Did anything stress you out before you got me/Cfs?

[duncan]

ME/CFS is a disease, but in terms of classification, ME/CFS is described functional somatic disorder (even if like me, you don't agree with the psychogenic etiological explanations given for functional somatic disorders).

Not by everybody. Certainly not by our advocates or most recognized expert ME/CFS clinicians

I suggest that every time you use the term, you legitimize it. I would shun it.

 

[Hip]

I suggest that every time you use the term, you legitimize it. I would shun it.

I don't like using either, but in this case, there is unfortunately no way to make use of the findings of that paper without referring to the term.

And if you understood my argument, I have used those findings to cast some doubt on the idea that stress can help precipitate ME/CFS.

 

[duncan]

I understand your argument. I also understand the impact of you using the term in the context of ME/CFS without disavowing it immediately.

 

[nikefourstar]

This might have been your precipitating infection, @nikefourstar . Lots of people have GI infections as their triggering event.



Environmental triggers? How far are you into your illness, how long have you had ME symptoms?

Welcome to the forums!

Thanks no offense but I don't want to be welcomed, I've never been so scared or suicidal in my entire life. But I've had symtoms for just over a couple months but it feels like my entire life especially considering I was chronically ill before this set off

 

[Neunistiva]

Obv I had a bad experience with them so I'm not promoting them but just in case they're right did anyone have some sort of emotional trigger?

I never experienced any emotional trauma or anything more than normal stress of everyday life.

Actually, I was in the best period of my life for several years when I came down with ME/CFS. 2 years prior I had moved back to my hometown and was closer to my family, I had very successfully passed all of my University exams, I had enough time to get back to doing sports, and I reconnected with my childhood friends and went out every weekend.

 

[Hip]

I also understand the impact of you using the term in the context of ME/CFS without disavowing it immediately.

To give the reader a proper understanding of what is meant by a functional disorder, it would require many paragraphs of text. You can see in this post what is required to adequately explain the concept of a functional disorder.

If you would like to provide such a long explanation in every thread where the term functional disorder or its synonyms are used, because you feel it is important, then please be my guest.

 

[duncan]

To give the reader a proper understanding of what is meant by a functional disorder, it would require many paragraphs of text. You can see in this post what is required to adequately explain the concept of a functional disorder.

If you would like to provide such a long explanation in every thread where the term functional disorder or its synonyms are used, because you feel it is important, then please be my guest.

I cannot agree. Simply say that functional disorders are rooted in about as much reality as conversion disorders and the tooth fairy. See? It's not difficult at all.

Alternatively, just resist the urge to indulge in a term that is false and denigrating and harmful - and not just to the ME/CFS community.

 

[nikefourstar]

Does anyone thing that since mine seemed to be completely stress drivin and maybe drug drivin, I didn't have a viral onset, maybe ill recover??

 

[Hip]

I cannot agree. Simply say that functional disorders are rooted in about as much reality as conversion disorders and the tooth fairy. See? It's not difficult at all.

Saying that implies that ME/CFS, fibromyalgia, IBS, GWS, etc are not real diseases, and are as imaginary as the tooth fairy.

 

[duncan]

Saying that implies that ME/CFS, fibromyalgia, IBS, GWS, etc are not real diseases, and are as imaginary as the tooth fairy.

See, and I would like to suggest it implies just the opposite. By disavowing the concept of functional disorders, it allows each of those diseases to be labeled as such, instead of a contrived psychobabble nonentity that relegates sufferers to a sort of diagnostic limbo or worse.

 

[Neunistiva]

To give the reader a proper understanding of what is meant by a functional disorder, it would require many paragraphs of text. You can see in this post what is required to adequately explain the concept of a functional disorder.

That alone may be a good reason not to use it. If it can't be clearly defined, it is bound to lead to confusion.

There is no definition of "functional somatic disorder" available online, wikipedia doesn't even mention it, Google returns barely over 2000 results, and most of those are connected to Simon Wesley....

Now, if you two would like to continue discussing this, may I suggest starting a different thread? None of this helps @l2009

 

[Hip]

By disavowing the concept of functional disorders, it allows each of those diseases to be labeled as such, instead of a contrived psychobabble nonentity that relegates sufferers to a sort of diagnostic limbo or worse.

If you want a pithy one-sentence statement on functional disorders, something like this might suffice:

The idea that functional disorders are caused by psychological factors is complete nonsense; there is no evidence to support this view; by contrast, there is plenty of evidence indicating that diseases classified as functional disorders are organic illnesses that involve numerous physiological abnormalities.

That alone may be a good reason not to use it. If it can't be clearly defined, it is bound to lead to confusion.

Functional disorders are clearly defined, but require a bit of background understanding.

There is no definition of "functional somatic disorder" available online, wikipedia doesn't even mention it, Google returns barely over 2000 results, and kost of those are connected to Simon Wesley....

Somatoform psychologists don't do much real scientific work, so they spend a lot of their time creating new names for old concepts, to make it look like they are working. A "functional somatic disorder" is the same as a "functional disorder", which you will find on Wikipedia here.

Now, if you two would like to continue discussing this, may I suggest starting a different thread? None of this helps @l2009

I don't find these discussions productive, and but Duncan tends to engage in them on any thread when a term is used that contains psychological concepts.

I am more than happy to delete all my above posts on this subject, including this one, if Duncan agrees to and is happy to do likewise, just to keep this thread on topic.

 

[ash0787]

Have to disagree with most of the conclusions drawn in this thread, my cfs started acutely within the same week as experiencing very high stress and emotional load, my father found a reason to consider divorce which would have meant selling the house that I have lived at for approx 20 years, this was amplified by me having used to suffer quite a bit from OCD ( properly diagnosed etc ), and my personality in general. I used exercise to cope with the intense stress, contracted some sort of infection that initially seemed like a cold, then boom, and here we are...

Something that might interest Hip, I also had general anxiety disorder for a period of around 3 monthes,
in the same year that I developed CFS. When I had this chronic anxiety problem I felt that there were physiological changes to my body as a result, for example difficulty controlling temperature ( overheating / thirst ). I actually remember a short period where I felt very CFS like in terms of energy levels, difficulty walking anywhere, general feeling of the body etc, but missing most of the symptoms. I actually even did a diabetes self test not long after that, which reminds me of the noticable extent to how the body felt 'off'.
It was around a month after I started to feel normal again / control the anxiety that I got the CFS.

 

[Dechi]

Did I ever point you to my thread here: Completely eliminated my severe anxiety symptoms with three supplements!

I had seen it before and actually tried your supplements. Unfortunately, I have hypersensitivity to supplements and a high probability of gaining weight with them. One of the three made me gain like 4 pounds in 3 days, so I stopped. Gaining weight would make me depressed, so I would rather manage anxiety than depression ;-)

 

[Hip]

my cfs started acutely within the same week as experiencing very high stress and emotional load,

I also had general anxiety disorder for a period of around 3 monthes, in the same year that I developed CFS.

Did the time you developed your generalized anxiety disorder coincide with the time of high stress and emotional load, or did one occur before the other, or did one occur before the other, but there was some overlap?

In my own experience of generalized anxiety disorder, once you have GAD, many normally easy-going events and activities in life suddenly become stressful, and if you actually encounter some events (like yours) that are genuinely stressful, then the stress content is even further amplified by your GAD, because I found GAD makes you much less able to handle stress.

 

[JES]

Something that might interest Hip, I also had general anxiety disorder for a period of around 3 monthes, in the same year that I developed CFS. When I had this chronic anxiety problem I felt that there were physiological changes to my body as a result, for example difficulty controlling temperature ( overheating / thirst ). I actually remember a short period where I felt very CFS like in terms of energy levels, difficulty walking anywhere, general feeling of the body etc, but missing most of the symptoms. I actually even did a diabetes self test not long after that, which reminds me of the noticable extent to how the body felt 'off'.
It was around a month after I started to feel normal again / control the anxiety that I got the CFS.

It might also be that whatever process that triggered your CFS actually started when you got the generalized anxiety, as that is what was my first symptom was as well. Not all cases of CFS progress rapidly, sometimes you have a gradual onset where the first symptoms come years before you "crash".

For me the problem started with generalized anxiety, and that anxiety had nothing to do with real-life crisis events, as I was in a steady life situation. People always assume that anxiety is a response to something in your environment, that it's some problem you have created yourself, but I think most of the time it's physiological. There are millions of people that are under huge stress every day. If you are a CEO of a big company, or a top athlete, or a single parent that works long hours, life can be massive stressful. Yet I don't read stories in the press about these people developing CFS. Stress and generalized anxiety are two very different things.

 

[Hip]

People always assume that anxiety is a response to something in your environment, that it's some problem you have created yourself, but I think most of the time it's physiological.

I completely agree.

 

[ash0787]

Did the time you developed your generalized anxiety disorder coincide with the time of high stress and emotional load, or did one occur before the other, or did one occur before the other, but there was some overlap?

In my own experience of generalized anxiety disorder, once you have GAD, many normally easy-going events and activities in life suddenly become stressful, and if you actually encounter some events (like yours) that are genuinely stressful, then the stress content is even further amplified by your GAD, because I found GAD makes you much less able to handle stress.

Seperate but close, developed the GAD / panic disorder in early may 2015, recovered from it by early august 2015 but was still relatively mentally unstable, slightly depressed etc, got the CFS acutely in early september 2015.

Perhaps ironically but what set off my anxiety problems to start with was a chest pain that started after running which I mistook for a possible heart problem ( knowing very little about medicine at the time ) then the physiological effects of anxiety created a sort of feedback loop of hypochondria. I was extremely physically fit prior to any of this occurring.

 

[me/cfs 27931]

I had quite a few neuro symptoms as a child, including vision issues, episodic short term memory issues, episodic brain fog, peripheral neuropathy. This was all before a severe viral infection at age 15, after which the entire cluster of ME/CFS symptoms, including PEM, set in.

For the most part, I led a relatively non-stressful life before ME/CFS. The exception being the periods where my neuro symptoms flared up, and I had to struggle with schoolwork, receiving no help or understanding from adults.

So, I honestly don't know how to answer @l2009 's question. For me, it's more of a chicken and egg type puzzle.

 

[Hip]

Perhaps ironically but what set off my anxiety problems to start with was a chest pain that started after running which I mistook for a possible heart problem

That chest pain could have been pleurodynia (Bornholm disease), which is usually caused by contracting coxsackievirus B, a virus linked to ME/CFS.

I developed anxiety symptoms after catching my ME/CFS-triggering virus (most likely an enterovirus like coxsackievirus B); anxiety was one of the first symptoms of my virus; then the ME/CFS came later.