Invest in ME Conference 12: First Class in Every Way
OverTheHills wraps up our series of articles on this year's 12th Invest in ME International Conference (IIMEC12) in London with some reflections on her experience as a patient attending the conference for the first time.
Discuss the article on the Forums.

when to implement the Cutler protocol

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by Aerose91, Dec 16, 2014.

  1. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,101
    Likes:
    618
    The general understanding I get is that you want to detox before getting into bug killing and immune system building. So-methylation and metal detox. I've had several various tests done that probe I have high lead and other metals as well as low minerals.

    I've been taking minerals for over 2 years and nothing has changed so I'm seriously contemplating the Cutler protocol however I'm not sure where this would fall in relation to methylation. Do I assume it's after methylation has been done heavilly? Get the detox systems working then start detoxing metals? Anyone else undertake this?
     
    helen1 likes this.
  2. TheChosenOne

    TheChosenOne Senior Member

    Messages:
    206
    Likes:
    64
    What kind of tests? If there is heavy metal poisoning, there is most likely deranged mineral transport which makes the mineral count unreliable.
    You don't need to support methylation if you chelate according to the Cutler protocol.
     
  3. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,101
    Likes:
    618
    Hair mineral analysis and a blood test sent to europe. Both I believe to be pretty reliable.

    Is the Cutler protocol better served if it's before or after methylation? Or it just doesn't matter?
     
  4. TheChosenOne

    TheChosenOne Senior Member

    Messages:
    206
    Likes:
    64
    But did you see deranged mineral transport or elevated heavy metals?
    Cutler doesn't say much about methylation. But I know that certain supplements like gluthatione are not adviced during chelation.

    My strategy is clean up all mercury, then make sure that it doesn't happen again.
     
  5. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,101
    Likes:
    618
    Yes, both.

    I'm just wondering if it should come before or after methylation. My feeling is after so hopefully your body already has some detox mechanisms in place to assist with the metals.
     
  6. TheChosenOne

    TheChosenOne Senior Member

    Messages:
    206
    Likes:
    64
    I think that it's hard to naturally detox heavy metals out of your system if have a methylation problem, even with methylation support. Especially in areas like the brain.
     
  7. xrunner

    xrunner Senior Member

    Messages:
    843
    Likes:
    680
    Surrey
    I did it the other way round 1. deal with infections, 2. remove amalgams 3. chelate (Cutler protocol). It worked reasonably well for me.
     
  8. TheChosenOne

    TheChosenOne Senior Member

    Messages:
    206
    Likes:
    64
    But infections is something else than methylation.
     
  9. whodathunkit

    whodathunkit Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,158
    Likes:
    1,469
    I did chelation long before I had more than a very slight passing knowledge of the process of methylation or how to effect it. It's a foundation of my current state of health. But I don't know if I ever had any real "infections".

    From what I've read it's pretty much a case of chicken or egg as far as whether to tackle infections or chelation first. People do it both ways.

    Some people might benefit from clearing infections first, because chelating in and of itself can make you feel pretty lousy. If you chelate when you already feel really lousy it could make the side effects from chelation intolerable.

    But other people might benefit from chelating first, since that will help clear some of the "heavy metal swamp" that some microorganisms that cause infection thrive in. Drain the swamp and you will automatically feel better. Plus clearing any infection(s) afterwards becomes much easier.

    IMO go with your gut as far as which to start first. If you're unhappy with the results, stop that and go the other way.

    Hope that helps. :)
     
  10. shah78

    shah78 Senior Member

    Messages:
    168
    Likes:
    114
    st pete , florida
    Over the summer you inadvertently pushed me over the edge in becoming a "100% all in KRUSEANISTA". You mentioned in a private message how his protocols were all very "natural" and quite benign. It took me a few months for me to implement the entire program going from 50% to 100%. But I never forgot your comment. I would like to return the favor.......I still do Cutler and I still do Freddd. But.......Kruse's program is one to two levels of magnitude more powerful. The EMF's, and the bluelight after dark, and the carbs in winter, and the lack of DHA on the cell/mito wall renders mercury and methylation issues almost moot. Add in the cold therapy and the magnetico sleep pad and its a slam dunk.....To summarize: do Kruse and your original question evaporates. Good luck and thanks again for that gentil push this summer. It was a life changer! :)
     
    whodathunkit likes this.
  11. whodathunkit

    whodathunkit Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,158
    Likes:
    1,469
    @shah78: I guess you're talking to @Aerose91...?

    Regardless, thanks to you and whoever turned you on to Kruse, and thanks for mentioning here. Your brief comments interested me enough to find him. Have just read a little but seems like really great stuff. More tools in my arsenal for staving off my dotage. ;)

    I've wished for a long time there was a way to avoid artificial light. But if you work at all in a typical indoor environment, there really isn't. I wonder are rose-colored glasses the answer after all? :D
     
  12. shah78

    shah78 Senior Member

    Messages:
    168
    Likes:
    114
    st pete , florida
    First off.Ubex blue blockers will do the job at work. A whopping $7 with free shipping. Everything Jack recommends has worked for me. I've been with him for over three and a half years. Almost nothing costs more than a nominal amount of money, if any at all. Except for the magnetico. I'm overjoyed that you connected with his "stuff".
     
    whodathunkit likes this.
  13. Cricketsof

    Cricketsof

    Messages:
    19
    Likes:
    4
    I'm wondering the same thing here. My amalgams will be out 3 months in just a couple of days. During the last 3 months I have experienced strange things. All of a sudden I can't handle oxalates. I was eating them everyday because I can't eat sulphur, it makes me sick. So I changed to celery and carrots and potatoes, and I could not figure out where the debilitating anxiety was coming from. I have never had a problem with these kinds of foods.

    So I stopped the oxalates and things are dying down. At least in that category.
    I have read many many times over even on the low oxalate group that they redistribute mercury. I took them out for a couple of day, reintroduced them and within 30 seconds my anxiety went through the roof as in attacks. I'm completely off them now. This is all too weird and I'm scared to death.
    I'm waiting on tests. One is mthfr. I will say though that one thing happened to me which was very scary. I took just a tiny bit of methylcobalamin. It was so tiny of a dose. I'm ashamed to say this but I went into some sort of a rage over absolutely nothing. It really scared me and I know it was the b12.
    So I don't think methylation is good for me first.
    I don't mean to take over this person's thread. Should I start a new one? I just had to post. I'm really scared.

    Thanks for reading. What is Kruse's program?
     
  14. pemone

    pemone Senior Member

    Messages:
    423
    Likes:
    191
    Cutler has an entire book written on the topic of hair analysis. One of the key signs of mercury toxicity is that it deranges the hair disposal of other minerals. So you will appear to be low on all minerals when in fact you are not low at all. You don't know what you actually are, and the hair disposal of minerals won't work correctly until after you have detoxed mercury.

    So focus on the mercury, if you can prove you are actually mercury toxic. THEN in one or two years your hair test will start to report your real mineral status and you can make adjustments.

    In the meantime, get BodyBio's incredibly clever mineral testing kit, and this will help you adjust dosing of good minerals in the short term:
    http://www.bodybio.com/BodyBio/docs/BodyBioBulletin-LiquidMinerals.pdf

    As for testing, the Quicksilver Mercury Tri-Test combines hair, blood, and urine together and gives everything you need to determine if you are storing mercury faster than you dispose of it. Completely unique test and it has no competitor.

    I think the methylation issue mainly supports the use of sulfur foods and NAC and glutathione. But technically there is no reason you have to support those things to detox.

    The main thing that people don't realize is that mercury comes out of liver through bile, and up to 95% of the bile can reabsorb. Quicksilver IMD powder is a silica particle that has many thiols attached, helping to assure that bile makes a one way trip out of body. I think the IMD alone will probably do a very decent job of helping to start clearing mercury.
     
  15. pemone

    pemone Senior Member

    Messages:
    423
    Likes:
    191
    And how are you testing for the presence of DHA on your mitochondrial membrane? And even if you could test, how are you ensuring that a high plasma level of DHA actually gets stored on the mitochondrial membranes?

    Kruse has many wonderful theories, but the problem is that very little of it can be reduced to testable objectives. You can waste a lot of time chasing goals that are not testable and make almost no progress.
     
  16. shah78

    shah78 Senior Member

    Messages:
    168
    Likes:
    114
    st pete , florida
    Excellent Questions, I'll get back to you after sunrise. I, avoid blue light after dusk. :)
     
  17. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,101
    Likes:
    618
    BodyBio does a cellular membrane test directly on red blood cells that breaks down every nutrient in it. I had this done and cake to find out that my DHA and omega 3's were off the chart high and omega 6's were real low. They had me change my nutrient intake to a 4:1 omega 6:3 in order to build toward this optimal balance. It's a test done at Johns Hopkins and it's really telling.
     
  18. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,101
    Likes:
    618
    That's really interesting about the mercury, I will have to read more about the Cutler protocol. I've had another blood test done that my doc sent to some lab in Europe for metals and the only one high was lead, though the rest of mine were on the highest side of normal. I know this was a blood test though and not cellular membrane. Since this whole disease is in my brain I need to research more what could be happening with mercury and other metals in my brain
     
  19. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,101
    Likes:
    618
    Glad to hear you're kicking ass with it, Shah!
     
  20. pemone

    pemone Senior Member

    Messages:
    423
    Likes:
    191
    Just to establish common frame of reference: red blood cells do NOT have mitochondria. Mitochondria inside of our tissue cells are the energy engines of the body. That is where the electron transport chain and aerobic metabolism do their magic. Kruse makes a big deal about DHA, but it is DHA in the mitochondrial membrane he is talking about.

    The test you did measured the RBC cell membrane, which is not mitochondria. Maybe they are similar, and maybe they are not. If you are tested as mercury toxic, in theory mercury deranges the mitochondrial cell membrane, so presence of DHA in plasma or RBC cell membranes may not accurately depict the state of your mitochondrial membranes.

    You and I have the same fatty acid test result. My practitioner said I have one of the top 5 Omega3 results he has ever seen out of thousands of patients. I am taking evening primrose oil to try to give specific Omega6 fatty acids, while avoiding the "bad" ones. I have not been retested but will sometime in 2015.

    You probably already know this, but the "correct" Omega 6 to Omega 3 ratio is one of the most controversial subjects in science. Biochemists strongly deny the necessity of lots of Omega 6 and feel that a 1:1 or 2:1 O6 to O3 ratio is probably more healthful. No one can do that experiment on humans because our food chain is so polluted with Omega6! Doctors and clinicians argue for a much higher O6 to O3 ratio, typically around 9:1, based on cardiovascular studies. Personally I think the biochemists are correct, and I would be personally okay with a 3:1 or 4:1 ratio.
     

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page