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For those who attend the UK's Fatigue Clinics: what your therapist is told/believes

Countrygirl

Senior Member
Messages
5,452
Location
UK
http://www.wolfson.qmul.ac.uk/images/pdfs/3.cbt-therapist-manual.pdf

http://www.wolfson.qmul.ac.uk/images/pdfs/5.get-therapist-manual.pdf

Should you attend a UK fatigue clinic this is what your therapist is told about your disease and recommended treatment.


Essence of CBT for ME

The essence of CBT is helping the participant to change their interpretation of symptoms and associated fear, symptom focussing and avoidance. Participants are encouraged to see symptoms as temporary and reversible and not as signs of harm or evidence of fixed disease pathology. In this way it is anticipated that they will gain more control of their lives, as they, and not their symptoms, dictate what they do.

Aim

The aim of this treatment is to change the behavioural and cognitive factors, which are assumed to be partially responsible for perpetuating the participant’s symptoms and disability, and to help the participants to develop strategies for dealing with other factors, physical, emotional, social or financial, that may also be impacting on their illness.


What factors perpetuate CFS/ME?

Just as there are many factors involved in triggering CFS/ME, there are also many factors that are involved in sustaining it. According to this model, the symptoms and disability of CFS/ME are perpetuated predominantly by unhelpful illness beliefs (fears) and coping behaviours (avoidance). These beliefs and behaviours interact with the participant’s emotional and physiological state and interpersonal situation to form self perpetuating vicious circles of fatigue and disability. Although it is acknowledged that lack of physical fitness may play a part in exercise induced symptom production, physical fitness is not central to this conceptualisation of the syndrome.

Fear about activity making the illness worse

People with CFS/ME commonly experience increased pain or fatigue after any activity and this may naturally be read as a sign of doing harm. These thoughts can then lead to safety behaviours e.g., avoiding activities and resting for too long. Resting for long periods can impede recovery by reducing activity tolerance and reducing fitness.

Avoidance of activities

People with CFS/ME may start to avoid activities for fear of making their symptoms worse. However, stopping doing things on a regular basis can lead to a loss of confidence in being able to do them. For example, they may have stopped socializing with particular friends, managing their home, doing exercise etc; resuming these activities may provoke fear and lead to further avoidance.



Fear of symptoms and consequent avoidance of activity

© Trial Management Group: CBT Therapists Manual Page 13 of 162 MREC version 2.1 – 08 December 2004 ISRCTN54285094 associated with symptoms is central. This model also acknowledges that the participant’s beliefs and behaviours are influenced by available information and attitudes of families and friends and that these may also need to be addressed. The model assumes that physiological (fatigue), cognitive (fear of engaging in activity) and behavioural responses (avoidance of activity), are linked. Therefore by modifying one response it is anticipated that changes occur in the other responses. For example, increasing activity (behaviour) may gradually reduce the fear (cognitions) that activity leads to worsening of symptoms.


GET assumes that CFS/ME is perpetuated by deconditioning (lack of fitness), reduced physical strength and altered perception of effort consequent upon reduced physical activity. A normal process of adaptive change in the body is assumed to occur as a consequence of rest or a reduction in physical functioning, i.e. weakening of muscles, reduction in fitness, ('use it or lose it') and altered perception of effort. Activity can then produce symptoms as a result of these negative changes, as the body is attempting a physical activity beyond its current capacity. These changes are thought to be reversible, and thus improving fitness and physical functioning will alter perception of effort, enable the body to gain fitness and strength, leading to a reduction in symptoms and an increase in activity capacity ('use it and gain it').

Preliminary research suggests that reduced symptoms arise from simply doing a GET programme, rather than necessarily getting fitter, whereas improved function is related to getting fitter and stronger. Participants are encouraged to see symptoms as temporary and reversible, as a result of their current physical weakness, and not as signs of progressive pathology. A mild and transient increase in symptoms is explained as a normal response to an increase in physical activity.


The more severely disabled group of CFS/ME patients were excluded from previous studies as the studies involved an exercise test that may have been too challenging. However due to greater levels of inactivity in the more severely disabled group, the deconditioning model should apply equally if not more to these patients.


Section on how to deceive your patient. (My wording……but their intention)

It is therefore very important that you convey warmth and empathy at your first meeting. The assessment provides a wonderful opportunity for participants to tell their story. Often it is the first time that they will have been able to go into detail about their problems. Allowing participants to elaborate on their illness often gives them the feeling that their illness is being taken seriously, often for the first time. Acknowledging the difficulties they have encountered along the way in terms of their illness, whether related to its impact on their life or response from other health professionals, etc., is important. Throughout your treatment sessions, it will be important that you continue to show warmth and empathise with your participant. There is no doubt that getting people to change previous routines can be difficult in a number of ways. The participant may be very fearful of changing the way they do things, fearing worsening of the symptoms. They may find that their symptoms initially worsen when starting their GET programme. Acknowledging the challenges associated with the programme is important if you are to win their trust.


Sensitivity

Participants may not have had their illness taken seriously by previous professionals and may be concerned that you will be no different. They may think that you will be another “professional” who will tell them “to pull themselves together” etc. Participants may feel sensitive about the use of particular words, such as asking them how often they feel tired which can provoke anger in someone who differentiates strongly between the word fatigue and tiredness. Although you cannot forever be thinking about whether or not you are going to offend them, it is worthwhile listening to and trying to use language that is not going to be alienating. In general, it is best to use the language that the participant does to describe their symptoms.

Collaboration

Collaboration is an essential skill in working with people with CFS/ME. Up to the point of meeting you, many participants will not have been included in the management of their illness. They may not have been asked their opinion about what is wrong with them and may feel rather helpless and out of control. Collaborating throughout treatment will help participants to feel more involved in their treatment and will help them to regain some sense of control.

You will be demonstrating a collaborative style at your first meeting when you individualise the GET model to their illness. By this we mean drawing a model together, examining factors they think have been responsible for triggering as well as maintaining the illness. Agreeing an agenda for each treatment session, asking for their input in making suggestions for their activity programme and evaluating previous sessions will help participants to feel valued and included in the treatment process.

Positive reinforcement

It is essential that you demonstrate positive reinforcement when you work with people with CFS/ME. Often, they will be very good at pointing out what they haven’t achieved. It is therefore important that you emphasise and are very positive about what they have achieved. Every session you should positively reinforce all of their achievements, however small they may seem, whether it is managing to walk for a minute longer than the previous session, read for 5 minutes longer or get up 5 minutes earlier. Establishing confidence in you as a therapist

Establishing the participant’s confidence in you as a therapist is important. This is likely to occur if you utilise the skills in the sections listed above. One cautionary note, if you do not know the answer to a question, you are more likely to be respected for saying that you don’t know the answer, rather than trying to answer it in a muddled way.


Aim

The aim of this treatment is to change the behavioural and cognitive factors, which are assumed to be partially responsible for perpetuating the participant’s symptoms and disability, and to help the participants to develop strategies for dealing with other factors, physical, emotional, social or financial, that may also be impacting on their illness.

Absolutely no one with ME is safe in the 'care' of people with such views of this illness. These clinics that perpetuate the above myths do need to be boycotted.
 

Countrygirl

Senior Member
Messages
5,452
Location
UK
Why do patients go to these clinics? Are they somehow forced in order to keep getting disability benefits?

Yes, @hixxy . After 40 years, I am now being forced to attend against my will on account of a well-known PACE proponent and researcher phoning my surgery, speaking to my GP, and persuading them that ME is psychological. It is not always possible to refuse as there are threats to withdraw one's continued care if you fail to co-operate, even though in theory that should not happen.
 

A.B.

Senior Member
Messages
3,780
Just as there are many factors involved in triggering CFS/ME, there are also many factors that are involved in sustaining it. According to this model, the symptoms and disability of CFS/ME are perpetuated predominantly by unhelpful illness beliefs (fears) and coping behaviours (avoidance). These beliefs and behaviours interact with the participant’s emotional and physiological state and interpersonal situation to form self perpetuating vicious circles of fatigue and disability. Although it is acknowledged that lack of physical fitness may play a part in exercise induced symptom production, physical fitness is not central to this conceptualisation of the syndrome.

It's a nice trick they are using. They make up a model, and then skip the testing step, and just talk as if it was a useful model. Everyone will assume that it has been tested and found to be correct. It certainly is a useful model, if your goal is to promote these therapies. In reality they are constantly disproving their own model with their own studies.

For example in PACE and other studies one could see that a change in beliefs didn't correlate with improved performance on the walking distance test, the step tests, employment, daily step counts. Patients appear to have adopted "helpful beliefs" and appear to believe their health has improved but there is no change in disability (assuming the responses reflect at least partially genuine change in cognition, and not entirely response bias).
 
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Molly98

Senior Member
Messages
576
They say Assume rather a lot of times, oh, wait a minute is that because they have to assume and guess because it's just an idea they floated from the sky and there is no evidence for what so ever.

Don't any of the therapist have the brains to ask why they are assuming everything about these patients.

What a crock of shit.

Utter Bollocks of the highest order
 

Cheshire

Senior Member
Messages
1,129
Just came across this video.

They keep repeating EBM like a mantra...


They are so eager to say to patients that their condition is not psychological that their explanations are totally illogical:

10:52 "patients should know that there are well acceptable psychological treatments although that this does not mean at all that there is a psychological cause for their complaints."
12:00 "I would change the ? between physical and mental health. Let's forget about that."

Fed up of this hypocritical nonsense. A psychological treatment is for psychological issues. Period. That's not dismissing psychiatric patients to say so, that's adapting treatment to causes.
They act as if the cause of diseases didn't matter. Would such a speech be acceptable for cancer patients? This is insane.


"The second thing we've got to do is to recognise that this is a very very big area, it's expensive, it causes a huge amount of suffering and destress and disability."
Yeah, sure. Start advocating for equality of social rights between "psychiatric" and "organic" patients first.
 

Sean

Senior Member
Messages
7,378
The aim of this treatment is to change the behavioural and cognitive factors, which are assumed to be partially responsible for perpetuating the participant’s symptoms and disability,...
Stopped there. Know what is coming. Heard it all before, for thirty years.

Life is too short to be re-reading this same old gutless fraudulent drivel yet again.

To our UK friends: Keep copies of this stuff, with date-time stamps, so it cannot be conveniently disappeared from the record, and can be dragged up in evidence when the accountability phase arrives, which is getting closer and closer.
 

Invisible Woman

Senior Member
Messages
1,267
Well, as I have pointed out numerous times to medics over the years:

When I was a kid I played sports. Most sports have a "season". So there would be a period when you started up the new season when you had to get fit for that sport all over again. Yes, sometimes that hurt, made you tired etc.

BUT: as a person who has ME I can categorically tell you that ME PEM and pain/tiredness/discomfort caused be becoming fit are two entirely different things. They feel entirely different because they ARE entirely different.

Treating PEM in the same way as treating the side effects of becoming match fit again doesn't work. I know. I tried it. I tried various variations of it.

On my own in a room with a "therapist" only one of us has experience of both and therefore is the expert. That would be me not the "therapist".
 

Invisible Woman

Senior Member
Messages
1,267
Why do patients go to these clinics? Are they somehow forced in order to keep getting disability benefits?

Many of the newly diagnosed don't know any better and are desperate for answers.

(In) Action for ME is the charity many newly diagnosed are pointed towards and they gave colluded in this type of cr@p over the years.

Many newly diagnosed patients will be stunned with diagnosis and may be thinking but that can't be right as I'm really I'll. They'll bend over backwards to prove they are not either lacking in moral fibre nor are they malingerers. They'll do themselves a lot of harm in the process. Then they will be dubbed malingerers / weak anyway.

:mad::bang-head:
 
Messages
9
If I may put a different slant on this topic. Whilst I totally agree with all the members above comments, I think there is some positives to be taken from these clinics.

After having a serious relapse around 7 years ago my doctor suggested I could attend a clinic that ran one afternoon a week for about 8 weeks. Bewildered by the catastrophic change in my health I pushed myself to attend. What it did give me was more of an insight into the illness and suggested ways of coping with it. Meeting other people on the course who were in the same boat so I did not feel so isolated. It got me out of the house with some effort.

I guess the downside is that once the course had finished, that's it, back to square one and totally forgotten about again. Also I am sitting on my bed in the middle of the day, 6 years on, no recovery, hey ho. Apologies if have veered off topic. The advice the clinic gave was I am sure well intentioned and the lady had had ME to some degree as well and was not completely recovered.
 

unicorn7

Senior Member
Messages
180
I am pretty shocked to read this actually, I have heard it all:eek:

Especially the positive reinforcement drove me mad. At the time I had a rehabilitation program, I was very convinced to be very honest about my problems. It's in my nature to make myself look better and healthier than I am and my boyfriend and parents urged me to really get the point across that something was not normal.

When the physiotherapist asked me how I was and I said every week it was still the same, she would always try to turn my words around and say that I was better:confused:
She would comment on that my muscles felt better to her (not to me...). When I told her I felt absolutely horrible ill, she would say that I did something extra (walked for an extra minute or whatever), so that was still progress!!:balloons:
I felt like I was some sort of crazy toddler.

Suddenly after a few sessions, she told me the rehabilitation was done. I thought we had hardly even started yet. I had a talk with the overseeing rehabilitation docter and she was very nice. As soon as I said I was very disappointed in the whole process, she turned completely around, said I was't positive enough and basically it was all my own fault for not trying hard enough.

Why do patients go to these clinics? Are they somehow forced in order to keep getting disability benefits?

I didn't know at the time. I didn't go to a specific clinic, I went to a rehabilitation-centre at the hospital, because the neurologist couldn't find anything. I think they put a CFS label on me, but they didn't tell me. I thought I had a burn-out that wouldn't go away. It seemed like a good idea to try and build myself up again through exercises, physiotherapy at the time. I didn't know anything about CFS or ME at the time.
 

NelliePledge

Senior Member
Messages
807
I went as I still work part time and if you're off sick getting paid your employer right expects you to take available treatment and not their fault this flawed approach is what you get from the NHS. The programme was 8 sessions on different topics. They did "educate" people about "CFS/ME" having bio psych and social elements all very high level. Activity management and relaxation were big elements there was encouragement to increase/vary activity within own limits and priorities but no way they could actually check people were increasing anything. I made it clear that as someone living on my own it simply wasn't feasible to spend my energy on exercise for the sake of it and to be fair I wasn't pressured. So it was BPS lite. That hospital clinic has closed now and the service is through generic pain or fatigue service in community under IAPT/MUS no idea what their approach is.
 

Sean

Senior Member
Messages
7,378
When the physiotherapist asked me how I was and I said every week it was still the same, she would always try to turn my words around and say that I was better:confused:
She would comment on that my muscles felt better to her (not to me...). When I told her I felt absolutely horrible ill, she would say that I did something extra (walked for an extra minute or whatever), so that was still progress!!:balloons:
I felt like I was some sort of crazy toddler.

Suddenly after a few sessions, she told me the rehabilitation was done. I thought we had hardly even started yet. I had a talk with the overseeing rehabilitation docter and she was very nice. As soon as I said I was very disappointed in the whole process, she turned completely around, said I was't positive enough and basically it was all my own fault for not trying hard enough.
Gaslighting. Standard tactic for psychopaths.
 

Sean

Senior Member
Messages
7,378
Maybe they're just misinformed. They have been told that science has proven patients can get better and even recover by following these steps.
I'm not that generous to them anymore. It would take a pretty thick or dishonest human being not to see the problem with the way @unicorn7 was treated. Gaslighting, double-bind rhetoric, extortion, and intimidation have always been unacceptable.
 
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TiredSam

The wise nematode hibernates
Messages
2,677
Location
Germany
When I had my first symptoms of M.E., I waited a few weeks until I felt better again, then tried to build up again slowly. Quite a few times in the first year. Didn't we all? It didn't work. It made me worse every time.

So why would doing it under the supervision of the psycho social club make any difference? And when hundreds of thousands of sufferers say "tried that, didn't work", what kind of arrogance does it take to ignore that feedback from the patients and plough on with the same shit regardless? And to have no interest whatever in investigating what else could be going on?

Arseholes.