Career Advice for Physicist.

[Vic]

@bananabas
Don't do anything that involves long computer use. Computer activity is one of the major reasons people with CFS/ME don't get better. From experience/observation.

 

[SOC]

Unfortunately both Broderick and Baraniuk are based in the US, while I was looking for something on the "old continent". I don't exclude such a relocation, but imagine I go there and don't like it, or my symptoms get worse (or both!).

Well, one benefit is that you'd be right there with some of the top ME specialists in the world. That's worth a lot if you want the best possible ME treatment.

More realistically, telecommuting is becoming so common that it might be possible to work with a research team overseas while still living at home.

I don't think there's much going on using physical sciences in ME in Europe at the moment. That time may come, but you'll need to find something else to do in the meantime.

 

[bananabas]

@bananabas
Don't do anything that involves long computer use. Computer activity is one of the major reasons people with CFS/ME don't get better. From experience/observation.

Is there something specific about computers that harms ME / CFS pacients? Is it the screen? Being sedentary? Or the cognitive involvement that comes with using it?

 

[Sushi]

Is there something specific about computers that harms ME / CFS pacients?

Some are sensitive to EMFs. Most of us find that the blue light spectrum can be hard on the eyes and prevent sleep. Some have installed programs that shifts the light to another strength and spectrum in the evening or they wear amber glasses.

 

[SOC]

Is there something specific about computers that harms ME / CFS pacients? Is it the screen? Being sedentary? Or the cognitive involvement that comes with using it?

Not all patients have trouble with long computer work. This is something you'll need to determine about your own particular situation. It's worth paying attention to whether long computer work makes you worse, but there's no need to assume that it's problematic for us all.

 

[anciendaze]

Three aspects of computer use come into play: sitting upright and leaning forward, mental concentration, close visual activity. I have to take regular breaks where I lie down with my feet up and rest my eyes. This is also a reason to walk to the mailbox.

It is probably unwise for the vast majority of ME/CFS patients to expect to concentrate on anything for hours at a time. This is a special problem for anyone working in an office. At one time I had a private office with a couch or daybed I could lie down on. Most people do not have such things at work, and would run into negative opinions from others if they used them.

I also find that a Balans chair allows me to type without getting the cramps or chest pains I suffer from most normal office chairs or from other knee chairs that do not allow me to rock a little as I change position. (The price on that one just linked shocked me. Anyone know a better source?)

Even with good ergonomics you have to avoid the idea that you can complete a task if you just push yourself a little longer. Once performance starts to deteriorate you won't be accomplishing much good. You also need to realize that common practice of driving to work and driving home is a task with many similar characteristics. You have to include those times in a kind of personal energy budget. I can consistently handle about four hours per day, but if I push beyond that, performance suffers. You may have a different capacity, of which you should keep track. It may take several days for excess activity to catch up with you, but, if you have this illness, it definitely will strike.

 

[Hip]

Don't do anything that involves long computer use. Computer activity is one of the major reasons people with CFS/ME don't get better. From experience/observation.

For me it is the opposite: I get PEM from mentally exciting activity such as socializing with friends (just 3 or 4 hours of light socializing at home triggers PEM the next day), whereas reading and working on the computer, in my own timeframe and without any pressures, I find relaxing and mentally rejuvenating.

 

[bananabas]

Some are sensitive to EMFs. Most of us find that the blue light spectrum can be hard on the eyes and prevent sleep. Some have installed programs that shifts the light to another strength and spectrum in the evening or they wear amber glasses.

EMF sensitivity is hard to prove scientifically I think. On the spectral problem, there is reasearch showing the blue part of the spectrum influences circadian rhythms. I use redshift.

 

[bananabas]

I also find that a Balans chair allows me to type without getting the cramps or chest pains I suffer from most normal office chairs or from other knee chairs that do not allow me to rock a little as I change position. (The price on that one just linked shocked me. Anyone know a better source?)

Interesting! I wonder if IKEA has anything similar..

 

[anciendaze]

For me it is the opposite: I get PEM from mentally exciting activity such as socializing with friends (just 3 or 4 hours of light socializing at home triggers PEM the next day), whereas reading and working on the computer, in my own timeframe and without any pressures, I find relaxing and mentally rejuvenating.

I think we all experience problems with sensory stimulation and multitasking. Socializing requires a number of subtasks which are commonly impaired. It also typically takes place while people are upright. The distinction may be between social interactions and solitary activities, or between sitting and fully upright posture, rather than between computer and non-computer activities. I would hazard a guess that you are able to break off computer activities and lie down whenever you want. This is not typical of social interactions.

One important place where this appears is in working with others during regular office hours. In that case computer activity and social interactions overlap. People also rarely lie down completely at a place of work. The associated stresses make it difficult to hold a regular job.

 

[Hip]

The distinction may be between social interactions and solitary activities, or between sitting and fully upright posture, rather than between computer and non-computer activities.

In my case I think the PEM and exhaustion I get from socializing is likely due to the brain arousal which tends to occur during excited socializing. I wrote a short post on this here:

Crashing after joyful get-togethers with family and friends


The interesting thing is that I get the same mental PEM and exhaustion when I use instant messaging (online chat) on my computer. For me, instant messaging is just as exhausting as face-to-face socializing.

I could not figure out why this might be initially, but then I realized that during instant messaging conversations, because of the real-time immediacy of it, you can get just as mentally excited and aroused as if you were talking face-to-face. Whereas when I am writing an online post or answering an email in my own timeframe, I find this calming and meditative, because there is no urgency for immediate reply or action; you do things in your own time, so the brain remains calm.

Thus in my case, I think brain arousal and excitement likely plays a major role in my mental PEM.


Another thing I find mentally exhausting in socializing — and this is hard to describe — is "maintaining my character and personality". In social interactions, naturally we present ourselves as ourself, and respond to the conversation as the personality we are. This is find takes a lot of energy; it takes a lot of energy (and arousal) just to be my social self.

But when I am not socializing, and I don't need to present myself as myself, I think there is less energy expenditure in the brain.

 

[Sushi]

(The price on that one just linked shocked me. Anyone know a better source?)

I don't know of one off hand but those have been on my radar for a while and I've seen ones that are much less expensive.

 

[Sushi]

EMF sensitivity is hard to prove scientifically I think.

Agreed. Those of us who mention it just feel like something is bothering us energetically when on the computer. No science, just anecdotal observation. And not everyone, by any means, feels that.

 

[Sushi]

The distinction may be between social interactions and solitary activities, or between sitting and fully upright posture, rather than between computer and non-computer activities.

Many of my social interactions, at home anyway, happen with me reclining in bed with lots of pillows propping me up, or doing the same on the couch or sitting in a recliner. This does make it easier for me than say, in a restaurant where your legs are hanging down and there is background noise.

 

[Vic]

Is there something specific about computers that harms ME / CFS pacients? Is it the screen? Being sedentary? Or the cognitive involvement that comes with using it?

Everyone with CFS/ME has an asymmetrical shift in their shoulders. For some this shift can get aggravated while sitting at a computer. For others the arm positioning of using a keyboard/mouse provides a support for that asymmetry, allowing them to relax more like @Hip said. But when you get back up, your body is more stuck in that asymmetry, and every other normal day to day function strains against it, causing the fatigue. I've noticed the effect change from time to time.

Some are sensitive to EMFs. Most of us find that the blue light spectrum can be hard on the eyes and prevent sleep. Some have installed programs that shifts the light to another strength and spectrum in the evening or they wear amber glasses.

Yes part of it is definitely the blue light. From what I've noticed it can cause automatic neuromuscular reactions. For a long time just looking at blue light would cause an injury in my chest to aggravate. From what I can tell it makes your chest and other muscles around the shoulders, neck, and face to tense up.

I think EMFs have a real effect on our bodies as well.

 

[SOC]

Everyone with CFS/ME has an asymmetrical shift in their shoulders.

Reference please, especially for the "everyone" bit. There's not much everyone with ME/CFS has.

 

[Hip]

Yes part of it is definitely the blue light. From what I've noticed it can cause automatic neuromuscular reactions.

Blue light, especially a flashing one on a police car, can make automatic neuromuscular reactions occur in some people: namely criminals running away from the law.

However, don't think blue light is going to affect the muscles of anyone else.

 

[Vic]

Reference please, especially for the "everyone" bit. There's not much everyone with ME/CFS has.

For now you just have to take my word for it. Or you can take your shirt off and look in a mirror.

Blue light, especially a flashing one on a police car, can make automatic neuromuscular reactions occur in some people: namely criminals running away from the law.

However, don't think blue light is going to affect the muscles of anyone else.

Just my experience and some observations. Too complicated for me to explain here.

 

[Valentijn]

For now you just have to take my word for it. Or you can take your shirt off and look in a mirror.

My shoulders are symmetrical. So your statement is obviously wrong.

 

[Hip]

I focused on low energy/low temperature physics, in the context of condensed matter. The particular type of problems we tackle are in the field of Bose-Einstein condensation as it applies to non-equilibrium dissipative systems, like cavity exciton-polaritons. Not sure how familiar you are with this type of systems, but I'm happy to give more details, if you wish. Perhaps in another thread or a private conversation.

While I do agree that brain fog is an interesting phenomenon to explore, the fact that it does not seem to be caused by physical changes makes it more molecular biology/chemistry related I think. Nothing wrong with that, but quite far removed from my field of expertise.

I am afraid that further details would probably go right over my head, much as I would like to understand more.

By the way, have you ever come across the Hameroff-Penrose microtubule theory of consciousness, which hypothesizes that consciousness arises from quantum processes occurring within the interior of microtubules, which are organelles found in every cell?

I found this theory very interesting, but I only understand it at the popular science book reading level, not in any technical detail. Originally Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff proposed that Bose-Einstein condensates were occurring within microtubules, and that these were the basis for human (and presumably animal) consciousness, and the means by which consciousness processes information. However, I understand this Bose-Einstein idea did not quite work out, so they now have proposed a Frohlich condensate instead. More info here.

As for the medical ramifications of this microtubule theory of consciousness, Hameroff et al published a paper hypothesizing that a degradation in microtubule polymerization and stability leads to the reduction of conscious awareness, memory, and cognitive function that is characteristic of Alzheimer's. Hameroff proposes that in Alzheimer's, microtubules are destabilized as a result of altered intracellular zinc levels; the zinc levels he says are themselves perturbed by the beta amyloid plaque found in Alzheimer's.



Of course, the Hameroff-Penrose theory of consciousness is just a hypothesis, but it is one area where quantum theory and human cognition may coincide. So perhaps your field of physics is not that far removed from consciousness and the brain as you think!

Although I would not have thought that microtubules and the Hameroff-Penrose theory of consciousness, even if true, play a role in the reduction of consciousness (brain fog) that occurs in ME/CFS; I think it is more likely that ME/CFS brain fog will be explained at the biochemical level of neurotransmitters.

Having said that, interestingly, some ME/CFS patents, and lupus patients (who also suffer brain fog), have been shown to have autoantibodies to microtubule proteins, and these antibodies could be disrupting the microtubules, and the quantum states hypothesized to exist inside them, possibly reducing consciousness.