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Deficient but really sensitive to b12. Stuck!

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by Jackdaw, Nov 10, 2018.

  1. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

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    I am bedbound. I am deficient in all b vitamins. I am trying to correct my b12 deficiency. I have low serum b12 and high urine MMA.

    Last year I took about 180 micro grams of methyl b12 sublingual. I had no bad effects the first time but three times after I would have burning muscles and was off my feet for a week.

    I am much sicker this year and am trying hydroxy b12 sublingual at just 5 micro grams. I feel wired, anxious and my ME is worse although some trouble moving my mouth is better.

    Does anyone know of such sensitivity to b12?
    Am I right to try and get this in my system or could it cause damage?
    My folate is low. Do I need to supplement this and how much?
    I am keeping my potassium up. Is there anything else that could be brought low?

    I am struggling to find anyone taking b12 in the amounts l am and wondering if I have a separate problem?

    I would appreciate any thoughts on this as I feel stuck.

    Thanks!
     
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  2. Learner1

    Learner1 Forum Support Assistant

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    Have you tried taking all the other cofactors that work with it? B6, B2, TMG, magnesium? Glutathione cofactors, like glycine, glutamine, and NAC? Transsulfuration pathway nutrients like B1 and molybdenum?
     
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  3. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    At one point, B12 supplements induced strong suicidal moods. It hasn't done that the last few times I tried it, but I have no trouble accepting that it can cause other serious reactions in other people. Learner1's suggestion of experimenting with cofactors is good. Of course, maybe the wrong cofactor will make B12's negative effect even stronger, which would at least tell you what to avoid.
     
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  4. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

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    I have tried the other b’s and magnesium. My molybdenum levels were measured not long ago and were fine. I am nervous about experimenting with NAC as some people have a very bad response and I am so ill already.

    @Learner1 I don’t know the other ones you mentioned. It is so difficult to get my head round.

    It has been suggested that it is a ‘reversal’ response as I have been deficient for so long. It is hard to tell when feeling bad is good!
     
  5. ljimbo423

    ljimbo423 Senior Member

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    I got very sick when I first started methylfolate. Even at 25-50 micrograms a day! I'm learning, after over 11 years of trial and error. That protecting my mitochondria and my brain from neuro-inflammation are the most important things to do first.

    Increasing methylation by increasing B-12, can mobilize toxins, make mitochondrial function worse, from the increased toxins and probably worsen brain inflammation.

    I have found that supporting my mitochondria and taking supplements to reduce the low grade brain inflammation Jarred Younger talked about at the OMF symposium in September.

    Has allowed me to function at much higher levels and to tolerate supplements much better also.

    High dose EPA/DHA from fish oil is good for brain inflammation and inflammation in general.

    I'm taking 4 grams a day now of EPA/DHA. BCAA's, at higher doses seems to be very good for mitochondrial function and increasing energy, as is coq10.

    Whatever you do, I encourage you to make changes very, very slowly, so you don't worsen your symptoms. You never know what might help.

    I put off trying BCAA's for many months, after reading about many people having good success with them. Only to discover that BCAA's would be the most effective supplement I have ever taken!
     
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  6. Moof

    Moof Senior Member

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    It's possible to be allergic to cobalt (B12, or cobalamin, contains cobalt), but usually it manifests as severe dermatitis. If you had skin symptoms as well as other reactions, it's possible that it's an allergy. It seems unlikely from what you've said, but I thought I'd mention it.
     
    Jackdaw likes this.
  7. YippeeKi YOW !!

    YippeeKi YOW !! Senior Member

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    Second star to the right ...
    @Jackdaw
    I have the same sensitivity, and after much experimentation with even teeny-tiny amounts of any B-vits, including methylB-12 and folate, I gave up and started looking into alternate methods/sources.

    The one I've settled on is a New Zealand-sourced, non-defatted beef liver, which is an excellent source of all the above, along with a lot of other stuff. I'm still in the break-in stage of one cap a day. I have to open it (just to make life absolutely perfect, I react incredibly badly to gelatin caps, ain't it fun) and dump it into a small amount of warm water (so I can whisk it into an emulsion) and about 3-4 times that amount of a fairly fresh very cold veggie juice that sort of mimics V-8, only a whole lot better for you and fresher tasting. This kills the taste (I really really REALLY hate the taste of liver), and I chug it down quickly.

    Here's a link to what I'm trialing if you want to give it look. https://ancestralsupplements.com/desiccated-liver

    I'll try to remember to post back to you when I've boosted the dose to at least half the recommended daily amount (which would be 3 caps, with 6 caps a day as rec'd dose) and have a better handle on how it's treating me. So far, though, it hasn't produced any bad effects, and I think there may be a subtle change in energy :woot:. Or an active placebo imagination :) .....
     
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  8. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

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    @YippeeKi YOW !! Unfortunately, i’m vegetarian. But glad you have found something that is hopefully working and not your imagination!

    @ljimbo423 Can you get those oils from a veggie supplement?
    BCAA’s make me crash easier. I have great energy potential (NADH, acetyl l carnitine) but I feel much worse after. I can’t fathom if I need something which is missing or it’s just bad to make energy.
     
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  9. ljimbo423

    ljimbo423 Senior Member

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  10. Jackdaw

    Jackdaw

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    @ljimbo423 I take flaxseed oil already. I didn’t realise it was a source of those. Thanks.
     
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  11. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    The body is inefficient at converting the flax oil omega-3's to the kind the body needs. Flax oil isn't being marketed (much) as a replacement for fish oil.

    There have been several studies released recently that show the 'omega-3 oil health benefits' to be almost entirely marketing hype, at least for heart health. It's marketed as a 'take one capsule a day instead of eating healthy and exercising' solution for avoiding heart problems. I hate marketing scams.
     
  12. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    That wired, anxious effect might be a result of over-methylation (assuming you were already an over-methylator). I believe niacinamide reduces methylation, so might counter the effects.

    Though with the normal daily intake of B12 from diet being around 3 mcg daily, it's hard to understand why the 5 mcg you took should have such strong effects.
     

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