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the psych lobby strikes again: DSM-5 v. WHO's ICD in the US

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS News' started by fresh_eyes, Dec 22, 2009.

  1. beckster

    beckster

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    Hi Marie,
    yes, and we might have to do most of the work, as most clinicians are overbooked and over worked. It afffects them too though because we wouldnt be able to see them, insurance wouldnt pay, visits cannot be prn, it limits tests, etc . . .
  2. beckster

    beckster

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    Also,
    anyone know how the DSM actually affects regular docs--what if they keep coding pain disorder, back pain, etc as they always have. Is there a matter of jurisdiction here? Any professionals have input?
  3. mezombie

    mezombie Senior Member

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    Non-psychs generally code to ICD-9CM (the US clinical version of the WHO's ICD). They don't use DSM.

    BUT if someone with ME/CFS goes to a psych to deal with the emotional impact of having a physical illness, that person would get a DSM code and could easily end up with a " Somatic Symptom Disorder" on top of ME/CFS.

    And don't forget that, in the US, we are all moving toward having all our medical records available electronically. It's all covered under "Health Information Technology" which was slipped in the Recovery Act. So now it's the law.

    Which means what we are coded with will follow us everywhere.

    Then there is also the "harmonization" project (see ealier posts on this thread)-- at some point, ICD and DSM have to make sense together.

    ----------------------------------
    There is so much more to say, but I really must get off this machine! I am on the "burnout bench"!
  4. beckster

    beckster

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    Hmmm, that's the guts of it, then.

    Marie, in a sentence, can you tell me when the ICD and DSM have to come together, and who instigiated this (is we know who).

    Thanks (maybe i'll see you at the bench . . .)
  5. starryeyes

    starryeyes Senior Member

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    ((((((((((fresh eyes)))))))))))) So good to see you! Of course we all understand. Sorry you've been having a hard time. Thanks for this link.

    :hug:

    tee
  6. starryeyes

    starryeyes Senior Member

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    Hi oerganix,

    That was a cool psych you had. I was wondering if you knew that flushing your meds down the toilet puts them into the drinking water and our medicines have ended up in rivers and lakes too. The best way to dispose of them is to throw them in the trash.

    tee
  7. gracenote

    gracenote All shall be well . . .

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    Hi tee,

    I've been told the best way to dispose of medication is to take it to select pharmacies who will dispose of it as a toxic substance, not put it into our landfills. You will need to call first to find out who will accept unneeded and outdated medication.
  8. mezombie

    mezombie Senior Member

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    Hi again, Beckster,

    I am a bit brainfogged ATM, but this might help answer your question (from post #27 on this thread, by MEAgenda):

    The International Advisory Group mentioned in this post can be found here: http://www.who.int/classifications/icd/TagMH/en/index.html

    I'm not sure about any deadlines.

    -----------------------

    Other points of interest:

    Jspotila did some research and found the US agency responsible for updating the ICD-9CM: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/icd/icd9cm_maintenance.htm

    The US also has a center that is responsible for collaborating with the WHO (World Health Organization) for the ICD (International Classification of Diseases): http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/icd/nacc.htm
  9. starryeyes

    starryeyes Senior Member

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    Ah okay, thank you.
  10. oerganix

    oerganix Senior Member

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    Yes, I am aware of that issue, hormones being the most dangerous in the water supply. But since the plumbing for my house was connected to a private septic tank, and I lived many miles from the closest creek or lake or neighbor in an area with near desert amounts of rainfall, I made that rather selfish choice. Regarding taking the meds to another pharmacy for disposal, I really didn't live close enough to one to make that a practical solution for me. (400 miles one-way) It would have been a huge expenditure in gas money and personal energy to drive that far just to 'do the right thing'. I had to drive 90 miles one-way just to see a doc that did not disdain me. Rural and small town living is really much different than life in the "big city".
  11. mezombie

    mezombie Senior Member

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    Yeah, I had a cool psych early on as well. The first doc I went to (an internist) suggested what I had was psychological. I didn't believe this, but desperately wanted to get well and had no place else to turn. The psych I saw referred me to an infectious disease specialist after watching me physically decline yet show no signs of depression.

    It would be hard to find her now (20 years later) but I may try.

    I really do think we need to get doctors like this to comment on the DSM-5 proposals, even if we have to draft a reply for them.

    Fresh_Eyes, what do you think about starting a new thread under the Activism section now that we have the DSM-5 proposals?

    MeZombie, formerly Marie
  12. Koan

    Koan Be the change.

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    Zombers!

    :hug:
  13. mezombie

    mezombie Senior Member

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    Rafiki/Koan!

    :hug:

    :D
  14. mezombie

    mezombie Senior Member

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    New York Times article on DSM-5 revision

    Posted by Jean Harrison (of Mothers Against M.E. aka MAME) on Co-Cure:
    (bold, italics, and underlines added)

    MZ
  15. starryeyes

    starryeyes Senior Member

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    Oh I see oerganix. Not that you have to explain yourself. I figured with your name that you knew what was going on.

    :hug:

    tee
  16. oerganix

    oerganix Senior Member

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    :innocent1:
    :hug:
    Hugs to you, too!
    :yinyang:(You've forced me to figure out how to use these thingys) :innocent1::innocent1::innocent1:(Sort of. These just sort of jumped here):innocent1::innocent1:
  17. Dx Revision Watch

    Dx Revision Watch Suzy Chapman dxrevisionwatch.com

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    UK
  18. Dx Revision Watch

    Dx Revision Watch Suzy Chapman dxrevisionwatch.com

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  19. Angela Kennedy

    Angela Kennedy *****

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    Suzy made this excellent comment on the Washington Examiner blog recently:

    http://washingtonexaminer.com:80/blogs/opinion-zone/2011/01/corrupting-psychiatry

  20. Enid

    Enid Senior Member

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    "Hell bent on colonising the entire medical field" is exactly where they are. One has to ask them - what's your problem ? They must think we are all (except them) stupid. Not too cool I'm afraid my psyche - going through a series of blackouts and forced onto me after another collapse and ambulanced to Accident & Emergency. All he could say was "what's the day today" ! ...............

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