1. Patients launch a $1.27 million crowdfunding campaign for ME/CFS gut microbiome study.
    Check out the website, Facebook and Twitter. Join in donate and spread the word!
9th Invest in ME International ME Conference, 2014 - Part 1: Autoimmunity and ME
Mark Berry begins a series of articles on the 9th Invest in ME International ME Conference in London, with a look at three presentations on autoimmunity
Discuss the article on the Forums.

This Requires A Very Good Explanation

Discussion in 'XMRV Research and Replication Studies' started by KFG, Oct 1, 2011.

  1. Angela Kennedy

    Angela Kennedy *****

    Messages:
    1,026
    Likes:
    152
    Essex, UK
    Ok, I actually do have the scientific knowledge and experience to discern the difference between fact and fiction. Mind you, a lot of people have here too, even the people not employed as scientists.

    Apart from that, your comments here are hilarious! Calling people 'delusional' and paranoid? ERV 'spot on'? Those are the most ridiculous, emotive, hyperbolic comments I've heard today! You silly, silly sheep.

    KFG - THESE are comments from emotion not reason. I know- I'm laughing at them. I guess that's an emotion as well. But when faced with incongrous silliness at this level, there's not much else can be done!
  2. FancyMyBlood

    FancyMyBlood Senior Member

    Messages:
    175
    Likes:
    67
    I agree with Ecoclimber 100% and am also getting increasingly frustrated about the way some people on the other forum are conducting themselves.

    It's time they start realizing they're only damaging the ME/CFS community and to be quite frankly, their denialistic and paranoid approach would make an outsider think there is some psychiatric component to the disease of those people. I'm getting sicker and sicker of this all.
    Sing, being, Jenny and 2 others like this.
  3. Kina

    Kina Moderation Team Lead

    Messages:
    4,936
    Likes:
    3,244
    Ontario, Canada
    Indeed, Ecoclimbers words are very strong and probably against forum rules but sometimes it is very hard to just keep one's mouth shut or post strong words masked by gooey sweetness. The way they treated Billy on the other forum was abhorrent and he was correct in his statements. Rather than address this calmly and rationally with proof that he is wrong, they attacked his character etc with a load of ad hominems. I suppose if Angela Kennedy is to be allowed to break forum rules here, then the mods can't play favourites. Note, she inulted everybody on this forum in this thread. I think the post by Ecoclimber is just a good example of frustration.
    Sam Carter and Firestormm like this.
  4. floydguy

    floydguy Senior Member

    Messages:
    650
    Likes:
    238
    Yes, apparently ecoclimber has now become afflicted with paranoid rants. Welcome to the community ecoclimber!!
    Roy S and Bob like this.
  5. Bob

    Bob

    Messages:
    7,428
    Likes:
    8,561
    England, UK
    Have you thought about not going to the other forum?

    Just a thought.
    Nielk likes this.
  6. Wonko

    Wonko Senior Member

    Messages:
    627
    Likes:
    103
    England
    In the face of the recent news would it not be posible for us all to pull together a little slower? So that in the act of coming together as one voice we dont do it in a way that causes our "community" to shatter?

    May not be a particularly helpful or intellegent observation but to be honest I simply cant follow most of whats been said in the last couple of pages, possibly because I rarely go to the other place, possibly because my brain doesnt do politics very well these days, possibly because I see most of whats being bickered about as irrelevant.

    On the threads main issue - bit irrevant now, probably always was, not sure what happened but obviously a mistake on some level - deliberate fraud - pull the other one. On the WPI closure - bad news, amazed and ashamed by proxy to see some on here attacking Judy, whilst I dont think all of her comments were helpful, surely no one can doubt her determination, passion and desire to help us - I hope she finds a way to continue but if not - thank you Judy and I hope you recover from this.
    Sing and SOC like this.
  7. Angela Kennedy

    Angela Kennedy *****

    Messages:
    1,026
    Likes:
    152
    Essex, UK
    Wow. I've been taking part in a serious, SERIOUS debate all afternoon here. And you think I'm breaking forum rules? As you have not been able to substantiate this claim, you are quite clearly wrong.

    But hey guys, GREAT way to derail a serious debate! Go for the faux outrage while making unsubstantiated allegations.
    Roy S likes this.
  8. Angela Kennedy

    Angela Kennedy *****

    Messages:
    1,026
    Likes:
    152
    Essex, UK
    Wonko, don't doubt your motives, disagree with most of what you say.

    **********Moderation:Text deleted.
  9. Wonko

    Wonko Senior Member

    Messages:
    627
    Likes:
    103
    England
    I domt support eco or you, reason being i cant figure out what you are "debating"

    edit

    or why

    all I know is that a rather sad thread which I was following with dread, watching people fragment in a most disturbing fashion, has suddenly become not just upsetting but completely incomprehensible to me.

    possibly i should stick to safe threads but TBH I was hoping that once the intital shock was over posts would be more productive

    and I'm not suggesting you (or anyone) shouldnt post what you like, thats for the mods to decide not me, I'm just giving you my take on it so far, I'll go find a rock/ get my coat / etc.
    Enid, Bob and Firestormm like this.
  10. FancyMyBlood

    FancyMyBlood Senior Member

    Messages:
    175
    Likes:
    67
    Of course I have and I don't visit it that much anymore after I had an argument about homeopathy (which they defended since a 'respected' ME/CFS UK doctor recommended it). But it's not about me personally getting frustrated about their approach, it's me getting frustrated on them damaging the ME/CFS community. Wether we like it or not, we need science and scientists to find a cure. Unjust attacks and denialism will not work in favor for our community.

    Wether I visit the place or not is irrelevant for this particular argument.
  11. Angela Kennedy

    Angela Kennedy *****

    Messages:
    1,026
    Likes:
    152
    Essex, UK
    Oh come on now! The forum didn't defend homeopathy! There was various forms of disagreement (shock! horror!)

    You are making false generalisations here.
  12. Kina

    Kina Moderation Team Lead

    Messages:
    4,936
    Likes:
    3,244
    Ontario, Canada
    That was what I was trying to say.
  13. joshualevy

    joshualevy

    Messages:
    46
    Likes:
    21
    But what if the mix up occurred during data analysis?
    You're assuming that the mistake was made just for the presentation (which is possible) but what if it was actually made just before data analysis (which is also possible)? Then the whole line of research could be off, and (at a minimum) the lab is very, very sloppy.

    Joshua (not Jay!) Levy
  14. shannah

    shannah Senior Member

    Messages:
    832
    Likes:
    156
    Here's the latest. See at the bottom of the page:

    http://retractionwatch.wordpress.co...r-mikovits-now-fired-share-data-with-science/

    Update, 7:30 p.m. Eastern: The Chicago Tribunes Trine Tsouderos, who has been covering the XMRV-CFS story for years, just tweeted the following comment from Science, apparently in response to questions about a story shes about to file:


    We are aware of allegations of mislabeled images in 1 of the figures in the 2009 Science paper + in meeting slides.

    Tsouderos story comes on the heels of a post by Abbie Smith alleging such image manipulation.
  15. Sing

    Sing Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,301
    Likes:
    421
    New England
    I started to read ERV's blog and immediately noticed two typos. She used the word 'to' for 'two' twice right at the beginning. Is this professional? Could she be prone to haste and error?

    Now I am being a little sarcastic. I find ERV's tone extremely so, however. Her blog is an exercise in contemptuous ridicule. It reminds me of the Far Right's daily attacks on President Obama and other Democrats. It reminds me of the hateful crowds in lynch mobs or following prisoners to the gallows or guillotine or stake. I would look no farther than this hatefulness to even consider what she has to say. She lost me from the outset with her style of extreme contempt.
    HowToEscape? likes this.
  16. shannah

    shannah Senior Member

    Messages:
    832
    Likes:
    156
  17. floydguy

    floydguy Senior Member

    Messages:
    650
    Likes:
    238
    Trine has absolutely no credibility with me. She is squarely tied to the hip to the crowd that is aghast that a handful of desperate patients are taking anti-retrovirals (presumably with a prescription from their MD). She writes incessantly about that. Meanwhile a much larger portion of the population is addicted to pain killers, meth and all sorts of legal drugs. But I guess that's just fine with Trine. If Trine was really interested in the drug aspect of it she would do an undercover story on the amount of medication seniors are on in some retirement facilities. Maybe Trine could post some of A list recipes in another thread.I could use some diversity in what I cook.

    Trine et al are going to have a field day with this turn of events...
    acer2000 likes this.
  18. Bob

    Bob

    Messages:
    7,428
    Likes:
    8,561
    England, UK
    It's still all speculation.
  19. Bob

    Bob

    Messages:
    7,428
    Likes:
    8,561
    England, UK
    The mix-up is in a presentation slide, Joshua. It's not in a published paper.

    So yes, I am assuming that the mistake occurred just in the presentation, because that is the easiest and most obvious assumption to make.

    Any other assumptions at this stage just lead to wild and unnecessary speculation, in my opinion.

    Of course I don't know that I'm correct about this, but nor does anyone else.
  20. Bob

    Bob

    Messages:
    7,428
    Likes:
    8,561
    England, UK
    Was that directed at me ecoclimber? I don't undestand what you mean?

    I do enjoy your tantalising and sensationalist posts ecoclimber (irony).
    But they are quite meaningless for the rest of us unless you flesh them out a bit.
    currer likes this.

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page