- Messages
- 8
I have been reading all I can about the different methylation protocols out there, and I came across this site - http://mthfr.net/taking-folate-and-feeling-badly-methylation-requires-balance/2011/11/15/ - which says "IMPORTANT!! Increased methylation may cause – and does cause – neurological symptoms."
My son once had b6 and b12 injections and suffered terrifying hallucinations shortly after. He was also on a new antibiotic, so I can't be sure what if anything external caused the hallucinations. I'm guessing the B12 was cyanocobalamin and that we have never supplemented the correct forms of anything, but I'm still concerned. I am especially hesitant because the same page says supplementing methylfolate and methylcobalamine will elevate methionine levels. My sons methionine levels are already elevated though I haven't a clue what this means.
The same web page talks of low B6 levels which my son also has.
My son is getting close to 17 years old and has been diagnosed with Lyme disease. He has a host of physical and neurological symptoms. None of the treatments/supplements we have tried so far have helped him much.
Anyway, my question is should all this information change how I go about the Active B12 Protocol? How? His B12 levels were okay. Are the recommended supplements easy to break in half?
Right now I'm thinking about supplementing B-6 and magnesium like the link above suggested and a B-complex. Then after a while adding the b9 and b12 slowly. My doctor suggests we see a geneticist.
I will also paste his NutrEval test results and my rewriting of the commentary. I'm on my own here as my doctor is not educated about this topic and we recently lost our insurance.
B-Vitamins
Thiamin - borderline
Pyridoxine - borderline
Folic Acid - borderline
Minerals
Magnesium - borderline
Zinc - Low 6.5 (reference range 7.8-13.1 mcg/g)
Need for Methylation - borderline
Carbohydrate Metabolism
Pyruvic Acid - borderline high2 6 (with reference range 7-32)
Creatine concentration - borderline high 17.8 (with reference range 3.1-19.5 mmol/L)
Neurotransmitter Metabolites
Quinolinic Acid - borderline high 7.9 (with reference range <=9.1)
Kynurenic/Quinolinic Ratio- low 0.34 (with reference range >=0.44)
Toxin Detoxification Markers
a-hydroxyisobutyric acid from MTBE - high 6.8( with reference range <=6.7)
Nutritionally Essential Amino Acids
Lysine - Low 38( with reference range of 34-226)
Methionine - High 90 (with reference range of 26-69)
Pheynylalanine - High 62( with reference range 22-61)
Tryptophan - borderline 86 (reference range 23-88)
Nonessential Protein Amino Acids
Cystine - High 114 (reference range 23-68)
Glutamic Acid - High 18 (Reference range 3-15)
Tyrosine - borderline 104 (reference range 28-113)
Intermediary Metabolites
Glycine/Serine Metabolites
Ethanolamine - High 581 (reference range 156-422)
Phosphoserine - high 69 (reference range 26-64)
Sarcosine - High 42 (reference range <=41)
Dietary Peptide Related Markers
Anserine (dipeptide) - borderline low 7 (reference range 8-118)
Carnosine (dipeptide) - low 3 (reference range 12-120)
Omega 9's - borderline 13.4 (reference range 13.3-16.6)
Saturated Fatty Acids
Palmitic - borderline 18 (reference range 18-23 wt%)
Stearic - high 19 (reference range 14-17 wt %)
Tricosanoic - high 0.25 (reference range 0.12-0.18)
Omege 6 Fatty Acids - borderline high 38.2 (reference range 30.5-39.7)
gamma-Linolenic - High 0.20 (reference range 0.03-0.13 wt %)
Arachidonic - High 21 (reference range 15-21)
Eicosadienoic - borderline high 0.21 (reference range <=0.26)
Delta - 6 Desaturase Activity
Linoleic/DGLA -borderline upregulated 6.6 (reference range 6.0-12.3
Omega 3 Index - Low 3.9 (reference range <=4.0)
lead, antimony, and arsenic were all measurable but within the reference range.
Also, his WBC is always a little high...
--2-HIBA was elevated and is a
metabolite of a gasoline additive. This was just
one decimal
point from not being above the reference range,
and I am guessing it isn't a problem...
--Kynurenic Acid/Quinolinic Acid ratio was low
which is associated with inflammation and overall
neurotoxicity. Healing Lyme by Stephen Buhner says this QA is elevated when the spirochetes infect the brain.
--He has low levels of a dietary peptide called
anserine.
"There is no clinical significance for low
anserine."
--Another dietary peptide, carnosine, was
measured to be lower than the reference range.
This is
typically low or absent for individuals who eat
low protein diets... NOT the case in our house!
--The amino acid cystine was elevated, but
without corresponding elevations in other amino
acids.
This is consistent with cystinuria - a genetic
disorder that causes kidney stones. One of the
symptoms is week fingernails, and his fingernails
have crumbled right in the middle many times. It
is also is associated with inflammatory responses
and reduced ability to detoxify if limited
glutathione results.
--Phenylalanine measured elevated...
This is linked to iron deficiency, subnormal
tissue oxygenation, anemia, pulmonary disorders,
cardiovascular
problems, magnesium deficiency, aluminum excess,
b3 and b1 deficiency, mitochondrial damage,
biopterin insufficiency, adrenocortical
insufficiency, addisons disease and insulin
insufficiency, genetic weakness AND MORE.
Symptoms with mild
moderate hyperphenylalaninuria include fatigue,
headaches, brain fog or mental confusion, nausea
or diarrhea. Artificial sweeteners need to be
avoided. We already do that.
--Ethanolamine was elevated. Magnesium deficiency
is frequently observed to coincide with this, and
could be caused by excess microbial production of
ethanolamine in the intestines and rate-limited
formation of phosphoethanolamine from
ethanolamine. A stool sample is needed to tell
the difference. Other markers for intestinal disbiosis didn't get flagged.
--Phosphoserine is an intermediary metabolite of
serine formation from phosphoglycerate
(glycolysis). It was elevated but serine is not.
Also, phosphoethanolamine is not elevated. This
suggests a rate limitation specific to the
phosphoglycerate-to-serine pathway.
This could be elevated due to a magnesium
deficiency {which he has} or b6 deficiency
{which he has} or coenzyme dysfunction of
pyridoxal 5-phosphate. This elevated
phosphoserine can cause vitamin D dysfunction, or
hormone/steroid imbalances.
--Methionine -amino acid- was elevated. This
implies rate-limited impaired metabolism of this
essential amino acid. This could have
far-reaching consequences and multiple
symptomatology. Magnesium may help.
--Glutamic acid is elevated and dicarboxylic
hyperaminoaciduria is not present.
The known conditions consistent with this are
ingestion of MSG, ingestion of nutritional
supplements containing large amounts of glutamic
acid, gout or pregout, some imbalance or
impairment in purine metabolism, metabolic or
renal acidosis. We avoid MSG, and he isn't on any supplements with glutamic acid.
--Sarcosine is elevated wich suggests three
possibilities.
1.recent dietary supplementation of
dimethylglycine.
2.Deficiencies of folic acid, THF, b2,
roboflavin. The methyl group fragment removed from sarcosine is at the oxidative level of CHO and can form
formaldehyde and slow down sarcosine's catabolism
while making it somewhat toxic.
3. Genetic weakness which is rare.
Unpublished clinical observations associate some
cases of acquired, mild sarcosinuria with past
exposures to organic chemical solvent and
petrochemicals. It's not known to be toxic,
however, folic acid supplementation is suggested
whenever sarcosine is elevated. He was low on
folic acid.
--Linoleic acid was within reference range but
below the functional physiologic range. Found in
virtually all vegetable oils. Linoleic acid
stimulates normal cellular division and cellular
repair. Inadequate LA may result in eczema-like
skin eruptions, behavioral disturbances,
increased thirst, growth retardation, and
impaired wound healing.
--Arachidonic acid was within the reference
range, but above the functional physiologic
range. AA is
also the main precursor for pro-inflammatory
eicosanoid synthesis. It may contribute to a
feed-forward inflammatory cascade and increased
immune system activation.
--Pentadecanoic acid and/or Tricosanoic acid are
above the reference range. May indicate an
increased need for b12 and biotin,
or may result from an exceptionally high water-soluble fiber diet.
--His lead, antimony, and arsenic were measurable
but not high. This is his second
heavy metals test with the same metals
elevated... but they didn't test for as many
metals this time. He's had two rounds of DMSA since testing.
--And last but not least, his zinc was very low.
He was also low on Thiamin, B6, Folic acid,
magnesium, and lysine and the papers suggest we
supplement them and omega 3's.
My son once had b6 and b12 injections and suffered terrifying hallucinations shortly after. He was also on a new antibiotic, so I can't be sure what if anything external caused the hallucinations. I'm guessing the B12 was cyanocobalamin and that we have never supplemented the correct forms of anything, but I'm still concerned. I am especially hesitant because the same page says supplementing methylfolate and methylcobalamine will elevate methionine levels. My sons methionine levels are already elevated though I haven't a clue what this means.
The same web page talks of low B6 levels which my son also has.
My son is getting close to 17 years old and has been diagnosed with Lyme disease. He has a host of physical and neurological symptoms. None of the treatments/supplements we have tried so far have helped him much.
Anyway, my question is should all this information change how I go about the Active B12 Protocol? How? His B12 levels were okay. Are the recommended supplements easy to break in half?
Right now I'm thinking about supplementing B-6 and magnesium like the link above suggested and a B-complex. Then after a while adding the b9 and b12 slowly. My doctor suggests we see a geneticist.
I will also paste his NutrEval test results and my rewriting of the commentary. I'm on my own here as my doctor is not educated about this topic and we recently lost our insurance.
B-Vitamins
Thiamin - borderline
Pyridoxine - borderline
Folic Acid - borderline
Minerals
Magnesium - borderline
Zinc - Low 6.5 (reference range 7.8-13.1 mcg/g)
Need for Methylation - borderline
Carbohydrate Metabolism
Pyruvic Acid - borderline high2 6 (with reference range 7-32)
Creatine concentration - borderline high 17.8 (with reference range 3.1-19.5 mmol/L)
Neurotransmitter Metabolites
Quinolinic Acid - borderline high 7.9 (with reference range <=9.1)
Kynurenic/Quinolinic Ratio- low 0.34 (with reference range >=0.44)
Toxin Detoxification Markers
a-hydroxyisobutyric acid from MTBE - high 6.8( with reference range <=6.7)
Nutritionally Essential Amino Acids
Lysine - Low 38( with reference range of 34-226)
Methionine - High 90 (with reference range of 26-69)
Pheynylalanine - High 62( with reference range 22-61)
Tryptophan - borderline 86 (reference range 23-88)
Nonessential Protein Amino Acids
Cystine - High 114 (reference range 23-68)
Glutamic Acid - High 18 (Reference range 3-15)
Tyrosine - borderline 104 (reference range 28-113)
Intermediary Metabolites
Glycine/Serine Metabolites
Ethanolamine - High 581 (reference range 156-422)
Phosphoserine - high 69 (reference range 26-64)
Sarcosine - High 42 (reference range <=41)
Dietary Peptide Related Markers
Anserine (dipeptide) - borderline low 7 (reference range 8-118)
Carnosine (dipeptide) - low 3 (reference range 12-120)
Omega 9's - borderline 13.4 (reference range 13.3-16.6)
Saturated Fatty Acids
Palmitic - borderline 18 (reference range 18-23 wt%)
Stearic - high 19 (reference range 14-17 wt %)
Tricosanoic - high 0.25 (reference range 0.12-0.18)
Omege 6 Fatty Acids - borderline high 38.2 (reference range 30.5-39.7)
gamma-Linolenic - High 0.20 (reference range 0.03-0.13 wt %)
Arachidonic - High 21 (reference range 15-21)
Eicosadienoic - borderline high 0.21 (reference range <=0.26)
Delta - 6 Desaturase Activity
Linoleic/DGLA -borderline upregulated 6.6 (reference range 6.0-12.3
Omega 3 Index - Low 3.9 (reference range <=4.0)
lead, antimony, and arsenic were all measurable but within the reference range.
Also, his WBC is always a little high...
--2-HIBA was elevated and is a
metabolite of a gasoline additive. This was just
one decimal
point from not being above the reference range,
and I am guessing it isn't a problem...
--Kynurenic Acid/Quinolinic Acid ratio was low
which is associated with inflammation and overall
neurotoxicity. Healing Lyme by Stephen Buhner says this QA is elevated when the spirochetes infect the brain.
--He has low levels of a dietary peptide called
anserine.
"There is no clinical significance for low
anserine."
--Another dietary peptide, carnosine, was
measured to be lower than the reference range.
This is
typically low or absent for individuals who eat
low protein diets... NOT the case in our house!
--The amino acid cystine was elevated, but
without corresponding elevations in other amino
acids.
This is consistent with cystinuria - a genetic
disorder that causes kidney stones. One of the
symptoms is week fingernails, and his fingernails
have crumbled right in the middle many times. It
is also is associated with inflammatory responses
and reduced ability to detoxify if limited
glutathione results.
--Phenylalanine measured elevated...
This is linked to iron deficiency, subnormal
tissue oxygenation, anemia, pulmonary disorders,
cardiovascular
problems, magnesium deficiency, aluminum excess,
b3 and b1 deficiency, mitochondrial damage,
biopterin insufficiency, adrenocortical
insufficiency, addisons disease and insulin
insufficiency, genetic weakness AND MORE.
Symptoms with mild
moderate hyperphenylalaninuria include fatigue,
headaches, brain fog or mental confusion, nausea
or diarrhea. Artificial sweeteners need to be
avoided. We already do that.
--Ethanolamine was elevated. Magnesium deficiency
is frequently observed to coincide with this, and
could be caused by excess microbial production of
ethanolamine in the intestines and rate-limited
formation of phosphoethanolamine from
ethanolamine. A stool sample is needed to tell
the difference. Other markers for intestinal disbiosis didn't get flagged.
--Phosphoserine is an intermediary metabolite of
serine formation from phosphoglycerate
(glycolysis). It was elevated but serine is not.
Also, phosphoethanolamine is not elevated. This
suggests a rate limitation specific to the
phosphoglycerate-to-serine pathway.
This could be elevated due to a magnesium
deficiency {which he has} or b6 deficiency
{which he has} or coenzyme dysfunction of
pyridoxal 5-phosphate. This elevated
phosphoserine can cause vitamin D dysfunction, or
hormone/steroid imbalances.
--Methionine -amino acid- was elevated. This
implies rate-limited impaired metabolism of this
essential amino acid. This could have
far-reaching consequences and multiple
symptomatology. Magnesium may help.
--Glutamic acid is elevated and dicarboxylic
hyperaminoaciduria is not present.
The known conditions consistent with this are
ingestion of MSG, ingestion of nutritional
supplements containing large amounts of glutamic
acid, gout or pregout, some imbalance or
impairment in purine metabolism, metabolic or
renal acidosis. We avoid MSG, and he isn't on any supplements with glutamic acid.
--Sarcosine is elevated wich suggests three
possibilities.
1.recent dietary supplementation of
dimethylglycine.
2.Deficiencies of folic acid, THF, b2,
roboflavin. The methyl group fragment removed from sarcosine is at the oxidative level of CHO and can form
formaldehyde and slow down sarcosine's catabolism
while making it somewhat toxic.
3. Genetic weakness which is rare.
Unpublished clinical observations associate some
cases of acquired, mild sarcosinuria with past
exposures to organic chemical solvent and
petrochemicals. It's not known to be toxic,
however, folic acid supplementation is suggested
whenever sarcosine is elevated. He was low on
folic acid.
--Linoleic acid was within reference range but
below the functional physiologic range. Found in
virtually all vegetable oils. Linoleic acid
stimulates normal cellular division and cellular
repair. Inadequate LA may result in eczema-like
skin eruptions, behavioral disturbances,
increased thirst, growth retardation, and
impaired wound healing.
--Arachidonic acid was within the reference
range, but above the functional physiologic
range. AA is
also the main precursor for pro-inflammatory
eicosanoid synthesis. It may contribute to a
feed-forward inflammatory cascade and increased
immune system activation.
--Pentadecanoic acid and/or Tricosanoic acid are
above the reference range. May indicate an
increased need for b12 and biotin,
or may result from an exceptionally high water-soluble fiber diet.
--His lead, antimony, and arsenic were measurable
but not high. This is his second
heavy metals test with the same metals
elevated... but they didn't test for as many
metals this time. He's had two rounds of DMSA since testing.
--And last but not least, his zinc was very low.
He was also low on Thiamin, B6, Folic acid,
magnesium, and lysine and the papers suggest we
supplement them and omega 3's.