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Van der Meer strikes again

Discussion in 'XMRV Research and Replication Studies' started by Rivotril, May 7, 2010.

  1. fred

    fred The game is afoot

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    Shame it's not been fired.
  2. JillBohr

    JillBohr Senior Member

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    Heck, we can all email the newspaper. I would be even more surprised if the journalist did not know English.
  3. omerbasket

    omerbasket Senior Member

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    I just emailed them - I suggest you fellows would do the same if you can.
  4. ixchelkali

    ixchelkali Senior Member

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    He certainly is mud-slinging, isn't he? Too bad that when he throws mud, we patients all get spattered with it. Unfortunately, if you keep repeating a lie often enough and loud enough, some people will believe it (as many politicians have discovered). Especially if it confirms what they want to believe.

    There are people determined to undermine this research with a smear campaign. I hope it doesn't stop the funding. I hope good scientists (besides the WPI) will go the distance to determine the truth.

    I don't think I like that man.
  5. Rivotril

    Rivotril Senior Member

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    I will also mail them...
    Just for the info about "De Gelderlander" : (the newspaper in case).. Gelderland is a "state" in the Netherlands, and Nijmegen one of the main cities in that "state". So it's, more or less, that the paper and Van der Meer are on good terms, they are the major newspaper in the erea where his scientific centre is settled.. and now I have the impression he uses it for his "propaganda"
    Because of this, I think they will be very careful in critisism to his "work".
    Sounds a bit like censured shit from iraq like I tell it now, hope it's not that bad :)

    Maybe it's also a good idea to send the translated (English) version of the article to WPI? So that they know what's going on
  6. parvofighter

    parvofighter Senior Member

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    It's all good

    Hi folks,

    Here is a link where you can add comments in English: http://www.gelderlander.nl/voorpagi...treden-vermoeidheidstest.ece?start=2&sort=asc

    The more vocal and public Van der Meer is, the better.... this makes it all the easier to illuminate what we have been up against. Mark my words, as soon as the European blood services start banning blood from ME/CFS patients, VDM will start looking ridiculous. And once those positive studies come in, and (as per Ruscetti's prediction) the issue of XMRV in ME/CFS patients is settled, we can go for the jugular. Probably, we won't need to, because there will be a massive distancing by government big-wigs from the psycholobby. Rats leaving a sinking ship.

    I'm not at all surprised to hear this blustering from the psycholobby. Amp it up guys - we're hanging on your every word... and copying it. BTW... see you in court.:Retro smile:
  7. Jerry S

    Jerry S Senior Member

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    Yay, Parvo! I like your attitude!
  8. Frickly

    Frickly Senior Member

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    I agree Parvo, they are on a slippery slope and not going to be able to hold on much longer. This is getting interesting. ;)

  9. JillBohr

    JillBohr Senior Member

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    When posting a comment online, does the comment appear automatically? I just posted one and it is not showing up.
  10. Frickly

    Frickly Senior Member

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    They have been having forum issues today. One time I posted something and it took 2 hours for it to show up. If this is the case, If you try and post the same message again it should tell you if you have another post pending.

    Jill
  11. anciendaze

    anciendaze Senior Member

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    When? How many experiments?

    It probably has to be viewed by someone to make sure it won't get them in legal trouble. Everyone running a site has to be cautious these days -- for reasons that have nothing to do with controversy over CFS.
    -----
    Does anyone know the date of the interview which led to that piece? If it wasn't substantially delayed, it would seem van der Meer is way out of touch. That is decidedly careless in a changing situation, which supports parvofighter's observation.

    Second question: In re-evaluating some facts in light of Dr. Mikovits letter, I wondered how many control samples were involved. She says one was included with each experiment, but I'm not sure what constitutes an experiment. If each sample were paired with a control, the chance of all contaminated samples not being controls would make the contamination hypothesis unlikely even with seven samples. If there were only one added to a run of seven, it wouldn't be enough to say very much.

    Scale the numbers up to 2/3 of the samples in the Science paper, which were certainly done in many separate experiments, and the hypothesis looks absurd. Rough and sloppy estimate: If the contamination rate is 2/3, the chance of having only a single uncontaminated negative control is only 1/3. With two controls, it is 1/9. With n controls it is 1/3^n. If you were to throw out every run with a contaminated negative control, and keep running tests until you get positive responses, you could get whatever results you like. This is approximately what the "whispered" accusations suggest. Thus, the outrage.

    Making some plausible assumptions about those controls, it looks to me like nobody analyzed the contamination argument at all. For people running laboratories, tracing contamination is a constant battle. If you assume contamination, and try to find the source, you might end up looking in Nijmegen.
  12. usedtobeperkytina

    usedtobeperkytina Senior Member

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    The taller they are, the harder they fall.

    Or as the Apostle Paul put it: "Consequently let him that thinks he is standing beware that he does not fall."

    Tina
  13. Alexia

    Alexia Senior Member

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    They read the comments first, normally it will appear after 24 hours.
  14. parvofighter

    parvofighter Senior Member

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    You made the Dutch Media!

    And bless your little cotton socks too pollycbr125 and Rivotril (in a good way). Your post, pic, and thread made the Dutch media here:http://translate.google.ca/translat...hl=en&lr=&newwindow=1&tbo=p&tbs=qdr:d&prmd=ln !

    Visitors: to say that ME/CFS patients are furious is a gentle understatement. Imagine if you had a devastating neuro-immune condition that more and more looks like a retroviral infection - like AIDS. Imagine that - as a result of this disease - you lost your loved ones, your career, your active hobbies, your quality of life. Now imagine that you were offered psychotherapy to change your "false illness beliefs" - instead of legitimate biomedical diagnosis and treatment. That is what psycho charlatans have been doing for decades - calling us malingerers, while lining their pockets and their curriculum vitae with ego boosts - at the expense of us patients, our loved ones, and your national economies.

    And now that the ship is sinking after hitting a potentially cancer-causing retrovirus, van der Meer is "outraged" that we want redress. As I said in an earlier post, "See you in court". The $hit hasn't even BEGUN to hit the proverbial fan.;)

    Who are you going to trust: the psycholobby which has everything to lose (prestige, status, lucrative contracts, and image-boosting market size of patients? Or blood services around the world, which are doing the only sensible thing possible - in the face of possible retroviral contamination of their blood supply - shutting down donations by patients with ME/CFS. Which country do you want to be in for your next car accident requiring a blood transfusion: Canada, New Zealand, and/or Australia - which are at the vanguard of protecting their blood supply? Or the Netherlands or UK especially, where Stone-Age psychiatric practices have a stranglehold on biomedical progress - and where the blood may be contaminated by the next AIDS virus? Take your pick.

    Keep in mind too that if the virus is found in as many as 4% of healthy controls, YOU could be the next ME/CFS patient... waiting to lose everything you hold dear - as the medical establishment ridicules you over the course of not just years, but decades, for being a so-called malingerer. It's time to let ME/CFS medicine catch up with the new millennium. And that requires thorough examination of the possibility of XMRV retroviral involvement - free of political machinations by dubious psycholobby characters.

    Positive ME/CFS/XMRV studies a matter of time: Fortunately, retroviral luminaries such as F. Ruscetti predict that the "controversy" over XMRV in ME/CFS will be resolved in 2011. And world-renowned retrovirologist John Coffin dismisses the flimsy complaints of "contamination". Follow the science - not the blusters of the panic-stricken psycholobby. Message to van der Meer: this is no time to be rearranging the deck-chairs on the Titanic.
  15. pollycbr125

    pollycbr125 Senior Member

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    Im afraid the credit must go to Fred lol He originally posted the pic i just happened to agree it was hilarious and added the aw bless his little cotton socks comment :D

    I wonder if the Dutch get British humour rofl :tear::tear::tear:
  16. pollycbr125

    pollycbr125 Senior Member

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    I cant quite work out their translation of my original quote lol .......

    aw bless His little cotton socks

    Must remember to use this pic in dance Any future correspondence with wessley and co, so true what They Say Can a face speak a thousand words


    DANCE ? DANCE ? where did i mention dance :eek: the mere thought of dancing with wessley is enough to give me nightmares arghh!! you know that really horible top to toe feeling you get when something gives you the creeps thats how i feel right now .

    if there was a cringe factor on tv hed win hands down ;)
  17. fred

    fred The game is afoot

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    Quite remarkable.
  18. justinreilly

    justinreilly Stop the IoM & P2P! Adopt CCC!

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    Is 'pretended' a correct translation. If so, I might have a problem with this.
  19. bettine

    bettine

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    yes Justin, pretended is the correct translation of Dutch pretendeerde.
    Note though, that it is not a direct quote by Van der Meer. (but it is his opinion, that is for sure ..... )
  20. flybro

    flybro Senior Member

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    pluto
    weasle is definatly creepy,

    i would rather die than be stuck in any hospital he had access to, especially if hopsitalsied against my will.

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