Cannabis and ME/CFS

[undiagnosed]

I'm way to wimpy to try darknet markets.

Wimpy in what respect? That you could get caught breaking the law or that you may get an unsafe product? I haven't actually made a purchase through any darknet market, just been browsing to see what's available.

 

[Cheesus]

I used to be addicted to cannabis. I smoked so much that when I quit I went through a genuine withdrawal. I had to stay at my parents house and told them I had the flu because I had a high temperature but felt really cold and shivery.

I think indica strains have more potential in people with ME than sativa. Indica plants are short and squat with broader leaves, whereas sativa are tall skinny things. Indica plants are more heavy in CBD, which is the compound that makes you feel mellow. Sativa, on the other hand, are high in THC which is the compound that gives you a giggly high.

Obviously one of the problems with cannabis is how you consume it. Smoking has its clear risk factors, not least because it costs a hell of a lot to smoke a joint without any tobacco in, so it is easy to become addicted to the tobacco. Moreover the smoke itself even without tobacco can be carcinogenic.

Brownies are one option, though they have a fairly short shelf life. Another option is to make cannabis butter which you can then add to food or spread on toast (the active compounds are fat soluble). The best option for homemade medicinal cannabis in my view is a tincture. You can dissolve cannabis in a 100% alcohol solution and then measure it out of a dropper bottle. This seems to me to be the easiest way to use it.

My dad knew a guy who had a friend with very severe ME. They sparked up a spliff one day and felt enormously better almost immediately. He went from completely bedridden to being able to help look after his kids, just so long as he kept on smoking. As soon as he stopped he would have a relapse. My understanding is the cannabis has some immunosuppressive qualities, so I wonder if that may be the reason behind his improvement.

Anyway, I won't be trying cannabis because of my previous addiction. By the end I was horrendously paranoid all the time but still a slave to it. We have good epidemiological evidence that there is an association between cannabis consumption and increased risk of schizophrenia too. The risk is probably reduced in older people, as psychosis is a young person's game.

 

[trishrhymes]

Thank you Cheesus for sharing your experiences. Your comments are very interesting.

I do hope one day there can be proper research on cannabis and ME, probably using Sativex or something similar, though the UK government is unlikely to allow it. Once again we in the UK will have to rely on more enlightened countries for the good ME research.

 

[flybro]

Wimpy in what respect? That you could get caught breaking the law or that you may get an unsafe product? I haven't actually made a purchase through any darknet market, just been browsing to see what's available.

"Lead me not into temptation" kind off way.

Also as crappy as they are I like "consumer protections/rights, accountability and quality control.

Re The dangers of pot:

If it had been legal all these years, market forces and medical research would have combined to reduce risks and improve variety access.

& yes the gene test, if it is a credible theory, would be beneficial, and would probably be widely available if pot hadn't been illegal.




Many different people have some very bad reactions to different types of alcohol. They can access numerous different types and find something that is ok for them.

Leaving the product in the hands of black markets, has many more dangerous health out-comes imo,

Really interesting thread.

 

[eastcoast12]

I really think in general cannabis has huge potential for a lot of medicinal reasons. Makers of fentanyl recently got caught donating big bucks to to anti-pot lobby. They know the benefits for pain relief. So many different neuro conditions benefit from use with the most notable example to ease the symptoms in a crazy form of epilepsy where people can have dozens of seizures a day. There's a great story (you can google it) of this little girl who had this and she would have I think about 100 seizures a day. They got wind of how cbd might help and gave it a try. Now the little girl is down to about 1-2 a day.
It can't hurt to try as long as your careful getting it and even still in many places it's decriminalized or a minor misdemeanor/fine.
If you do try it out, which I highly recommend, I think the following advice would be extremely helpful
As we all know ganja can give you the paranoids. They suck. Be prepared to reexamine every mistake you've ever made and try and figure out your purpose(for me anyway). If your gonna give it a shot take it sssslllllloooooow. Just a small toke and that's it until ur completely confortable then go to 2 etc.
uhh. eh eh. Dudes if you think about it... Like monkeys are natures humans. Far out man

 

[valentinelynx]

I really think in general cannabis has huge potential for a lot of medicinal reasons. Makers of fentanyl recently got caught donating big bucks to to anti-pot lobby.

I was annoyed by the reporting in the story you are talking about. Insys, the company that makes Subsys, a sublingual fentanyl preparation (that was a miracle drug for me until insurance refused to pay for it anymore), lobbied against legalization of marijuana in Arizona. The article I read (some are more accurate) made it sound like it was because pot competes with opioids. It completely neglected to point out that Insys is deeply invested in developing cannabis-based pharmaceuticals!

Not that I approve of them working against legalization of marijuana, but I think most people would be more understanding of why they did so if they were aware that Insys is trying to bring cannabis-related products to market!

 

[undiagnosed]

I was annoyed by the reporting in the story you are talking about. Insys, the company that makes Subsys, a sublingual fentanyl preparation (that was a miracle drug for me until insurance refused to pay for it anymore), lobbied against legalization of marijuana in Arizona. The article I read (some are more accurate) made it sound like it was because pot competes with opioids. It completely neglected to point out that Insys is deeply invested in developing cannabis-based pharmaceuticals!

Not that I approve of them working against legalization of marijuana, but I think most people would be more understanding of why they did so if they were aware that Insys is trying to bring cannabis-related products to market!

I don't find that rationale any more palatable, haha.

 

[valentinelynx]

I don't find that rationale any more palatable, haha.

Palatable, no. Understandable from a business perspective, yes. So long as there are things called stockholders, and the short-term economic viewpoint, business will be for business, not for social benefit. Capitalism, it is.

 

[eastcoast12]

well look where unregulated neoliberal/conservative (is there even a difference any more) capitalism has got us today.
Simple fact is if it was legalized people would have instant access to it.
Capitalism has run its course. The US is literally an oligarchy where corporations are considered people.
CNN interview with libertarian presidential hopeful Gary Johnson sums up what's wrong with this planet perfectly
GJ: I want to stop the sales of weapons to Saudi Arabia (you know for funding 9/11, Islamic extremism, killing 1,000s of there own citizens as well as killing 1000s of innocent people in Yemen which for some reason no one cares about)
CNN Wolf Blitzer: what about the jobs

Hey as long as we're making money fuck everything else. This world is truly fucked

This wasn't aimed at you valentinlynx. just frustrated. All I do is read since I got sick and I made the mistake of reading into how this country works. Maddening but this anti-pot lobbying is a great (even though small) example of how this country really works.

 

[Hell...Hath...No...Fury..]

@flybro thanks for the info on the medipen. Just ordered one

 

[Research 1st]

Hello there.

I don't feel I am at all intentionally or unintentionally stigmatizing cannabis users.

All I did was warn forum members that in some cases, people can become psychotic from use.I said this with the intention of protecting patients by making them aware there are risks of smoking it.

I also don't feel I intentionally or unintentionally stigmatize cannabis users, by linking to a blood test that may show if you have genes associated to Schizophrenia and I added the caveat I don't what the test result means.

So I'm rather confused what I've meant to have done wrong? Maybe someone else can help me understand as I'm completely lost.

 

[Snowdrop]

If we're talking about medicinal cannabis (high CBD low THC) than I think it actually is used to treat schizophrenia IIRC.

 

[flybro]

@flybro thanks for the info on the medipen. Just ordered one

Cheers, let us know how you find it.

 

[Firefly_]

I can't smoke regular weed, tried it after reading on this forum how it helped some people and all it did was put me into a not very fun stupor sort of state, and it also gives me crazy bad munchies, which would be great if I was underweight, but alas, that is not an issue for me.

OTOH, CBD oil has been GREAT to eliminate my daily severe muscle spasms, I use it in one of my ecig vaporizers every few days and it does the trick.

 

[invisiblejungle]

Wimpy in what respect? That you could get caught breaking the law or that you may get an unsafe product? I haven't actually made a purchase through any darknet market, just been browsing to see what's available.

Hi Undiagnosed,

What are your main sources of information for researching darknet markets? It's something I"m willing to try but have no idea how to go about doing it.

 

[undiagnosed]

Hi Undiagnosed,

What are your main sources of information for researching darknet markets? It's something I"m willing to try but have no idea how to go about doing it.

As far as just seeing what's out there, I downloaded Tor and used the Grams search engine (Grams link will only open in Tor browser). Results will be shown for products in the different darknet markets. However, in order to view details, you'll need to setup an account for the particular market. There is somewhat of a learning curve if you want to actually buy anything.

 

[Mrs Sowester]

Article in today's Guardian:
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2016/sep/19/can-cannabis-relieve-pain-medical-marijuana

I've never noticed any effect on pain personally, has anyone here?

 

[flybro]

Article in today's Guardian:
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2016/sep/19/can-cannabis-relieve-pain-medical-marijuana

I've never noticed any effect on pain personally, has anyone here?

th
Yes, very much, but not the same as tramadol. Pot helps relax muscles, a bit like being in a warm bath, sounds daft but it enables you to stretch.

 

[Mrs Sowester]

Maybe I don't have the sort of pain it helps with, or maybe I don't feel that pain because of the brownies!

 

[flybro]

I wish they could do a study on the different types of pot and delivery methods. The different methods seem to make for quite different experiences.

Nice brownie with a cup of tea sounds good.