Tweets on talks on CFS by Peter White, Julia Newton & Alastair Miller

[Valentijn]

So Peter White appears to be claiming that patient organisations opposition to CBT and GET is due to mind/body dualism. There's more to it than that, Peter.

Maybe one day they'll actually have an argument with some substance. But currently it looks as though they're indefinitely stuck in "straw man" logical fallacy mode.

Someone send these idiots to an introductory logic class. And maybe some ethics while they're at it. In fact ... I bet Coursera has a range of free and rudimentary online options which could help them with the multitude of gaps in their knowledge which are highly relevant to their professions

 

[lansbergen]

Someone send these idiots to an introductory logic class. And maybe some ethics while they're at it.

I second that.

 

[user9876]

Maybe one day they'll actually have an argument with some substance. But currently it looks as though they're indefinitely stuck in "straw man" logical fallacy mode.

Someone send these idiots to an introductory logic class. And maybe some ethics while they're at it. In fact ... I bet Coursera has a range of free and rudimentary online options which could help them with the multitude of gaps in their knowledge which are highly relevant to their professions

I suspect he needs a course on ethics rather than one on logic. He cannot be so naive to think the way he is spinning the PACE results is not exaggerating them. Hence he knows he doesn't have a logical route to counter arguments and has to try to rubbish patient's opinions. We have seen a pretty constant campaign to dismiss patients so that others in the medical profession don't look too closely.

Then of course there is the ethics of ignoring safety information from patient surveys and not warning patients of potential side effects. Also putting other professionals in a position where they are not informed enough to warn patients of potential side effects. The excuses used to dismiss such reports also don't follow any form of logical argument.

I think with White it is a case of belief over evidence, logic and ethics.

 

[Dolphin]

I suspect he needs a course on ethics rather than one on logic. He cannot be so naive to think the way he is spinning the PACE results is not exaggerating them. Hence he knows he doesn't have a logical route to counter arguments and has to try to rubbish patient's opinions. We have seen a pretty constant campaign to dismiss patients so that others in the medical profession don't look too closely.

Then of course there is the ethics of ignoring safety information from patient surveys and not warning patients of potential side effects. Also putting other professionals in a position where they are not informed enough to warn patients of potential side effects. The excuses used to dismiss such reports also don't follow any form of logical argument.

I think with White it is a case of belief over evidence, logic and ethics.

Add in Peter White turning down one or more individuals (more I think) for disability payments unless they do CBT and/or GET even in the linked case where the person had already undertaken CBT and GET:
Critical Illness - A Dreadful Experience with Scottish Provident.http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2356683 (named in this post: http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2356683#9 )

 

[Chrisb]

Add in Peter White turning down one or more individuals (more I think) for disability payments unless they do CBT and/or GET even in the linked case where the person had already undertaken CBT and GET:
Critical Illness - A Dreadful Experience with Scottish Provident.http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2356683 (named in this post: http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2356683#9 )

http://www.bmj.com/content/298/6682/1199http://www.bmj.com/content/298/6682/1199
Whenever I read of Peter White in this sort of context my mind is drawn to this paper" Fatigue syndrome; neurasthenia revived" from 1989 in which he acknowledges that one third of patients had no evidence of psychiatric disorder and says we should treat what we know is treatable.

One wonders how anyone could , in good faith, believe that that they knew that people with no psychiatric disorder would respond to treatment in the same way as people with a psychiatric disorder.

 

[Chrisb]

@maxwhd has alerted me to the abstract


So Peter White appears to be claiming that patient organisations opposition to CBT and GET is due to mind/body dualism. There's more to it than that, Peter.

You're not going to get a long list of treatments being recommended/suggested for CFS if you have Peter White giving a talk.

I find myself perplexed by these quotes from the above abstract:

Abandonment of a
dualistic - mind or body - approach to management may help to address these issues.

His research
interests have included illnesses affecting both mind and body and understanding the links between them.

Is it only patients who are expected to know of Gilbert Ryle's description of mind as metaphor, whilst psychiatrists are allowed to continue to wallow in Cartesian dualism-whilst pretending to themselves that they do no such thing? If the duality is to be abandoned why would one research it and how can there be links between mind and body if there is no duality? One of the concepts must be otiose.

I hope there is someone out there able to explain how these statements can exist side by side. We seem to have thesis and antithesis. what could the synthesis be?

 

[Wildcat]

.
Typical of the psychosocial double speak that Peter White churns out.

 

[Bob]

Abandonment of a dualistic - mind or body - approach to management may help to address these issues.

So does this mean that e.g. HIV, polio, malaria and Ebola can be treated/managed with CBT? Measles, chicken pox, hepatitis C?

Given the choice, I'm certain that any HIV or hepatitis C patient would choose anti-viral therapy over CBT as a 'management' plan.

 

[Snowdrop]

Re: PDW
The dude's in a perpetual time warp.
For him the year is always 1984.

He must be a master of personal cognitive dissonance management.