“I had a large effect from increasing my zinc from 15mg/day to 65mg. That made quite a difference oin the early years of MeCbl etc. I had been taking zinc for decades to no effect. After adding MeCbl, AdoCbl and L-methylfolate, suddenly the zinc made a huge difference.”
"Starvation will usually result in several vitamin deficiencies. The most important of these with respect to refeeding is thiamine, as it is an essential coenzyme in carbohydrate metabolism."
“Six weeks of copper and my testosterone level went up by 300ng/L. That is a huge and fast increase. If the variability of the testosterone and the gums correlate usefully and then the eyeball tissue descriptions, it might be possible for some others here to not have to have all their teeth out because their gums melt away from low copper loss of connective tissue.”
“Correcting copper deficiency can increase need for potassium. For me, it upped the my potassium daily need by 400 mg on the 3rd day after starting copper. It started affecting symptoms perceptively in several hours.”
“So copper, instead of 200 symptoms from lack of basic methylation and ATP, copper might only account for a dozen or so symptoms, similar but different pattern from the basic ones. If copper turns out to be the most limiting factor in general methylation/atp it will hit like a ton of bricks and could possible cause +2000mg or more of hypokalemia typically on the 3rd day.”
“ methyltrap hit in about 2 hours causing body wide inflammation, return of allergies and asthma as well as all sorts of epithelial tissue problems; IBS, cheilitis, peeling and cracking fingertips, skin rashes, acne type lesions”
“Zinc with doses of 200-300mg daily were known to cause copper deficiency both by competition blockage during absorption and in the body. The LOWEST amount of zinc with the possibility of contributing to copper deficiency was about 50mg. None below 200mg were confirmed as problem.”
“ I cut back to 35-40mg daily. I'm about 2 months into copper usage now, somewhat improved and not getting worse.”
“I'm taking [copper] 7.5mg twice a day with food. It doesn't seen to upset my stomach”
“until I tried a 5 star MeCbl on May 21st, 2003 at 6:05 pm and in 5 minutes I knew it was changing my life and in an hour a lifelong depression was lifting. “
“Phosphatidylcholine, Phosphatidylserine and bonemeal, among some other supplements contain organically useful phosphorus in various forms. Lecithin contains Phosphatidylcholine.”
“Refeeding syndrome can be very frustrating as healing can stop perhaps 100 different times if a person doesn't start with a lot of basics, like b-complex, trace minerals and so forth. Even with those, for instance, 1.5mg of copper in the multi mineral I take just wasn't enough. That's why all the clues from people and what symptoms they immediately change are very handy to know.”
“To say it differently, the L-carnitine fumarate didn't do anything until after the MeCbl, AdoCbl and l-methylfolate deficiencies were fixed then suddenly LCF had a huge effect, and increased again the need for potassium. Then suddenly more zinc made a difference. And after AdoCbl and LCF were in place then D-ribose made it's difference the”
“P5P at 50mg in addition to the b6 in the b-complex caused my hematocrit to go up too high into a problem causing range, mid 50s. Stopping the p5p dropped it back to 47 and appears to be continuing down. It appears that P5P drives the hematocrit but it appears that B6 doesn't, at least in the same way.”
“There are items that allow things happen, there are items that make things happen and there are items that prevent things from happening. So far I have found top of effectiveness characteristics in B1, B2, B3 and inoistol. Basically for me they increased the need for methylfolate and potassium to insatiable levels and caused or allowed certain specific combinations of folate deficiency symptoms to come back.”
“The maximum B1 I can take without problem is 15 mg/day in divided doses, B2 10.2 mg per day, B3 50mg. Inositol has the same problems but I haven't thoroughly titrated that so don't know of a useful level”
“I had been taking 1mg of Boron in a multi mineral but that turned out to be insufficient”
“So copper, manganese, boron and molybdenum all appear to be involved in some way.”
“I take 1000mcg a day of Biotin. It is involved with the AdoCbl generation of ATP. Deficiency can bring ATP to a halt with then can bring methylation mostly to a halt, deadlocked. ATP is involved in the actual growth of the cell, supplier of energy for so many items.”
“I'll tell you what I am using, 8mg of Chelated Manganese from Solgar, Multi Chelated Boron from Solgar 3mg, Country Life 150 mcg chelated molybdenum, and 2.5mg Chelated Copper from Solgar x4 in am and x4 in evening. “
“Low boron can lead to uncontrollable tooth decay especially when combined with the dry mouth and poor circulation with the low copper. I'm up to 30mg of copper per day at this time and my serum copper id going up slowly. I also have some restored color in my hair. I dropped back to 36 mg of zinc but I ended up having worse problems in increased it to 65 mg again and am healing better.”
“Third level methylation blockage, METHYL TRAP. This often has sudden hard onset. It occurs for lack of MeCbl in cells so L-methylfolate is expelled from cells. Rich pointed this out when the symptoms and circumstances were described. It starts suddenly, widespread inflammation and pain, severe muscle aches and pain, MCS, asthma, allergies, sudden severe flu like illness with little or no fever.”
“It is my understanding, that adcbl is the base b vitamin in the body (mother) in which all others rest on, including methylb.”
“1.D-ribose deficiency, dysfunction in recycling used ATP back to ATP”
“My most bothersome symptom at this point is severe multiple chemical sensitivity -
That sounds more like an l-methylfolate deficiency”
“Method 1 - feed subjects 1 gram of l-glutamine and 600mg of time release NAC twice a day for duration (or frequent glutathione infusions, or NAC or whey in some). In 3 hours after first dose most of available b12 in the body will be flushed out in the urine. Then within the next few hours methylfolate is expelled from the cells via the "methyl trap”.”
“Zinc turned out to be a severely limiting factor for me, and a percentage of others when they tried it. In Carmen Wheatley's paper LARGE GORILLA... ADENOSYLCOBALAMIN, she details exactly where zinc comes into play with AdoCbl in reducing inflammation.”
“Vit D appears to be the most commonly limiting of the usual vitamins with zinc and magnesium the most limiting of the common mineral supplements.”
"The thread says basically that Iodine and Lithium are antagonic, if taking Lithium one should take Iodine which minimizes its antithyroid effecs and one should be taken at mornings and other night because lithium disrupts iodine metabolism."
"FWIW - T4 to T3 conversion problems and high reverse T3 are common with mercury toxicity."
"I want to add that taking orally liquid Iodine blasts mosts of intestinal pathogens so is something to consider. I plan to experiment with Lugol´s in the future."
"Starvation will usually result in several vitamin deficiencies. The most important of these with respect to refeeding is thiamine, as it is an essential coenzyme in carbohydrate metabolism."
“Six weeks of copper and my testosterone level went up by 300ng/L. That is a huge and fast increase. If the variability of the testosterone and the gums correlate usefully and then the eyeball tissue descriptions, it might be possible for some others here to not have to have all their teeth out because their gums melt away from low copper loss of connective tissue.”
“Correcting copper deficiency can increase need for potassium. For me, it upped the my potassium daily need by 400 mg on the 3rd day after starting copper. It started affecting symptoms perceptively in several hours.”
“So copper, instead of 200 symptoms from lack of basic methylation and ATP, copper might only account for a dozen or so symptoms, similar but different pattern from the basic ones. If copper turns out to be the most limiting factor in general methylation/atp it will hit like a ton of bricks and could possible cause +2000mg or more of hypokalemia typically on the 3rd day.”
“ methyltrap hit in about 2 hours causing body wide inflammation, return of allergies and asthma as well as all sorts of epithelial tissue problems; IBS, cheilitis, peeling and cracking fingertips, skin rashes, acne type lesions”
“Zinc with doses of 200-300mg daily were known to cause copper deficiency both by competition blockage during absorption and in the body. The LOWEST amount of zinc with the possibility of contributing to copper deficiency was about 50mg. None below 200mg were confirmed as problem.”
“ I cut back to 35-40mg daily. I'm about 2 months into copper usage now, somewhat improved and not getting worse.”
“I'm taking [copper] 7.5mg twice a day with food. It doesn't seen to upset my stomach”
“until I tried a 5 star MeCbl on May 21st, 2003 at 6:05 pm and in 5 minutes I knew it was changing my life and in an hour a lifelong depression was lifting. “
“Phosphatidylcholine, Phosphatidylserine and bonemeal, among some other supplements contain organically useful phosphorus in various forms. Lecithin contains Phosphatidylcholine.”
“Refeeding syndrome can be very frustrating as healing can stop perhaps 100 different times if a person doesn't start with a lot of basics, like b-complex, trace minerals and so forth. Even with those, for instance, 1.5mg of copper in the multi mineral I take just wasn't enough. That's why all the clues from people and what symptoms they immediately change are very handy to know.”
“To say it differently, the L-carnitine fumarate didn't do anything until after the MeCbl, AdoCbl and l-methylfolate deficiencies were fixed then suddenly LCF had a huge effect, and increased again the need for potassium. Then suddenly more zinc made a difference. And after AdoCbl and LCF were in place then D-ribose made it's difference the”
“P5P at 50mg in addition to the b6 in the b-complex caused my hematocrit to go up too high into a problem causing range, mid 50s. Stopping the p5p dropped it back to 47 and appears to be continuing down. It appears that P5P drives the hematocrit but it appears that B6 doesn't, at least in the same way.”
“There are items that allow things happen, there are items that make things happen and there are items that prevent things from happening. So far I have found top of effectiveness characteristics in B1, B2, B3 and inoistol. Basically for me they increased the need for methylfolate and potassium to insatiable levels and caused or allowed certain specific combinations of folate deficiency symptoms to come back.”
“The maximum B1 I can take without problem is 15 mg/day in divided doses, B2 10.2 mg per day, B3 50mg. Inositol has the same problems but I haven't thoroughly titrated that so don't know of a useful level”
“I had been taking 1mg of Boron in a multi mineral but that turned out to be insufficient”
“So copper, manganese, boron and molybdenum all appear to be involved in some way.”
“I take 1000mcg a day of Biotin. It is involved with the AdoCbl generation of ATP. Deficiency can bring ATP to a halt with then can bring methylation mostly to a halt, deadlocked. ATP is involved in the actual growth of the cell, supplier of energy for so many items.”
“I'll tell you what I am using, 8mg of Chelated Manganese from Solgar, Multi Chelated Boron from Solgar 3mg, Country Life 150 mcg chelated molybdenum, and 2.5mg Chelated Copper from Solgar x4 in am and x4 in evening. “
“Low boron can lead to uncontrollable tooth decay especially when combined with the dry mouth and poor circulation with the low copper. I'm up to 30mg of copper per day at this time and my serum copper id going up slowly. I also have some restored color in my hair. I dropped back to 36 mg of zinc but I ended up having worse problems in increased it to 65 mg again and am healing better.”
“Third level methylation blockage, METHYL TRAP. This often has sudden hard onset. It occurs for lack of MeCbl in cells so L-methylfolate is expelled from cells. Rich pointed this out when the symptoms and circumstances were described. It starts suddenly, widespread inflammation and pain, severe muscle aches and pain, MCS, asthma, allergies, sudden severe flu like illness with little or no fever.”
“It is my understanding, that adcbl is the base b vitamin in the body (mother) in which all others rest on, including methylb.”
“1.D-ribose deficiency, dysfunction in recycling used ATP back to ATP”
“My most bothersome symptom at this point is severe multiple chemical sensitivity -
That sounds more like an l-methylfolate deficiency”
“Method 1 - feed subjects 1 gram of l-glutamine and 600mg of time release NAC twice a day for duration (or frequent glutathione infusions, or NAC or whey in some). In 3 hours after first dose most of available b12 in the body will be flushed out in the urine. Then within the next few hours methylfolate is expelled from the cells via the "methyl trap”.”
“Zinc turned out to be a severely limiting factor for me, and a percentage of others when they tried it. In Carmen Wheatley's paper LARGE GORILLA... ADENOSYLCOBALAMIN, she details exactly where zinc comes into play with AdoCbl in reducing inflammation.”
“Vit D appears to be the most commonly limiting of the usual vitamins with zinc and magnesium the most limiting of the common mineral supplements.”
"The thread says basically that Iodine and Lithium are antagonic, if taking Lithium one should take Iodine which minimizes its antithyroid effecs and one should be taken at mornings and other night because lithium disrupts iodine metabolism."
"FWIW - T4 to T3 conversion problems and high reverse T3 are common with mercury toxicity."
"I want to add that taking orally liquid Iodine blasts mosts of intestinal pathogens so is something to consider. I plan to experiment with Lugol´s in the future."
