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What could my reaction to testosterone mean?

drob31

Senior Member
Messages
1,487
How is your diet? If your insulin is constantly getting spiked that will produce high levels of aromatase.

Do you eat many carbs? What does you fasting blood sugar look like? HbAc1, and insulin?
 
Messages
4
Actually it was oestradial that was tested. 133 (<150). Here are some other results i've had.

LH 4 (3-20)
FSH 11 (3-20)

Any idea what the units are on that? pg/dL? That is close to the upper end and certainly enough to cause you to have the symptoms you're describing. A lot of times they talk about men with high estrogen, but they're only talking about men close to the upper end of the range rather than men completely outside the range. Normally that wouldn't necessarily be an issue, but given that you're taking testosterone it seems like a clear connection to me.
 

Rand56

Senior Member
Messages
675
Location
Myrtle Beach, SC
Actually it was oestradial that was tested. 133 (<150). Here are some other results i've had.

LH 4 (3-20)
FSH 11 (3-20)

Does it state which methodology was used on your blood test for your Estradiol when it says " <150 "?

If so, I wonder if it's the same methodology that was used when I had my Pregnenolone, MS tested, and all they state is a reference range...adults: <151, but yet they do not say what methodology was used. LEF did my blood test, and from an article, they say that a male's optimum level should be 180 ng/dL. Seems odd that they would show a range of <151 based on this information. My Preg was low at 59 ng/dL.

Now on my Estradiol, they do state "Roche ECLIA methodology". The range on that is 7.6 - 42.6 and my result was 41.2 pg/mL
 
Messages
59
They didnt state any other information. I've done most of my testing over the last decade with QML but I will switch to sullivan nicolaides, the other major pathology in my state. My first total testosterone with QML was 11(10-30), second with SNP was 10 (12-30), and the recent one with QML was 12(5-30). Thats right, 5 nmol/L(which equates to around 150 ng/dL)has managed to become part of the normal range for QML in the space of a few months.

To add more confusion to the mix, over the decade I have had free testosterone and total testosterone tested a few times. My total testosterone always came back normal or high but free testosterone was always well below range. However, last year QML dumped that testing method for free testosterone and now use calculated free testosterone. My recent one came back mid range. But as I understand it, even if free testosterone is in range it becomes irrelevant if the total is low.

And gingercakes that was 133 pmol/L for oestradiol.
 

xks201

Senior Member
Messages
740
They used a female estrogen range most likely. I hope you are a female if you think that estrogen level is okay. Being at the top end of any estrogen range is not good as a man. lol

Taking 200-400mg of test per week with no AI ....you might as well be taking estrogen. All that T is gonna convert to E. Congrats. If I did that without an aromatase inhibitor long enough I'd have a nice set of breasts as a male. Hopefully you fared better. Do your research before you mess around with drugs. If your free test is low, SHBG is probably high.

Gel is a joke. A shot of say 80-125mg every 5 days is better if treatment is needed. There is a ton of aromatase on the skin and gel half life is too short to have a consistent hormone level. Stay away from the 500$/month overhyped gel. The people getting heart problems are all on that because it all turns to estrogen and DHT in most people- mostly estrogen. Give man estrogen and you will eventually give him heart issues. Like I said, do your research. This forum is probably not the place to be doing research on male hormone therapy because so few have experience with it.
 
Messages
59
They used a female estrogen range most likely. I hope you are a female if you think that estrogen level is okay. Being at the top end of any estrogen range is not good as a man. lol

Taking 200-400mg of test per week with no AI ....you might as well be taking estrogen. All that T is gonna convert to E. Congrats. If I did that without an aromatase inhibitor long enough I'd have a nice set of breasts as a male. Hopefully you fared better. Do your research before you mess around with drugs. If your free test is low, SHBG is probably high.

Gel is a joke. A shot of say 80-125mg every 5 days is better if treatment is needed. There is a ton of aromatase on the skin and gel half life is too short to have a consistent hormone level. Stay away from the 500$/month overhyped gel. The people getting heart problems are all on that because it all turns to estrogen and DHT in most people- mostly estrogen. Give man estrogen and you will eventually give him heart issues. Like I said, do your research. This forum is probably not the place to be doing research on male hormone therapy because so few have experience with it.

I am a guy with man boobs as I stated earlier. And I have done plenty of research, and could not find any information regarding optimal estrogen levels for men, except for one forum post where someone stated 60 was the ideal level. If you could direct me to where I could find information regarding optimal estrogen for men that would be great. I did ask my doctor his opinion on my levels and he did not think it was high.

I've heard mixed reviews regarding gels, but I do agree shots are more effective and consistent.

As for anti E, I have tried DIM but didnt quite feel right with that. I faired better with calcium D glucarate. I'm going to start taking it again. Prior to CFS I did try arimidex for a short while and found it gave me headaches, I have taken too much though. What AI are you taking? Have you tried novaldex? How does it compare to Arimidex. I know they have different methods of effect. Do you have an opinion on progesterone use for men?
 

xks201

Senior Member
Messages
740
His estrogen levels went a lot higher when he took the bigger doses. I prefer aromasin personally. 12.5mcg e4d. Allthingsmale forum is a good one
 

cman89

Senior Member
Messages
429
Location
Hayden, Idaho
Hmm. That sounds like a total estrogen number. Estradiol (also known as E2) typically has a range of something like 10 - 50, or 7- 46 etc. For example, my estradiol was 108 pg/dL at one point with a range of 10 - 52 ng/dL.

My problems didn't begin with the clomid/estradiol, but got significantly worse. Initially, I began to experience severe muscle fatigue and pain. I used to lift regularly, but nothing extreme. I got sick and had a couple of unrelated injuries over a summer and took some time off to recover. I went back in the gym once the summer was over and slowly tried working my way back up to the previous weights. I got about half way back up and started having serious muscle shakes and pain. I just could not recover from exercising no matter how much rest I got, food I ate, or supplements I took. I went to doctor after doctor and they pretty much accused me of trying to overdo it or not sleep/eat enough and so on after none of the tests that were run came back with anything definitive. As a last ditch effort I tried self-medicating, which only made matters worse. Today I can barely bench half of what I could before, can no longer bend my knees past about 75 degrees, and when I do exercise I have to limit myself to once or twice a week and no more than 15 total reps each workout. I have lost significant muscle mass, gotten much weaker, and it seems to be progressive in that even as I reduce the amount of weight I lift, I get more and more fatigued/have muscle pain.
Are you confirmed ME/CFS? If so, stop lifting. If not, take it very very slowly.
 
Messages
8
Location
East Anglia, UK
How is your diet? If your insulin is constantly getting spiked that will produce high levels of aromatase.

Do you eat many carbs? What does you fasting blood sugar look like? HbAc1, and insulin?

Re E2; as well as T, I think some foods can increase this, i.e. chickpeas, peas, etc.

Also check your SHBG. Mine was too high, so took Danazol to reduce it.
 
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