Judy Mikovits has been arrested

[taniaaust1]

WOW you are quick to assume a lot! This whole story has more holes than an antique bucket, and most people on this thread (with a few honourable exceptions) and Cort himself have basically presided over your own kangaroo court!

Angela.. I (and Im sure there are others here too) would love to hear of the "holes" in the whole saga. I just pointed one out at PR in another thread on this (I noticed that Max contradicts himself in his affidavits over what he did with what he stole). But that is the only hole ive seen so far so if there are others which can be proven and shown.. please share.

 

[leela]

Well there are others, but the easiest one to write before I go off to bed (drooling now) is that as far as I can see (did I mention the drooling?) only in affadavit #2, taken the day before JMs hearing, does he allege she asked him to gather info regarding Dan Peterson.

 

[Undisclosed]

As it stands, Judy is out of jail, due to reappear on Dec 19th for an extradition hearing to Nevada. David Nolde (Judy's husband) has stated they are in negotiations. That could be for all sorts of reasons. As far as the affadavits go. Affadavits are legal documents and lying on them is a crime of some sorts. People are questioning the veracity of Max Pfosts statements. By making these statements he has opened himself up to criminal charges too as he admitted he took things from the WPI without permission. Even though the affadavits do appear to have some discrepancies which in itself does not make them null and void, the information given can indeed be used to prove or disprove the veracity of the statements. Electronic trails of cell phone messages can be followed. Car rental information can easily be found. IP addresses on email addresses can easily be revealed. So the veracity of this information in the affadavit no doubt will be checked upon by both parties.

I don't think the term "kangaroo court" is really applicable to this thread. Most people seem to be making statements based on legal documents. The whole story is still not known. We will learn more in the future. Judy Mikovits has had not a chance to answer to what Max Pfost has said. If the Whittemores are in negotiation with Judy Mikovits, this seems that they are willing to solve this matter as fast as possible. I really hope they do.

 

[Tristen]

Well there are others, but the easiest one to write before I go off to bed (drooling now) is that as far as I can see (did I mention the drooling?) only in affadavit #2, taken the day before JMs hearing, does he allege she asked him to gather info regarding Dan Peterson.

It was with Dr P's prudent decision to abort wpi, that I began to see the writing on the wall. That together with all that has transpired since leaves me unsurprised by current events. Still, I do hope that truth and what's best for everyone involved will prevail through this tumultuous time.

 

[Enid]

"I really hope they do" too Kina. (Your post 177).

 

[Vitalic]

I have trouble viewing this sort of IP (intellectual property) theft as a "bad thing". In most IP employee vs employer cases, people do something illegal or in breach of their contract for emotional reasons. The work they have done is their baby, and they have often spent years nurturing it, but there's a piece of paper somewhere saying that it belongs to guy that doesn't even love it, just because he paid for it.

If the allegations are true, then she did the wrong thing, and the stupid thing, but I wouldn't equate such an action to doing a morally bad thing.

It could be argued that the theft itself is morally forgivable due to the emotional attachment, but the divides created in the patient communities and the damage to the whole research endeavor will be immeasurable and for that I don't think she can be forgiven, despite all her prior efforts and research. The problem is you have a lot of people in this community with a religious mentality who built her up as some kind of messiah, and now the walls have come crumbling down they can't quite accept the obvious truth staring them point blank in the face.

 

[santi]

Preliminary injuction:

http://www.wpinstitute.org/docs/ReplyBriefISOMotionforPreliminaryInjunction-final.pdf

 

[Cort]

WOW you are quick to assume a lot! This whole story has more holes than an antique bucket, and most people on this thread (with a few honourable exceptions) and Cort himself have basically presided over your own kangaroo court!

Cort uses 'confesses' rather than 'alleges' which would have been the correct term. Legal 'evidence' - exhibits! - are put out in public that will prejudice juries in advance (which in the UK at least should make them inadmissable!). Various of you are talking as if she is guilty and speculating as to motive (assigning her a 'tiger mom' status now some of you!)

Various other discrepancies are being uncovered. But HERE - we have the kangaroo court - courtesy of Cort himself and 'PR', the forum you (and I, for my sins) are supposed to be part of.

Seeing the lack of critical faculties here (again with a few honourable exceptions) and this behaviour, I have no option but to leave PR. This place has become a stomping ground for trolls anyway, committed to shutting the door on HGRV research, and spreading misinformation and demoralisation with impunity.

Moderator - that was supposed to be Mark, but I can see Kurt waiting in the wings. Get me out of here. I cannot abide while this forum makes an exhibition of itself. This is NOT my forum. I have to say - NOT IN MY NAME.

Confesses was the term used in the affadavit - that is why I used it. Pfost 'confessed' to having taken and then hidden the documents at Dr. Mikovits request.

 

[maryb]

Eh ecoclimber you're all heart!! you missed this bit out

'Emmett Littleton, a deacon at her church.
His wife, Sherelyn, visited Mikovits in jail yesterday and told the story of her trying to help another inmate make bail so she would not miss work today. "Judy is all heart," Sherelyn said. "Her whole interest is in helping patients, and everything that she has done is for that end."

 

[Mathilde]

Hope she's going to put lots of effort into helping Max with his employment too - his career is likely to be in a world of trouble now.

 

[liquid sky]

What happened to the information about cells that Annette wanted to divert from a government study to another researcher who was not legally allowed to have them? There is a lot more to his story than notebooks and a laptop computer. I do hope somehow Judy gets to continue her research.

I know it's mostly one way story on here, but there is always two sides to a story.

 

[leela]

Yes, highly interesting that the cell lines were supposedly shipped to Lombardi instead of JM.
After she was fired. For not agreeing to turn them over to him.

 

[santi]

What happened to the information about cells that Annette wanted to divert from a government study to another researcher who was not legally allowed to have them? There is a lot more to his story than notebooks and a laptop computer. I do hope somehow Judy gets to continue her research.

I know it's mostly one way story on here, but there is always two sides to a story.

Do you mean that Lombardi wasn't allowed to have the cells?

 

[jenbooks]

Do you mean that Lombardi wasn't allowed to have the cells?

Right. Judy was research director and for whatever reasons, research priorities, wanting to work on it herself, or numerous other possible reasons, did not want Lombardi do to the specific research he wanted to on those cell lines. At that point since Annette was not research director, she really didn't have the right to demand that, unless she wanted to fire or demote Judy (my understanding anyway).

However, assuming Max Pfost's sworn affadavit is true, Judy has colluded in stealing, lying etc, and has influenced Max, who has really blown up his own career. I feel sorrier for Max, as he won't likely be able to repair the damage he has done to his own career.

 

[Undisclosed]

I just looked up information regarding cell lines from Japan. A researcher has to fill out a form stating they will not give the cell lines to 3rd parties, acknowledge the person who developed the cell lines, that they will not use the cell lines for unethical research etc. I don't see, if Lombardi ordered the cell lines from Japan, how Judy Mikovits could tell him he couldn't use them. If they came from Japan, then she had no ownership over them.

According to Max Pfost, he says the package arrived from Japan addressed to Lombardi and he opened it and called Mikovits. She told Pfost that she would look after it. Later she got fired. It seems it was over this issue. Mikovits has stated that Lombardi couldn't have the cell lines because it would be "unethical". This is where there is information missing. If Mikovits was using the same cell lines for her research, why was Lombardi not allowed to order the same cell lines from a third party company and use them for whatever he was researching or looking into. I don't really understand why the use of cell lines from Japan would have been unethical and Judy never really explained this.

I suppose this is more information we won't know until more information is released.

 

[liquid sky]

There was mention of the cells being used for the NIH grants and Lombardi was not cleared to use them otherwise. I'm sure it will all come out in the wash. not

 

[joshualevy]

Do you mean that Lombardi wasn't allowed to have the cells?

Just to state the obvious: Lombardi was the first author of the original XMRV study. Why wouldn't he be allowed to have the cells? He was part of the research team, even if his "full time" job was over at the clinic.

Joshua (not Jay) Levy

 

[liquid sky]

Judy's lawyer has said that he was going to use the cells for other purposes than the NIH grant and these cells were paid for by the NIH grant and not deemed for other research. An ethical problem.

 

[joshualevy]

Judy's lawyer has said that he was going to use the cells for other purposes than the NIH grant and these cells were paid for by the NIH grant and not deemed for other research. An ethical problem.

I'm sure her lawyer said that.......
After all, a lawyer is paid to do whatever is in their client's best interest.
Now why someone would believe it, that's a mystery.

Joshua (not Jay) Levy

 

[Nielk]

I'm sure her lawyer said that.......
After all, a lawyer is paid to do whatever is in their client's best interest.
Now why someone would believe it, that's a mystery.

Joshua (not Jay) Levy

Who is Jay Levy?