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What's the significance of ammonia in treating CBS/BHMT?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by bigmillz, Jan 28, 2016.

  1. bigmillz

    bigmillz Senior Member

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    NYC
    I've read numerous sites quoted here (Heartfixer, etc) and I still don't totally understand the significance of reducing ammonia levels when treating CBS/BHMT mutations. It seems like sulfates are the real issue, at least prior to starting methylation treatment. Can someone help me to understand this better? :)
     
  2. Valentijn

    Valentijn Senior Member

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    There's nothing to treat. The CBS and BHMT variants listed by methylation proponents either have no impact or very little impact. They certainly would not be causing ammonia or sulfur problems.
     
  3. Mr.Catts

    Mr.Catts

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    Valentijn, what is your opinion, does ammonia and sulphur need treatment? Is it a problem?
     
  4. Valentijn

    Valentijn Senior Member

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    No idea. But the CBS SNPs are definitely not an indication of any ammonia or sulfur problem.
     
  5. Mr.Catts

    Mr.Catts

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    Ok, if sulfur, ammonia and nitrogen are tested high?
     
  6. Valentijn

    Valentijn Senior Member

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    Ask your doctor?
     
  7. Basilico

    Basilico Florida

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    My husband and I both did the genetic testing and the full Yasko protocol, including all the (insanely expensive) testing and supplements and the result was...drumroll...nothing. No change whatsoever. In fact, many of our test results were the exact opposite of what she claimed would be the case based on our SNPs, which led me to believe that a lot of her assertions pretty bogus. Same was true for my husband, so I can't say that it's because I'm a weirdo.

    I do believe that supporting the methylation cycle is important, but I wouldn't worry too much about avoiding sulphur foods or ammonia. I'm not sure if you're asking just out of curiosity, or if you are actively involved in a methylation protocol and are considering a Yasko-type approach - Heartfixer is very much in line with Yasko. Either way, I'd recommend focusing on methylfolate and sublingual B12 (methycobalamin) and any of the other methylation supporting supplements that you feel are important, starting with really small doses and working your way up, if you can't tolerate them at first. I personally had no issue starting with regular doses of these, but my husband (who is an overmethylator) couldn't tolerate regular doses of methylfolate at first, so he had to slowly work his way up and now he can take it without problem. He also has no problem with MethylB12, but can't tolerate P5P. I actually think focusing on B vitamins is probably the most important take away I got from the whole methylation thing.

    (Just as one example, my SNPs indicate that my ammonia should be way too high. I had it tested both through a blood test -which showed my ammonia was perfectly in range - and also I used those pee-sticks to test ammonia in the urine - which also showed my ammonia was perfectly in range. My levels remained good whether I was testing during my 2 weeks of no-suphur/no meat diet or whether I tested after eating a huge amount of sulphur (eggs, onions, meat, cabbage, etc...) And in fact, after doing the elimination diet, I can say that I do not react poorly to sulphur foods at all, regardless of whatever my SNPs are, and neither does my husband.

    If I could only go back in time and tell myself not to waste all that money on Yasko's protocol...but then, at least I know I've left no stone unturned.
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2017
    ellecognito and Valentijn like this.
  8. xena

    xena Senior Member

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    @Mr.Catts I have high blood ammonia levels develop when I take methylfolate and methyl cobalamin. I also have the CBS and bhmt snps Yasko says are causing that. So. Maybe there isn't good evidence for that or healthy people aren't affected by it but I think it is likely I am. Maybe it's just a coincidence but if you do badly in mthf it could be a factor.
     
  9. Valentijn

    Valentijn Senior Member

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    It is just coincidence. Most humans have at least one of the CBS variants listed by Yasko, because they are extremely common. So odds are good that anyone with sulfur problems will have those variants. But the odds are just as good that anyone without sulfur problems will also have those variants.
     
  10. xena

    xena Senior Member

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    We can say that it is possibly a coincidence but we don't know that for sure either. Maybe the up-regulations that are a mild advantage in healthy people are a disadvantage in people with cfs who have a methylation block. I don't think there has been any specific study of the issue. For example, rich Van K noted that in their study, people with the CBS polymorphisms took longer to show improvements. There could be a variety of reasons someone might struggle with methylfolate or same or b6 of course.
     
  11. xena

    xena Senior Member

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    The other thing is that the urea cycle is functioning subnormally in cfs (I read something about Marty palls work showing this) so we may not be able to handle the extra ammonia burden healthy people do.

    My doctor said that methylation is used to remove the Ammonia
     

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