The power and pitfalls of omics part 2: epigenomics, transcriptomics and ME/CFS
Simon McGrath concludes his blog about the remarkable Prof George Davey Smith's smart ideas for understanding diseases, which may soon be applied to ME/CFS.
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Wahls diet, mitochondria

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by maddietod, Oct 17, 2013.

  1. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

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    Good point. There are some that have been on restrictive diets (and some very restrictive ones) and only got better after they listened to their cravings.
     
  2. I'm on Wahls Paleo Plus and am happy to be a discussion partner. One of the questions I have is specifically what vegetables are considered "starchy" (aside from the obvious potatoes etc.). If we need to be eating non-green vegetables while eliminating nightshades (eggplant, tomatoes, peppers), reducing "starchy"-root veggies to 2-servings/wk (pumpkin, squash, parsnips, all colored carrots, beets etc.), while still maintaining the "colored" vegetable requirements, (vegetables colored all the way through)- what non starchy- low sugar vegetables qualify? Turnips and red cabbage aren't colored all the way through, but are low in carb. asparagus, zucchini and cucumbers are green, but have a low GI so maybe these would still count? Any ideas?
     
  3. maddietod

    maddietod Senior Member

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    Do you have Dr. Whals' second book? I've loaned mine out, but I thought she clearly outlined the Paleo Plus diet. This link might be useful.
    I couldn't stay on the original diet, much less Paleo Plus. I couldn't eat that much food.
     
    merylg likes this.
  4. Thanks. I do have the second book and had read the link. Dr. Wahls also recommends the GI on a website in Australia though a significant number of foods are not listed. I double checked the book (though I have plenty of brain fog) and didn't see a specific list of vegetables that qualify as "starchy" and "non-starchy" still I'm also am not sure about what non-green colored vegetables are permitted on WPP.
    Also, I've heard her say that force feeding isn't necessary. I usually make an 8-10 oz coconut milk/water/leafy green smoothie (2 c. Packed leaves, a couple tablespoons of coconut milk,a couple ice cubes, and enough water so that it's not too thick.) I try to eat 3-4oz of animal protein/day, 1 c. Berries, 1-2 cups other veggies, and some broth.
    I've found that's usually a good amount for me (I'm 5'2). When I first started I was trying to eat a minimum of 6c. Fruits and vegetables plus 6+ oz of protein- it was intense! (for me- my exercise during the day was chewing)
    If you want to again and need support I'm your girl (though I can't say that I feel any better, but I'll stick with it.)
     
    merylg and maddietod like this.
  5. maddietod

    maddietod Senior Member

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    If she doesn't give a list, I would just go with what's commonly accepted. Here's a guideline from this diabetes site:

    "Generally, non-starchy vegetables have about 5 grams of carbohydrate in ½ cup cooked or 1 cup raw". There's a list of non-starchy vegetables there, which includes carrots - I would have been unsure about that one.

    Yeah, I gave up because of the 6 cups a day requirement, on top of the protein. My jaw hurt!

    How long have you been eating this way, and has anything shifted?
     
    merylg likes this.
  6. Thanks for the link. I haven't exactly been on the Wahl's diet for very long, but for the last 15 yrs, I have experimented with eliminating many foods, going gluten-free, sugar free, rice free, corn free, dairy free on and off, Paleo, Paleo, liver cleanse diets, the candida diet-, Gaps (80%adherence) since spring 2012-> Wahls Sept 2015-> Wahls Paleo, Oct 1-> Wahls Paleo Plus Oct 12.

    I don't feel any difference, but I'm planning to continue some version of it for life.

    How about you? Did you notice a difference when you tried it?
     
    merylg likes this.
  7. I just read over the diabetes list
    Re: non starchy veggies- carrots and beets are high in sugar- some peas are too. In a way I like that you here are a few unknown rules- I've had some doctors that wanted me to obsess over cross contamination, having topical contact with restricted foods/tap water. It was frustrating, isolating and I started to resent my dr for assuring me that if I wasn't improving that I must have come into contact with a food/contaminate. I didn't feel convinced that I had any food sensitivities. With the Wahls diet, I'm not obsessing- just doing my best, but if I'm too sick to cook and have to chose between eating a 3rd serving of a starchy vegetable in one week or going hungry- I'm cool with a parsnip:)
     
    maddietod likes this.
  8. maddietod

    maddietod Senior Member

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    Another truth is that I'm never going to eat heart, kidneys, brains, etc. I can manage chicken livers very occasionally, but not nearly often enough to satisfy Wahls' protocols. I also ended up hating kale.

    As with all my dietary explorations, I learned from this one. I now automatically think about eating colors. I eat a lot more cooked leafy greens - swiss chard, collards, and bok choi are always in my fridge. I'm not a huge fruit eater, but I've mostly switched to berries.

    I would have stuck with her original diet if my energy had improved. No such luck.
     
  9. I hear ya:)! I haven't started the organ meats yet, but plan to. In the meantime I'm taking dedicated liver.
     

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