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Acetyl L- Glutathione, ATP, Baking Soda, Sam-e & Catalase = No PEM after exercise

Discussion in 'Post-Exertional Malaise, Fatigue, and Crashes' started by Mya Symons, Dec 17, 2014.

  1. drob31

    drob31 Senior Member

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    Any news?
     
  2. Mya Symons

    Mya Symons Mya Symons

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    Yes, I don't have diabetes. My TSH is very low, however, and I'm taking the same amount of synthroid I have been taking for years. For the last 3 years my TSH has been between 1 and 2 and now it is almost 0. It has never been this low. It has always slowly gone up and I've had to increase my synthroid every few years. The doctor wants me to get a thyroid ultrasound. The nerve pain in the feet seems to be subsiding however. That's good news!
     
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  3. drob31

    drob31 Senior Member

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    What I'm learning is that the adrenal glands and thyroid, or at least inconsistent levels of the hormones they supply can cause dysglycemia, which makes it seem like you have blood sugar issues. I think I'm putting allot of peices together, i'll start a new thread with my theory, but I'm borrowing part of what Dr. Kharazzian has concluded.

    Is your synthroid for a deficiency caused by hashimoto's? Also, I would wonder how well your t4 is converting to t3, as adrenal issues and blood sugar issues have a huge impact on that.
     
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  4. Mya Symons

    Mya Symons Mya Symons

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    Yes, I have Hashimoto's. Unfortunately, I can't find a doctor who cares about t4 converting to t3. They only worry about TSH. I think this new doctor I am seeing is finally noticing that the synthroid is not stopping the Hashimoto's antibodies. This is a nice change from many doctors who are in denial that synthroid doesn't always solve all thyroid problems. I think I will ask her about the t4/t3 conversion test. Maybe she's different.

    Thanks for the information.
     
  5. drob31

    drob31 Senior Member

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    Since you know it's an autoimmune attack, I would first treat it from an autoimmune perspective:

    Autoimmune paleo diet (most important): http://www.phoenixhelix.com/paleo-autoimmune-protocol/
    Fish Oil + Tumeric + Resveratrol + Vitamin D
    Sunlight as much as possible to reinforce Vitamin D
    Focus on gut: probiotics (primal defense), glutamine, (AIP diet above),
    Read this: http://www.amazon.com/Still-Thyroid-Symptoms-Tests-Normal/dp/0985690402

    If that doesn't cut it, then if you use t3 or slow release t3. I know it works for some with hashimoto's. At a high enough dose you will supress TSH, and the activity of the gland, and I know allot have lowered their anitbodies this way.
     
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  6. drob31

    drob31 Senior Member

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    Since you know it's an autoimmune attack, I would first treat it from an autoimmune perspective:

    Autoimmune paleo diet (most important): http://www.phoenixhelix.com/paleo-autoimmune-protocol/
    Fish Oil + Tumeric + Resveratrol + Vitamin D
    Sunlight as much as possible to reinforce Vitamin D
    Focus on gut: probiotics (primal defense), glutamine, (AIP diet above),
    Read this: http://www.amazon.com/Still-Thyroid-Symptoms-Tests-Normal/dp/0985690402

    If that doesn't cut it, then if you use t3 or slow release t3. I know it works for some with hashimoto's. At a high enough dose you will supress TSH, and the activity of the gland, and I know allot have lowered their anitbodies this way.

    The adrenal glands complicates it because if there is dysglycemia or hpa-axis dysfunction, you can't proceed with the t3 until that is resolved.
     
  7. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    I have seen 4 or 5 endocrinologists since 2011. Last year I finally found one who thought it was a good idea to put me on hormone replacement despite "low" TSH of 4. He said that my high antibodies were causing too much inflammation and that HR would help with that. Then he prescribed me levothyroxine. One week later I had to run to a psychiatrist who put me on citalopram.

    My antibodies decreased slightly, and TSH decreased to 2. The endo was very statisfied, and said that my constant low BP (90/60) was just excellent, and ignored other complaints of mine.

    I finally found an integrative dr who put me on compounded T4/T3. Even so, my reverse T3 has been pretty high (the integrative dr checks for it!), and after increasing the T3 replacement I had to titrate the citalopram down very quickly and quit it. BP is now 11/7 and antibodies are going down more quickly, head is much more clear :thumbsup:

    We tried increasing the T3 again, but it didn't work out. I still have a need for something else, and am going to look into pregnenolone next. I take a homeopathy that gives me a light adrenal support, so I will try to improve something on that direction.

    What makes it harder is the fact that blood tests don't accurately match the symptoms. I guess I will have to chart my body temperature after all to know what I really need.
     
  8. drob31

    drob31 Senior Member

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    How does your cortisol look? Ever consider cortef?
     
  9. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    It is highish to very high in the morning after a bad night's sleep.

    When I upped my T3 again I started biting very hard the insides of my mouth at bed time, then backed off.
     
  10. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    I am suspecting that tyramine plays some role in inflammation for MAO-Aers.
     
  11. drob31

    drob31 Senior Member

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    Same here, except I have no antibodies. My cortisol was lowish, then started t3, was still low, then at some point t3 caused it to become high.

    I'm about to do a 6x cortisol saliva test. Had my doc write a labcorp script for cortisol saliva test every 4 hours for 24 hours. I'll be super curious to see what the 4 AM sample says. I've never had one from that time before.
     
  12. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    I don't think I need to test that one - high for sure
     
  13. MeSci

    MeSci ME/CFS since 1995; activity level 6?

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    Do you mean the insides of your cheeks, because the skin seems to be loose? I am getting that at the moment but am not taking anything different from usual, and don't take any thyroid meds.
     
  14. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    I have what you are describing sometimes and to me it is when I have too much salicylates, then the mucosa inside my cheeks and mouth gets swollen (allergic reaction). That is why I avoid tooth paste and use CaCO3 and MgO with water to brush my teeth.

    What I meant as related to too much T3 was that just before falling asleep I get a sudden muscle contraction in my jaw and it will close very tightly, painfully biting my mouth lining and making a noise when the lower teeth meet the upper teeth :confused:
     
  15. MeSci

    MeSci ME/CFS since 1995; activity level 6?

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    I see. I sometimes get that too but not for some time, and not usually at night - it could happen at any time. I haven't eaten different foods from usual, so it can't be that causing my current problem, but it's not as bad as it was - not really a problem now.
     
  16. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    The mouth swelling isn't specifically at night, on the contrary. It apparently happens randomly, but I suspect it is when something allergy-wise builds up, be it too much of a certain food or a slower Phenolsulfotransferase function (details in my salicylate link). Coconut oil pulling makes for a big time swelling, so it's no-no.
     
  17. Gondwanaland

    Gondwanaland Senior Member

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    :bulb:
    It might be related with our own hormone cycle. When there is more endogenous hormone to be broken down (estrogen, progesterone etc) perhaps added to a plant hormone overload (salicylates etc) which are broken down thru the same liver pathway.
     
  18. Mya Symons

    Mya Symons Mya Symons

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    Drob, thanks again for the information. I take most of these supplements through the Pall Protocol. I can't take curcumin or Tumeric, however, because it boosts my Sjogren's antibodies. I think it strengthens my immune system too much. I would love to find a doctor willing to prescribe T3 (Cytomel), but, unfortunately, I live in Wyoming. The doctor choices here are limited.

    If anyone knows of a doctor who prescribes T3 in Colorado, I would be willing to travel.
     
  19. Mya Symons

    Mya Symons Mya Symons

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    I don't know what it is with hormones, but they always cause me a severe crash. And, everytime I try a hormone replacement I get cysts on my ovaries and breasts. I found that DIM (Diindolylmethane) works well. It's supposed to modulate the bad estrogen into a better form of estrogen. For me, it helps prevent the bad Fibromyalgia crashes right before and during the first days of the menstrual cycle (or what would be my menstrual cycle before the hysterectomy.)

    My new doctor also told me that I have a lot of inflammation going on because of the Hashimoto's antibodies. She said it was the reason for my chronic elevated C-Reactive protein. This is the first time I have heard this. All the other doctors I have seen said it was unknown why I had the inflammation. It baffles me that so many doctors treat Hashimoto's disease like it is nothing.
     
  20. drob31

    drob31 Senior Member

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    http://www.thyroid-info.com/topdrs/colorado.htm

    Also:

    These are all patient recommended doctors:

    http://www.thyroidchange.org/patient-recommended-doctor-list-us.html


    Jonathan Singer, DO Osteopathic Doctor 1401 Airport Pkwy Ste 150 Cheyenne Wyoming (307) 635-4363

    Steven Henke Naturopathic Doctor 1304 S. College Ave., Suite No. 5 Fort Collins Colorado (970) 482-0549

    Jacob Schor, ND Naturopathic Doctor 1181 South Parker Rd, Ste 101 Denver Colorado (303) 337-4884

    George Juetersonke, DO Osteopathic Doctor 3525 American Drive Colorado Springs Colorado (719) 597-6075

    Jacques Saari, MD Integrative Doctor 9695 S. Yosemite St., Ste 385 Lone Tree Colorado (303) 706-9192


    Beyond that, there are ways. People don't need to needlessly suffer. There are online pharmacies that you can order t3 from if it comes down to it. Obviously I'm not advocating that approach and only suggesting it as a last ditch effort if you can't get it.
     

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