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Stimulation of the Vagus Nerve: 'Nerve Hack' Offers Arthritis Sufferers Hope

Discussion in 'Other Health News and Research' started by ruben, Dec 23, 2014.

  1. ruben

    ruben

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    Interesting article today on Sky news about a new treatment from Holland for arthritis and suggestions it could be used for all kinds of other conditions. Just thought I'd highlight it.
     
    Sherlock likes this.
  2. Bob

    Bob

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    It's vagus nerve stimulation to treat rheumatoid arthritis, in a small study of 20 patients showing a 50% response rate:

    'Nerve Hack' Offers Arthritis Sufferers Hope
    http://news.sky.com/story/1396464/nerve-hack-offers-arthritis-sufferers-hope

     
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  3. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    Splenic nerve is required for cholinergic antiinflammatory pathway control of TNF in endotoxemia
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2504833/
     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2014
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  4. msf

    msf Senior Member

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    I think this could be a very exciting development. I definitely perked my interest (which is unusual for Sky News). It seems to me that, if the vagus nerve hypothesis that Cort wrote about on Phoenix Rising is true, and if other treatments for Rheumatoid Arthritis that affect the immune system, like Rituximab, also work in some ME patients, then there is a chance that this will also work for some. The article mentioned that they try it with other disorders too, such as diabetes, so it seems that it might have a more general application than has been shown so far.

    I would be interested in Prof. Edward's (or someone else who understands the immune system and Rheumatoid Arthritis) take on how this might work in RA, and whether it might prove effective in some people with ME.

    I would just like to point out that I do not usually get excited about new medical developments, and this one will obviously not be available for a long time (a doctor on the program suggested a timeframe of around 10 years), but if it proves effective for some patients then it would be a very elegant solution to their problems (assuming the side effects aren't too bad).
     
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  5. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    which leads to
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4178160/
     
  6. Sasha

    Sasha Fine, thank you

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  7. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    Yes, but that's for the expensive and profitable electronic device being developed by Pharma. That doesn't mean there are not cheaper and readily available means. Just thinking out loud: maybe shiatsu, maybe the electro-stimulators that are sold for abdominal muscle development, maybe nicotine.
     
  8. msf

    msf Senior Member

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    Hmm, in the article they said that it was twisted around the vagus nerve, so it would be difficult to an effect that was that specific, assuming that is that is has to be specific.
     
  9. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    Poking around, I see diaphragmatic breathing being recommended to stimulate the vagus nerve.
     
  10. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards "Gibberish"

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    I think I would like to see some data, and information about trial design. I find it very hard to see why stimulating the vagus nerve should help RA - and it seems the authors have no idea either. I don't think I will be holding my breath on this one.
     
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  11. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    The idea seems to be that as macrophages pass through the spleen they get exposed to regulatory chemicals which are secreted by nerve ends which are controlled by the vagus nerve. The chemicals tell the macrophages to not produce TNF etc

    http://brainimmune.com/role-of-the-vagus-nerve-at-the-neural-immune-interface/

    [​IMG]


    Various animal studies are cited. I suppose it makes sense that the CNS can influence immunity. when you see the bear, the body gets reading for injury and infection.
     
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  12. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    High fat diet stimulates vagus nerve and downregulates inflammation?


    Nutritional stimulation of cholecystokinin receptors inhibits inflammation via the vagus nerve

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2213207/
    sounds similar to canola - I haven't seen other fats tried (e.g. olive oil has more SFA than PUFA) .

     
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2014
  13. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    Help for leaky gut?


    Stimulating the Central Nervous System to Prevent Intestinal Dysfunction After Traumatic Brain Injury

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4251579/



    upload_2014-12-23_16-17-4.png
     
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  14. garcia

    garcia Aristocrat Extraordinaire

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    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...ts-leave-some-patients-pain-free-9941001.html
     
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  15. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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    Last edited: Dec 23, 2014
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  16. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    Did the gnarled nature of the fingers regress any?
     
  17. natasa778

    natasa778 Senior Member

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    I couldn't find info on that @Sherlock here is the most detailed report I could find:

    Eight weeks after his surgery, this first patient returned to work, performed manual labor, and drove a delivery truck. When asked about how he felt before and after the surgery, he made it very clear that the vagus nerve stimulator therapy had alleviated the severe pain in his joints. A review of his laboratory test results indicated that his serum levels of CRP, a marker of inflammation that is often elevated in arthritis patients, had fallen from an abnormally high value (more than 20 milligrams per liter), to a normal level (1.2 milligrams per liter). His quality-of-life measures and the number of joints that were swollen, painful, and tender were all significantly improved. His face wore an expression of unbridled joy, gratitude, and relief. ...
    :)

    www.dana.org/Cerebrum/2012/A_New_Approach_to_Rheumatoid_Arthritis__Treating_Inflammation_with_Computerized_Nerve_Stimulation/
     
  18. Sherlock

    Sherlock tart cherry etc. for joints, insomnia

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    ...and some of the inevitable complexity:
    "Vagus Nerve Infection in Chronic Fatigue Syndrome"
    http://chronicfatigue.about.com/b/2013/07/10/vagus-nerve-infection-chronic-fatigue-syndrome.htm

    --------------------

    (Plus, I wonder if people with vasovagal syncopy or neuro mediated hypotension should avoid this altogether.)
     
    natasa778 likes this.
  19. kangaSue

    kangaSue Senior Member

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