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I took NADH a long time ago and it had no effect on me.
How much Nadh did you take and for how long?? Thanks
PQQ is actually an essential nutrient.
but I did not notice any benefit for ME/CFS.
This is from a textbook from the 1940s or 50s about if PABA meets the criteria of a vitamin/essential nutrient (which it does) but apply it to PQQ
any of a group of organic compounds which are essential for normal growth and nutrition and are required in small quantities in the diet because they cannot be synthesized by the body.
The scientific journal Nature published the 2003 paper by Kasahara and Kato that essentially stated that PQQ was a new vitamin and in 2005, an article by Anthony and Fenton that stated that the 2003 Kasahara and Kato paper drew incorrect and unsubstantiated conclusions.
Although mammalian synthesis is not certain, PQQ does occur normally in the mammalian body[23] and approxiamtely 100-400 nanograms of PQQ are thought to be made in humans each day;[3][24] leading some authors to claim an estimated tissue concentration of approximately 0.8−5.9ng/g in humans.
However, there are no reports that eukaryotic cells can synthesize PQQ. If mammalian cells cannot synthesize PQQ, two origins of it can be considered: production of PQQ by enteric bacteria and/or dietary origin. In the present study, we have been able to detect PQQ in every food (Table 1); its levels are 5-10 times higher than those obtained in human tissues or body fluids [14]. Thus, it is probable that PQQ existing in human tissues is derived from the diet, at least partly.
Nowhere in those three studies cited (3,23,24) by examine.com for the claim the body makes it's own PQQ is there any such claim.
Do you know of a study thats says our cells can make PQQ?
Although PQQ is not biosynthesized in mammals, trace amounts of PQQ have been found in human and rat tissues because of its wide distribution in dietary sources. Importantly, nutritional studies in rodents have revealed that PQQ deficiency exhibits diverse systemic responses, including growth impairment, immune dysfunction, and abnormal reproductive performance. Although PQQ is not currently classified as a vitamin, PQQ has been implicated as an important nutrient in mammals.
Just leave them on a PQQ deficient diet, and they will die, same with a diet 100% absent of any other b vitamin.
Another study showed the rats on a PQQ deficient diet had 20-30% less liver mitochondria when examined after they killed them. Sooooo it is a unique vitamin, and needed for mitochondrial renewal.
If I was in charge of classifying things I would of classified it as essential nutrient as soon as it was shown a deficiency state can be exhibited in rats.
Do you have any evidence to back up this statement?
It's not a vitamin unless the animal dies without it. The "vita" in vitamin is Latin for "life", indicating that vitamins are essential for life.
I suspect if you were in charge of things, you'd cease production of antibiotics and vaccines, as according to your previous post, you believe pathogens cannot cause death nor long-term disease in well-nourished individuals, which is the craziest idea I've ever heard.
Unsupported statements like this do not make for a good discussion. Without quoting sources, there is no basis for discussion.Other studies show cancer patients are low in b6. So give those patients as much anti biotics or chemotherapy as one wants, and they will only get sicker- never better. Give them a bowl of rice bran cereal each day- which is high in b6- or another good food source of b6, and they would get better assuming there was not also a deficiency of a vitamin that is not in rice bran like c, b12, ADEK.
That complete essential nutrient deficiencies ultimately result in death in rodents/man?
Give them a bowl of rice bran cereal each day- which is high in b6- or another good food source of b6, and they would get better assuming there was not also a deficiency of a vitamin that is not in rice bran like c, b12, ADEK.