Choline on the Brain? A Guide to Choline in Chronic Fatigue Syndrome
http://phoenixrising.me/research-2/the-brain-in-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-mecfs/choline-on-the-brain-a-guide-to-choline-in-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-by-cort-johnson-aug-2005
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Clostridium Butyricum - A Game Changer?

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by adreno, May 7, 2015.

  1. hixxy

    hixxy Senior Member

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    Non-medicinal ingredients: lactose, potato starch, polyvinyl alcohol, providone. Capsule: hypromellose.

    Those look pretty horrible for anyone really hypersensitive. It's a shame when companies ruin their supplements like this.
     
  2. MeSci

    MeSci ME/CFS since 1995; activity level 6?

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  3. pattismith

    pattismith Senior Member

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    I like to do my own lactic acid bacteria cultures too, so I'm interested in growing the clostridium butyricum in my yoghurt maker like you do. Don't you think that the culture may be more rich if you add the potatoe starch in the milk ?
     
  4. IThinkImTurningJapanese

    IThinkImTurningJapanese Moderator

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    I got help from it immediately. Some benefits, like improvements in OI, were not seen until several months of treatment though.

    I think @adreno may have it right when he said,
    With an intervention as powerful as this, it is important to pay attention to your experience.
     
    pattismith likes this.
  5. IThinkImTurningJapanese

    IThinkImTurningJapanese Moderator

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    That makes a hell of a lot more sense, AOR's website says providone which Google can't even find. :confused:

    I thought maybe it was just the capsule which could be discarded, but no!!! :thumbdown:

    I wonder how responsive AOR would be to changing their excipients. ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2017
  6. lyran

    lyran

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    Thank you for the information. I have seen that on iHerb but it's quite expensive. When I was using Symbioflor 2 (e-coli probiotic), It did help a little with my fatigue, so I'm guessing I may be low on some e-coli strains and Clostridium Butyricum lowers e-coli in the gut.

    When I came down with CFS, I also began to have some food allergies (nuts, beans, peas) and that's why I thought that CB could be beneficial to me.

    Nice to know. What was your dose in the beginning and what is it now?
     
  7. tango

    tango Senior Member

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    Yes, the excipients in the AOR are horrible however it's a unique formulation that no one else makes and the results for me are AMAZING so I take it anyway.

    I tried emailing their customer service through their online form but I didn't get a response. I'm not sure if it actually submitted properly as I get a strange page after pressing the submit button.

    Definitely needs to make the product cleaner but for me the benefits far outweigh the excipients.
     
  8. tango

    tango Senior Member

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    Miyarisan has lots of nasty excipients too. The talc concerns me. So neither of the products are clean.

    Lactose Hydrate, Corn Starch, Talc, Microcrystalline Cellulose, Magnesium Stearate, Sucrose
     
  9. IThinkImTurningJapanese

    IThinkImTurningJapanese Moderator

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    I started with 6 tablets a day of Miyarisan Strong, after 3 or 4 months I quit completely due to stomach pains.

    Within three weeks, I experienced a strong return of MCS. I hadn't realized how much Miyarisan was helping with that, I've learned to be very careful with chemical exposures.

    I then started again with 2 tablets a day until I got used to it, and now take 4 a day.
     
    Chocolove, lyran and pattismith like this.
  10. lyran

    lyran

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    I also ordered one bottle of AOR Probiotic-3 to test it. I guess it's best to start with one capsule per day.
     
  11. sflorence

    sflorence Senior Member

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    How many people have seen improvement now with the clostridium . butrycum?

    62 pages is a lot for someone who is fatigued... sorry to be such a cop out.
     
  12. themjay

    themjay

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    Judee, adreno and Gondwanaland like this.
  13. jjxx

    jjxx Senior Member

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    I just did a search on amazon (US located), I could not find Miyarisan anymore! What's going on? Did anyone buy it from amazon recently?
     
  14. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    I think people are buying from ebay
     
  15. IThinkImTurningJapanese

    IThinkImTurningJapanese Moderator

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    Global Rakuten has it. However, I'm finding the same problem when I do a current search. :confused:
     
  16. adreno

    adreno PR activist

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  17. lyran

    lyran

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    It is possible to get gut bacteria analysis, but it costs so much that at least I can't afford it. Using these different probiotics seems to be like hit or miss.
     
  18. jjxx

    jjxx Senior Member

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    @Gondwanaland @IThinkImTurningJapanese Thank both of you! I rely on sufficient reviews from amazon customers to decide if the seller or product is legit, however it does NOT seem it's the case with miyarisan on ebay. With Rakuten, I am struggling to figure out how long and how much to deliver to US.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2017
  19. IThinkImTurningJapanese

    IThinkImTurningJapanese Moderator

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    It's free until August 31st for the U.S. but the English is confusing on the campaign page. I can't check it in Japanese because Rakuten.jp has different policies, but it appears to be free shipping for a minimum order of $100 through EMS, no idea how long they take.

    The sellers you're finding on there are often the same ones I find through Amazon or Rakuten, here in Japan. 99% of the Japanese companies I've dealt with have been excellent at business and customer service.

    I have seen staff change though and the service with it, so reviews may save you the headache of an irresponsible seller. :thumbsup:
     
  20. IThinkImTurningJapanese

    IThinkImTurningJapanese Moderator

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    I have taken Miyarisan for two years now. I will "Bet you money" :rofl: an analysis of my gut bacteria would be far from normal.

    I probably have considerably more than usual c. butyricum species because of daily supplementation.

    I think it is important to realize continued use of this probiotic is most probably not effective at "normalizing" the gut microbiome.

    I most probably have abnormal levels of Butyric acid in my gut.

    I know, however, that it is a powerful means of reducing Lactic Acidosis while simultaneously increasing lactic acid producing bacteria in the gut, shifting the immune system away from inflammatory reactions, and reducing pathogenic bacteria.

    Like you said, Hit or miss. ;)
     
    Judee and lyran like this.

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