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The role of Mercury in ME/CFS?

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by Stuart, Sep 5, 2009.

  1. Stuart

    Stuart Senior Member

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    Could mercury poisoning be a key issue in ME/CFS or other diseases? It certainly has neuro-immune consequences.

    A book published last October might be worth looking at - Diagnosis: Mercury: Money, Politics, and Poison by Jane M. Hightower, M.D. I just learned of it and have not read it, but it might be useful in understanding some of the system dysfunctions other than the glutathione cycle that may be effected. Since Dr. Hightower has treated patients it might be useful in detox treatments.

    It seems that any test for mercury is rather complex, that a number of processes can cause poor excretion of mercury, glutathione being only one. Poor excretors will test low to no level of mercury in blood, urine, or hair. Stimulation of excretion by chelating will not tell you how much body burden you have, only that you do have it, nor will it tell you were it is concentrated.

    Individual organs can be building up mercury, requiring biopsy to find the level. Heart biopsy has found level 22,000 times normal. There is an apparent affinity between virus particles and mercury. Is this another chicken and egg problem in ME/CFS? Do we have unknown toxic body burdens of mercury? Could transport and deposition of viral particles in the body be facilitated by mercury?
  2. susan

    susan Senior Member

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    Mercury and homeopathics

    I visist a homeopath who has told me there is a definite link. She says that viruses cannot live in the body without mercury to sustain them. She said we had health crisis and an immune response that opened the door to viruses who latched on the back of mercury where they now sit. Get rid of mercury and the viruses cannot live. As you know they used to put mercury in vaccinations......they say they dont anymore but she says they will call it another chemical name......big money at stake here in vaccinations. Why did they do it in the first place if it was not to transplant the vacination virus. Which proves her point that you have to have mercury to transplant the virus.

    She has give my friend 80% of her life back and 2 other people that I know of. I have just begun the detox which involves quite some bizarre stuff like making a special drink that everyday has to have the inside juice of a coconut plus homeopathics.
  3. Frickly

    Frickly Senior Member

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    Mercury

    We recently did a challenge test on my son and it turns out he has high levels of mercury and lead. We will be chelating soon and I am very interested to see if this has an improvement on his behavior. I have heard many success stories with regard to autism and chelation. If I can ever stop spending all our money on his doctors and therapists I would like to do a challenge on myself. Personally, I do not beleive the answer is as simple as mercury toxification alone, but I do feel that it can make us much sicker as out bodies are not able to properly detox. It is a vicious cycle.
  4. Recovery Soon

    Recovery Soon Senior Member

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    I tested extremely high for Mercury Allergy on the MELISA test.

    Had my pulled fillings pulled and chelated for 6 months.

    Result? NOTHING.

    I don't think there's any link between mercury and CFS.

    There are spotty anecdotes here and there, but that's about it.
  5. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

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    Hi Recovery...

    I'm curious what type of chelation did you use?

    Andrew Cutler says the only thing that can chelate mercury from the brain is alpha lipoic acid...and it must be taken every three hours for 3 days 2 nights, and then take a week off and start again...for months, sometimes years.

    And if it's still in the brain, then one would still have symptoms and/or no improvement.

    ???
  6. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    Susan--That's interesting about the coconut. I just began Lauricidin (lauric acid extracted from coconut) in July. It's anti-viral and also a mild chelator.
    For more about my experience, please read my post in the viral treatments segment.
  7. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    Toxic Metal Overwhelm

    I'm hoping someone has good ideas about things that NEUTRALIZE the metals when they come gushing out.
    I am in such a position right now, due to taking the Lauricidin. N-A-C helps somewhat, but is there anything
    else? So far I've tried: fruit pectin, large doses of chlorophyl and vit C, minerals, B-Complex, B6, and being
    in the sun sweating.

    I am SO HYPER and WIRED from this detox reaction, it's very uncomfortable. But I want to keep taking the
    Lauricidin, as it's helpful A LOT with my viral symptoms. If I can just figure how to control the detox, maybe
    I can make it work.

    Any ideas?
  8. dannybex

    dannybex Senior Member

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    Hi Dreambirdie...

    Dr. Andrew Cutler PhD says that sometimes NAC may be harmful, but it depends on something that right now I can't recall.

    He has a protocol that he developed based on reviews of hundreds of studies (he went to school at Princeton) and found that ALA -- alpha lipoic acid -- is the best chelator because it's the only one that crosses the blood-brain barrier. He's very outspoken about this...and says that many common chelation protocols can be very dangerous and actually make patients a lot worse.

    He strongly advises that you take it starting at a low dose, but also very important -- take it every three hours -- that means getting up at nights -- for three days, two nights...then wait a week, and start the 'round' over again. The reason for this is that it has a very short half-life in the body, so if one takes it only twice a day, or once a day, then it's possible that mercury could be moved into the brain, or pulled out of the brain and moved to another organ. By taking it constantly for a few days, that danger is greatly reduced...according to Cutler.

    It takes weeks, sometimes months or longer to clear mercury, depending on your situation. I highly suggest googling "Andy Cutler" and mercury, or Andrew Cutler...and you'll find a lot of info.

    Hope this helps,

    Dan

    p.s. He recovered from CFS, and his wife from fibro, by chelating heavy metals using ALA.



  9. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    DannyBex!

    Oh brother! This is so CONTRA to my experience that I'm not sure I can try it. N-A-C has truly been my SAVING grace during MANY times when I've had heavy
    metals hit my bloodstream from various other chelators. And ALA has made me SO SICK! According to one of my most knowledgeable sources, ALA is a very
    POOR chelator.

    I've heard about Cutler's ideas, but whenever someone makes statements that this is "THE ONLY... (fill in the blank)" I usually run as fast as I can in the opposite
    direction. :eek: I've see this so many times where someone figures out a protocol and sets it in stone, and then expects that it will work for every single person
    in the same exact way. It all sounds so good in theory, but wow what a gap there can be btwn the theory and the reality. We all have such different biochemistries.
    There is never a one size that fits all.

    So now I'm lost in toxoland with mercury across the BBB... and it's so not fun.


  10. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    More Info on Andrew Cutler Protocol

    So here's what I learned about Andrew Cutler's protocol. He used ALA in combination with a chemical chelator. This is a very bad
    choice for anyone who has MCS. In fact only a VERY SMALL percentage of people who are mercury toxic have good enough kidney and liver function to
    be able to effectively handle those strong chemical chelators.

    Also, according to my favorite herbalist/doctor expert on these things, ALA is actually more of a mercury MOBILIZER, rather than a chelator--it pulls the mercury out of "storage," but doesn't help your body eliminate it. N-A-C on the other hand is an effective chelator.

    So now my reaction, as noted in the post above, is beginning to make sense. As if I need a reason to feel the way I do. :rolleyes:

    But I still need answer to my previous question about what other NATURAL chelators will help my body exit this mercury once it has been mobilized by
    the Lauricidin, which was not even supposed to do this?
  11. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    Hi Dreambirdie,

    I'm sorry to hear what you're going through. Is there any way you can taper off on the Lauricidan until you can find an effective way to get the mercury out of your system more efficiently?

    I myself have been doing clay foot baths for about 2-3 years now, and feel they have helped me (safely) detox some of my mercury load. I first learned about them at a website company called http://www.evenbetternow.com/.

    This company was founded by a woman who claims to have used her described protocols to recover from CFS and then sometime later, interstitial cystitis. I have found her website to be quite a treasure trove of information regarding heavy metal detoxification and how important it is when addressing any kind of neurological disorder.

    She is also a big believer in using far infrared (FIR) saunas to assist with heavy metal detox. My own sauna experience in the past several weeks is indicating to me that this will be an important tool in my own detoxification efforts.

    If you're interested, I created a thread over at ProHealth about my experience with they foot baths. It's entitled, "Detoxification Clay / Clay Foot Baths Work Well for Me" and can be accessed at: http://www.prohealth.com/me-cfs/blog/boardDetail.cfm?id=1104646.

    Good luck in finding something that helps you. Mercury detoxification is serious business and should incorporate as many safeguards as can be realistically implemented.

    BTW, I've noticed that your posts are quite broken up. I was wondering if there's any way to avoid this. Unfortunately, my reading abilities kind of get messed up when things out of the ordinary like that happen. -- Thanks.

    Wayne
  12. SaraM

    SaraM Senior Member

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    Dreambirdie,

    Based on what I have read on the internet, people must take Chlorella -a good metal binder- to get the mercury out of the system before it has been mobilized. I myself have used it to see if I can get any benefit from that for my health, but never noticed a difference.
  13. jenbooks

    jenbooks Guest

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    Apparently if you correct your methylation cycle you will start excreting heavy metals in the order your body chooses. One sees this with autistic children.
  14. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    Thanks everyone--Wayne, SaraM, Jenbooks--on your input regarding this. I am a bit exhausted at this point, so I'm going to check
    into your ideas tomorrow.

    AND YES... Wayne... I am having a hard time trying to figure how to type my posts so that they take up just the right amount of space
    on the screen??? If you, or someone else, could assist me with that, it would be very helpful.
  15. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    Hi Wayne--

    So I did completely STOP the Lauricidin for a couple days and I feel TOTAL RELIEF at this point from my detox symptoms. I checked in with an TCM herbalist I know,
    who does biophoton testing, and he confirmed that the Lauricidin is not only clearing the viral, but also causing a major detox of both heavy metals and old pesticides.
    That's quite a load that was being dumped into my bloodstream to process out! What worked best to help me ease my symptoms was: N-A-C, Xyflamend (a natural
    anti-inflammatory), and heavy doses of multi-minerals. I actually felt so much better today that I was able to get out and enjoy some nature! Yay! Feeling good feels
    especially good after you've been feeling like crap!

    What's amazing is that the Lauricidin is supposed to be primarily anti-viral/fungal/bacterial, but on me it's also the most powerful chelator I've taken. I don't want to
    stop it, because it's really helping me with the chronic infections---LIKE NOTHING ELSE I've tried in the past 10 years. But I have to figure out how to dose it to make
    more bearable to take. I am already at such a small dose--only ten pellets. But I might have to return to the children's minimal dose of just 3 pellets. Maybe that is
    all that I need. :confused:

    As for the saunas... I wish there was someone in this area who had one I could try. I don't want to invest all that money into something I'm not 100% sure of. Been
    there, done that. But the idea of a sauna, especially as the winter approaches and I can't do my sweating out in the sun, is very appealing.


    Hi SaraM--

    I have tried chlorella in the past, and unfortunately it doesn't work for me at all. I'm allergic to algaes!


    Hi Jenbooks--

    I am reading up on methylation (and on the B12 info of Freddd's). WOW! There is a lot about this I didn't know. But I am very eager to know more.


    Thanks for all your input. I really do appreciate it a lot. :)
  16. susan

    susan Senior Member

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    Dreambirdie.
    You might have to get the electric drill out for lunch like me to drill the hole in the coconut for its milk to get a natural supply of laucidin. Costs me $3.00 a day for a coconut that I have to throw away after I milk it. No change for me yet...only 1 mth into it......just got out of bed after 2 solid wks tied to it just becausei I got too excited over being grandmother.......saliva adrenal test showed rock bottom adrenals. I cant wait to feel like you so I know something is happening......
  17. jenbooks

    jenbooks Guest

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    Dreambirdie, some professionals feel that bugs in the gut especially use polysaccharides (sugars) and metals/minerals (doesn't really matter to the bugs) to make a matrix with a goopy biofilm--to protect them from being killed by us or antibiotics.

    Thus when you start killing the bugs, and especially if you also take enzymes that help dissolve the goopy layer of the biofilms, you lose the metals too. You're sort of busting up the whole matrix.

    People have long commented on the correlation btw metal toxicity and infection. Maybe metal toxicity first suppresses immunity and leads to infection, but once infection has flourished, the bugs use the metals.

    This could be happening with lauricidin. Instead of it actually being a chelator. I think to chelate mercury etc it needs sulfur.

    I once tried lauricidin but for me it ruins my good bacteria in my gut within about one day and I therefore never used more.
  18. Dreambirdie

    Dreambirdie work in progress

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    Hey Jenbooks...very interesting.

    Whatever the case may be, that Lauricidin is BLASTING all of the GOOPY into my pristine all organic bloodstream, and making my body work really hard to eliminate
    it. I know that the lauric acid of the Lauricin does dissolve the fatty exterior coating (whatever it's called) of the viruses, and that is how it destroys the bugs. And in
    my case those nasty pathogens sure did surround themselves with toxic metals. That must be the reason why I'm having both die-off and toxicity issues at the same
    time.

    Wouldn't it be nice if there was an easy way to get well?
  19. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    Dreambirdie - Lauricidin

    Wow Dreambirdie, this is some pretty remarkable information. Congratulations on getting TOTAL RELIEF from your detox misery. I just heard about Lauricidin about 3-4 weeks ago, but had not really gotten around to researching it. Your posts here have already given me quite an education. Feels very encouraging.

    Regarding saunas: I had thought about getting a far infrared (FIR) sauna for the past 3-4 years but had some of the same concerns you mention. Imagine my surprise and delight when I found a local health facility only three miles away that offers a monthly membership ($45) to go in as often as I want to do a sauna. Perhaps there's one in your area you may not be aware of.

    Whenever I think of doing things that will likely initiate detoxification like the Lauricidin, I now have a much greater sense of safety. It's reassuring to know that I've built up a certain stamina from doing saunas that can really facilitate moving a lot of toxicity straight out of my system without having to unduly burden some of the more normal detoxification channels.

    I'm really happy to hear you're feeling better. I was a bit concerned about so much mercury being mobilized and not having a way to exit out. Thanks for the update.

    Wayne
  20. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    Susan - Tried Low-Dose Hydrocortisone ?

    Hi Susan,

    I was wondering if you've considered doing low-dose hydrocortisone for your rock bottom adrenals. I've done this therapy for over ten years now, and would be almost non-functional without it. I created a post a couple years ago, and I'll paste it below in case you have an interest.

    Congratulations on being a grandmother! :)

    Wayne
    ...........................................

    Safe Uses of Cortisol by William Jeffries. I considered this book (and still do) the most authoritative literature on low-dose hydrocortisone Ive been able to find. Dr. Jeffries devoted his entire career to researching and developing a low-dose hydrocortisone protocol for people with CFS, FM, arthritis, post-viral syndrome, mononucleosis, HPA axis dysfunction, hypoglycemia, and many other conditions including infertility. He found even marginal adrenal insufficiency can have big effects. Some highlights Ill mention for now:

    1. The average body makes approx. 40 mg cortisol/day. If you have adrenal insufficiency, the adrenal glands are constantly trying to increase cortisol levels, and being unable to do so, virtually never fully rest. By supplementing with enough cortisol (Cortef) to bring levels back up to normal, the whole body starts to function better and the adrenal glands get a chance to start resting and hopefully start rejuvenating.

    2. The average dose necessary to bring cortisol levels to normal are 20-30 mg per day. As long as you keep the amount below 40 mg/day, your adrenal glands will not shut down, which is a problem with higher dose supplementation. He goes into detail the history of cortisone, and how the initial promise of it became obscured when early high dose supplementation created many of the problems that doctors are currently concerned with. Unfortunately, most doctors know nothing about the safety of lower doses.

    3. Cortef / hydrocortisone has the same molecular structure as our bodys natural cortisol. Prednisone and most of the other synthetic souped-up products that are often prescribed are on average about 4 times more potent than cortisol. Each pharamaceutical company had to come up with their own unique molecular formula so they could get a patent and get in on this market. Supplementing with these can be very problematic on a long-term basis.

    4. He has little confidence in any of the current tests to measure cortisol levels, including the Cortrosyn Stimulation Test or the Adrenal Stress Index test. He says our cortisol levels fluctuate too much to get an accurate snapshot of the true status of adrenal function. He instead relies primarily on a patients response to a trial supplementation. He starts out at 20 mg/day for about 1-2 weeks. If no improvement is noticed, he increases it to 30 mg/day. If there is still no improvement in symptoms, he usually determines that adrenal insufficiency is not the problem, and takes another 2-4 weeks to gradually withdraw the supplementation. In other words, if you dont need it, your body wont respond to it.

    Ive been taking 20-25 mg/day of Cortef for about 8 years now and I believe it is the difference between my being about 20-25% functional as opposed to being about half that or less. All the side effects have been good. To name a few: better digestion, better stress response, increased ability to relax, better sleep, and more.

    Ive experimented with two other brands of hydrocortisone. I believe one was a compounding pharmacy product and another a brand name I cant remember. Neither of them were good for me at all (gave me a very disconcerting feeling). Only the Cortef works for me.

    My initial dose of 5 mg felt like I had drunk too much coffee and went outside and walked like I hadnt walked in ages. I realize now that my body was so unused to having this degree of energy coursing through my system, and needed time adjusting to it. But gradually increasing the amount over a two week period brought me to appropriate and comfortable levels. I now feel very confident that this is both safe and highly beneficial for me.

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