is really annoying.

 

[Undisclosed]

Trouble doing math isn't the half of it, just trying to dial a phone number can be a real challenge at times.

How many digits can you remember. Joe average is supposed to be able to remember seven digits, I think I average out at about two on a good day.

 

[ebethc]

It's odd things like that, that only someone very close to the child (or adult with ME) will notice -- no one else sees them after one lesson in school when they can scarcely string a sentence together (this happened to my daughter regularly), or unable to stand long enough to make a sandwich (we bought her a high stool so she could sit to do this). No one else sees these 'little' symptoms, they only see when they are well enough to manage a lesson in school or have an outing (with a wheelchair to ease the energy demands). It's part of what makes the illness so frustrating to deal with, and must fuel some of the disbelief that people can be that poorly and yet look 'fine'.

yes, I'm adopted and my adoptive mother has an extremely strong immune system... can't remember a single day that she was in bed all day! if she gets a cold/virus she can "push through" and still serve a holiday dinner to a dozen or so people, then everyone praises her for being strong... I simply can't "push through" as much as I try, and even the ppl closest to me can't understand... I met my biological mother and asked her what she does when she has bad symptoms, and she says, "I just go to bed.. what else could I do?" .. ha!

I was a decent student (not in math, even though I scored the same in math as other subjects on standardized tests...too hard to concentrate) and even played sports, loved lots of activities, but I had to push myself... I never felt full of energy after the age of 7 or 8... something shifted, and i had problems w joint pain, fatigue, brain fog and digestive problems

 

[ebethc]

(In case you don't know, working memory is the bit before short-term memory. It's basically when you're holding something in your head in order to work with it, without it going into short-term or long-term memory. So like holding the numbers of a sum in your head to work out the total, or adding up coins (adding two coins, holding the total, adding the next, etc)

yes, I always think "I need more RAM installed in my brain"

 

[Gondwanaland]

yes, I'm adopted and my adoptive mother has an extremely strong immune system... can't remember a single day that she was in bed all day! if she gets a cold/virus she can "push through" and still serve a holiday dinner to a dozen or so people, then everyone praises her for being strong... I simply can't "push through" as much as I try, and even the ppl closest to me can't understand...

My biological mother is like your adoptive mother, and I am more like my father's sisters who have Hashi's, very little energy even if not ill.

 

[ebethc]

My biological mother is like your adoptive mother, and I am more like my father's sisters who have Hashi's, very little energy even if not ill.

some ppl have amazing immune systems... My adoptive mother's family is full of marathoners... they just have amazing strength, stamina and pain tolerance.... My adoptive mother doesn't take any pain killers at the dentist..

 

[frog_in_the_fog]

yes, I always think "I need more RAM installed in my brain"

Sign me up for a cyberbrain implant, I think this would help a lot of us.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Sign me up for a cyberbrain implant, I think this would help a lot of us.

I'm holding out for a replacement cyborg body.

 

[cman89]

do you have sinus problems? If so, does it impact brain fog?

shoemaker has a theory that some ppl w CFS have persistent nasal infections that go undetected by traditional medical tests.... I can't afford the MARCONs test now, but it's an interesting idea... doing lots of sinus rinses, XLEAR, and i might add Ponaris
http://biotoxinjourney.com/marcons/

It has been suspected that I may have chronic sinus issues, but I think part of that may have just been a radiologist guessing. Past attempts to treat sinus issues have potentially helped though..

 

[ebethc]

Past attempts to treat sinus issues have potentially helped though..

how have you treated sinus issues?

also, what part of the brain processes math? do you know?

 

[cman89]

how have you treated sinus issues?

also, what part of the brain processes math? do you know?

Well, technically, multiple parts of the brain process math, but "working memory" is essential for doing quick calculations , and that can be affected by ME Brain Fog. As far as sinuses, I have just used neti pot rinses and nasonex. I was perscribed antibiotics for an old sinus infection once, but I am wary of overdoing that.

 

[PatJ]

@cman89 do you know about this thread that mentions oral probiotics having a positive effect on sinus problems? Some people who tried the oral probiotics also noticed increased mental clarity (relevant to this thread.)

 

[sleepingbeautyxxx]

It's pretty much the same for me. Even on brain fog days I can still read and understand the information, even though I might have to read it slowly or twice. But calculating...

I was never good at this, but now it's very hard for me to count two numbers together. But I realized it's easier if I have the numbers written down, bc I guess for me it's a problem remembering, imagining the numbers and then counting them together in my head. Generally, I can't remember things spoken to me, I'm a visual thinker. Thats probably the case for you too?