Depression Poll

[Misfit Toy]

Well, I agree with that @GracieJ. You are right. I am depressed over life's circumstances and also because of lack of sleep. But it feels depressing.

There comes a point that you can't even tell the difference.

Am I really depressed? It's funny because all night I've had the song, "The Hills are Alive with the Sound of Music" running through my head. I keep singing it.

That's a pretty happy song and I laugh when I remember the movie because I loved it.

Not so depressing. But, oh so tired.

"Goodnight, farewell"......

 

[Kati]

Being unhappy or upset is not depression. And that seems to be what many here are experiencing from time to time, as a consequence of the disease and their treatment.

I also asked that people vote based on which response is most accurate, most of the time. If someone is a bit upset from time to time, but generally not depressed, then they don't have depression and the answer would be "no".

To quote the NHS website: "Most people experience feelings of stress, sadness or anxiety during difficult times. A low mood may improve after a short time, rather than being a sign of depression." This temporary reaction seems to be what most "no" voting patients are describing here, even if they (incorrectly) use the term "depression" to describe that temporary reactive state.

And finally, if anyone feels differently about their initial response, this poll allows them to change their answer at any time.

Look, I ave a history of depression and yes, i take anti-depressants. But I am currently not depressed. i am not happy as a clown but I laugh everyday and I haven't cried in months. I manage to have a few goals and a few projects and I am hopeful for the future.

A poll is a poll. It will not be accurate. You ask a question, you can't tell people how to answer. If you want a more accurate sampling, your poll question and answer need to be more precise.
For instance
1) I have a history of depression before disease onset
2) depression came after disease onset
3) I have never been depressed.
4) etc...

Right now you asked 'Are you depressed', yes or no. You get a yes or no for answer, but please don't tell people how to answer.

 

[CFS_for_19_years]

If I wanted to avoid stigma, I'd hang out at an MS forum and tell everyone in my life that that's what I have, not ME/CFS

From now on I have MS! Even people whom I've already told I have CFS/ME - it's really MS, the diagnosis of CFS/ME was a mistake!

 

[Kati]

View attachment 9562

From now on I have MS! Even people whom I've already told I have CFS/ME - it's really MS, the diagnosis of CFS/ME was a mistake!

Shave your head and tell people you have cancer. You'll receive homemade meals, offers to cut the grass, clean your house and much more.

 

[GracieJ]

Hi, @Misfit Toy It struck me as I was reading your earlier posts that you feel sad and discouraged at times. I think we overreach on the word depression. I see other posts where you are hilarious and full of humor, but of course it would be inaccurate to say anyone cracking jokes here is then manic.

It is such a huge and good milestone for me to come on these forums and say what is what in my life. I do not have to pretend anything. If my week went rough, it went rough. If I crashed from autumn and it took a three-month chunk from me (it did), then it did. If I had a wonderfully fantastic emotional high at work with my clients, I can share that as well.

It was a happy and triumphant moment, believe it or not, to do this poll with a resounding NO!! I just pulled out of the worst ME/CFS crash I have had in years. I feel like a successful person because I pulled out of it without triggering any serious level of ANY depression. Talk about an emotional high! I am feeling strong this week mentally, and am encouraged and empowered with such a great new feeling. That, I understand, is one facet of resiliency, a relative newcomer in my life.

Hello, contentment!

 

[Misfit Toy]

Yes, cancer is where it's at. Sad. But even my friend...a 10 year sufferer who did pass told me, "Everyone came in the beginning. They'd visit and bring food or smoke some pot with me....but now, no one has called, visited in months. Nothing."

I felt so bad because I promised to go but then I became sick and she died.

Gosh. Awful. But what a strong, beautiful person. So full of life and wore a purple wig. She was an amazing artist.

 

[Misfit Toy]

@GracieJ -I believe you. I don't question your response. It's just to see 76% of all people on here do not have depression seems...well it seems like a high number.

I don't want to defend my statement or my opinion. It's an opinion, that's it. Everyone has one.

But yeah, that's how I feel.

I go up and down with this illness. No mania here. Just an illness that is very much like a yo yo. Sometimes higher, sometimes, too low.

Ultimately, not what I want. No one can deal with extremes. No pain..lots of pain. Some sleep, no sleep...inflammation, infection, surgery.. It's crazy making. So, yes...I suffer with a bit of depression for said reasons.

BUT, I am so happy you are in a good place. I believe it and yes!

 

[Valentijn]

Right now you asked 'Are you depressed', yes or no. You get a yes or no for answer, but please don't tell people how to answer.

I didn't tell anyone how to answer.

I did, however, clarify what is meant by the options so that people can have a common understanding of the results. Had I not done so, there would now be a dozen comments along the lines of "If I was depressed once for 10 minutes, that's a 'yes', right?" and "I can't answer because I'm depressed 33% of the time, upset 33% of the time, and feel happy the rest of the time."

If someone believes that being situationally upset for a couple days after tribulations means that they are depressed, they can still select "yes" if they really want to. Then they're just responding in a manner which isn't accurate to the definition of "depression", and is confusing the results.

People described being reactively upset, yet marking "no" on the poll. It was then implied that they are (deluded?) liars who must fear stigma and/or who stigmatize mental disorders. I find that rather offensive, especially since it's an attack upon ME patients often made by BPS researchers seeking to discredit ME patients and withhold biological treatment.

 

[CFS_for_19_years]

Shave your head and tell people you have cancer. You'll receive homemade meals, offers to cut the grass, clean your house and much more.

I'm anxious with anticipation.

 

[Kati]

I didn't tell anyone how to answer.

I did, however, clarify what is meant by the options so that people can have a common understanding of the results. Had I not done so, there would now be a dozen comments along the lines of "If I was depressed once for 10 minutes, that's a 'yes', right?" and "I can't answer because I'm depressed 33% of the time, upset 33% of the time, and feel happy the rest of the time."

If someone believes that being situationally upset for a couple days after tribulations means that they are depressed, they can still select "yes" if they really want to. Then they're just responding in a manner which isn't accurate to the definition of "depression", and is confusing the results.

People described being reactively upset, yet marking "no" on the poll. It was then implied that they are (deluded?) liars who must fear stigma and/or who stigmatize mental disorders. I find that rather offensive, especially since it's an attack upon ME patients often made by BPS researchers seeking to discredit ME patients and withhold biological treatment.

I do think there is a lot of trauma fear and yes, stigma in our community in regards to depression. In my case, my own GP felt that I was simply depressed for over 2 years. Patients do not necessarily want to admit to depression because it is often seen as a weakness of character in society.

It it complicated. It will remain complicated for a while longer, until we have biomarkers and until there can be one day biomarkers, better treatments and more respect for depression and for ME.

 

[GracieJ]

I wish I could find these numbers again.

Depression supposedly strikes people with ME/CFS at the same rate as in the general population, 16% according to the writer or researcher I cannot locate at the moment. Then it goes up the same way it does in any ill population, anywhere from 30 to 60% depending on symptoms, length of illness. Considering we are a mostly under treated and under diagnosed population, I would say matched numbers show how strong people are in adversity.

 

[MeSci]

Shave your head and tell people you have cancer. You'll receive homemade meals, offers to cut the grass, clean your house and much more.

If only that were the case. A friend of mine has late-stage leukemia and is still having to struggle to the supermarket with her 81-year old husband who has heart disease. She has not been able to get any help with that and struggles with computers so can't (yet) order online.

Don't assume that the grass is so green on the other side.

 

[MeSci]

I wish I could find these numbers again.

Depression supposedly strikes people with ME/CFS at the same rate as in the general population, 16% according to the writer or researcher I cannot locate at the moment. Then it goes up the same way it does in any ill population, anywhere from 30 to 60% depending on symptoms, length of illness. Considering we are a mostly under treated and under diagnosed population, I would say matched numbers show how strong people are in adversity.

I've seen studies citing this too. This one, astonishingly by 2 notorious psychs, talks about (mis)diagnosis of psychiatric illness in people with CFS. (Which of course is nothing to do with them...)

 

[MeSci]

I think that those who are suggesting that we are not being honest may be viewing things through the veil of their own depression. As I've said, I have experienced depression, and know how it affects one's interpretation, although I don't recall suspecting depression in others. A depressed person and a non-depressed person may pick up different 'feels' from an article or message, one perceiving it as negative and the other perceiving it as positive.

I have met people who think that everyone must feel the same as they do. For example, a doctor who had had a cancer scare thought that everyone must have a fear of cancer in the forefront of their minds - because she had.

Then there is logic - if one has an illness and is also depressed, maybe it's hard to imagine that anyone with the same illness could be non-depressed.

Most of us here appear to be very in touch with our emotions, and also very open and honest. And the poll itself is anonymous. Many more people have voted than have posted messages in the thread.

So I really think that we should trust people's votes - and replies.

I was actually affronted by those who appear not to, but tried to rationalise it instead of responding angrily. I hope I succeeded!

 

[MeSci]

Check this article: http://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...-allergic-reaction-inflammation-immune-system

Is depression a kind of allergic reaction?
A growing number of scientists are suggesting that depression is a result of inflammation caused by the body’s immune system

I was going to suggest giving this article its own thread - but two people already have! Here is the active one.

 

[MeSci]

In other words, if ME/CFS is not intrinsically depressing for many patients, if you are depressed, does it make sense to blame your depression on the limitations and tribulations of ME/CFS?

If that is one's carefully-reasoned perception - yes. Everyone's circumstances are different - some more drastically-affected by ME than others. Everyone's symptoms are a little different. Everyone's biochemistry is different. People are of different ages, in different financial circumstances, etc. All these have a bearing on how ME will affect them.

 

[MeSci]

@Antares in NYC
This thread is about whether ME/CFS patients have depression as a commodity or not.

That really threw me for a moment. Depression as a commodity - an article of trade or commerce, especially a product as distinguished from a service. 2. something of use, advantage, or value...

Then I realised you probably mean co-morbidity!

 

[Mij]

I have felt distressed years ago when I thought I would never improve or recover, but that is not depressed. They are different.

 

[MeSci]

Well, I do see depression on here Valentijn. People write me PM's and let me know their truth. They don't always confess for all to see. Plus, I read jealousy posts, pacing posts, all kinds of sad and depressed folks on here. Almost...almost everyone who is sick is depressed because of their illness. Not everyone, but most.

Those that claim they aren't, I sometimes wonder if they want to come off all shiny and fabulous. Maybe you are not. Maybe you are fine with your BF and all that goes on...but many who are financially strapped, tired, can't do much, don't have help....are.

I know that for years I said I wasn't depressed with this illness. I was frightened of that stigma. I say stigma because when I was first diagnosed with CFS, all docs thought I was just mental and yes...that's a stigma because they treated me like I was crazy. I'm not scared of that "stigma" anymore. I know I'm sick. Docs know I'm sick. I've got blood work to prove it and yup, I'm depressed. It's a shame they started believing me in my 30's.

And I know there are so many lurking in the shadows that read these posts, rarely comment...they are depressed and I know this because they email me. People are also frightened of who sees what on here. Are CFIDS higher ups on here, or the government? We don't always know anymore who or what is watching us.


And let's not forget how many people end their lives because of this illness. They weren't happy when they went out, that's for sure.

I don't quite understand your reference to pacing in the context of depression - or was that to show that you are reading a wide range of topics?

The idea of me trying to appear shiny and fabulous is really comical! I have suffered severe poverty, to the extent that I had to go through two freezing winters with no proper heating. I was constantly worried about being able to keep my head above water financially. Etc., etc. But these do not automatically lead to depression.

In the early days I had no one who understood what was happening. Even I didn't know what was wrong. I was vomiting every day, without a car, losing my house, malnourished, and more, and yes - I did become clinically depressed and made a serious attempt on my life in 1996.

So I am very aware of when I am depressed and when I am not. The only time I have been slightly depressed since then was a consequence of a personal loss which was nothing to do with ME. It wasn't the same - more grief plus existential crisis due to realising how much time had passed, etc. It was no way the same as what I had in 1996.

Please don't generalise from your own experience. I know that you have had extreme pressures on top of ME, and your life is not the same as those of other people here. None of our lives is the same as those of other sufferers. Some have it 'better', and maybe some have it worse.

We are all individuals!

 

[MeSci]

Well, I agree with that @GracieJ. You are right. I am depressed over life's circumstances and also because of lack of sleep. But it feels depressing.

There comes a point that you can't even tell the difference.

Am I really depressed? It's funny because all night I've had the song, "The Hills are Alive with the Sound of Music" running through my head. I keep singing it.

That's a pretty happy song and I laugh when I remember the movie because I loved it.

Not so depressing. But, oh so tired.

"Goodnight, farewell"......

I feel much more cheerful today than I did yesterday. That's because I slept well last night and not the night before. My friend with leukaemia sounded tearful on the phone yesterday - but she has been sleeping very badly (as well as stressing over going into a new clinical trial, facing all the travel and exhaustion and side effects - or dying). Sleep - or lack of it - can make a huge difference to mood.