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Specific questions re heart rate monitoring

Discussion in 'Autonomic, Cardiovascular, and Respiratory' started by Anjikun, Oct 15, 2013.

  1. Anjikun

    Anjikun

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    Hello,

    I hope this is the right place to post this question. I recently bought a heart rate monitor to help with pacing, and I have a couple of specific questions.

    My heart rate lying in bed after I wake up (resting heart rate) seems to be right around 70, but sometimes during the day I notice it going down quite a bit lower than that (like mid 50s), especially when sitting on public transit and even when standing and waiting for the bus. Is this common?

    And this afternoon after lunch I took a nap, and noticed when I woke up (and was still in bed) that my heart rate was around 90. Is this from eating?

    Also, I am thinking of having exercise testing to determine my anaerobic threshold. The place I contacted (a sport facility) calls it "lactate testing", which I gather is basically the same thing. Is this the test that people with CFS do to help avoid post-exertional malaise? Are there any certain values that I should make sure the test includes?
     
  2. Sushi

    Sushi Moderator and Senior Member Albuquerque

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    Hi,

    I can't answer most of your questions above but I don't think the sport's facility's lactate testing would give you the same information as the kind of exercise testing members here have written about. Here is the gold standard: http://www.workwellfoundation.org/about-us/

    Best wishes,
    Sushi
     
  3. Anjikun

    Anjikun

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    I had a look at the link--very interesting. Unfortunately I can't travel there to take the test. Based on the checking around I did, the only testing I have access to here within my budget is the sports-oriented testing (just one session). The test I am thinking of doing ($200) will give me by V02max and lactate threshold (which is the same as anaerobic threshold). Are these parameters tested on the workwellfoundation test? I realize that their test is over 2 days. Is it the anaerobic threshold on the second day only that is used to set a limit on activity levels for pacing to reduce PEM?
     
  4. Sushi

    Sushi Moderator and Senior Member Albuquerque

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    Anjikun

    This page gives a lot of useful links: http://www.workwellfoundation.org/research-and-latest-news/

    I haven't checked but there may be sample test reports somewhere there. They test for just about everything I believe.

    I hope you will get some replies here from those who have actually taken this test and they can tell you much more about how it is used for pacing.

    Best,
    Sushi
     
  5. SOC

    SOC Senior Member

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    This is certainly not the Workwell gold standard test, but is probably sufficient for your purpose which is to determine your AT. I suggest you don't test to maximum if all you want is your AT for HR monitoring purposes. If you stop at your AT you are much less likely to suffer serious PEM. If you go all the way to maximal exercise, you will almost certainly suffer serious PEM. You won't have the VO2max data, but you don't need it for HR monitoring.

    If you need CPET data for disability or other documentory situation, then I don't think the test you are considering will be sufficient.

    If you only need AT data, make sure you confirm with your tester that you want to stop at your AT. You won't be able to tell yourself when you've reached that point.

    I have done the maximal exercise test and the test only to AT. I have not done the 2-day test. The test to AT was very much easier than the maximal test and gave the same AT result.

    My experience is that I cannot function continuously near my AT, even if I stay below it. For continuous activity, housework or walking, I need to stay around 80-90% of my AT to avoid consequences. I can go up to my AT briefly during things like stair-climbing or showering without consequences, but for longer continuous activity I have to aim lower. Going over my AT for more than a minute or so will definitely PEM me, so it's a great place for me to have an alarm set on my HR monitor. Alarm goes off, I sit... no matter what.

    It may be that the 2-day CPET would show a lower AT the second day which would be more accurate as a safe level for continuous activity. I just don't know enough to say.
     
  6. Anjikun

    Anjikun

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    Thanks so much for this information. I had asked the testing place about the VO2max because I thought it would be useful and it's only a bit more in terms of cost, but if it means I will have to exercise to max I definitely don't want to do it!
     
  7. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    I've got a heart monitoring question, so I will add it here.

    I recently bought a pulse oximeter to monitor my heart rate. It seem to me that it goes high very easily and varies a lot. The problem is that I don't really know what normal heart function looks like. Is there any web site that gives 'normal' heart rates for various levels of activity or describes normal heart rate in general?
     
  8. Shell

    Shell Senior Member

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    Can't think of a website just off hand but here's some basics:
    A healthy person's resting HR is between 65 to 80ish. Athletes can have resting HR of 50 but that would be bradycardic in a "normal" person.
    Resting HR of 90 + is a bit high. 100+ is tachycardic.
    Running could get a healthy person's HR up to 140s but if it's 140 just because you stood up that's not healthy.

    POTS is a raise in HR by 30 beats per minute within 5 to 10 minutes of standing or a HR of 120 + on standing.
    IST is a resting HR of 100+ with spikes above 120 when upright. Most of us (without meds) hit HR way higher than that,

    SATs should be 98 to 100. Low SATS are a pain in the bum but you can't usually get good treatment for that unless you are regularly below 88. Those with lungs that are shot are considered doing ok on SATS of 90 to 93. (It does't feel ok mind you).

    Hope that's a bit of a help.
     
    Valentijn likes this.
  9. Chris

    Chris Senior Member

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    Hi; I have been using a HR monitor for some time now--not all the time, but frequently. I am 80, but until various things (including of course ME) started up 8 years ago, was very active--resting HR ca. 55 or so. Could keep 145 for longish spells and feel fine. Now my resting HR is around 60-64; I find a brisk 8 min walk will raise it to around 94-98; I can then rest 4 mins and return at around the same HR, without triggering more than very slight short term (3 hours?) PEM I can also row for 1 min approx, which gets my HR to around 122, without serious PEM. If I go beyond those parameters, or pile activity upon activity, I trigger longer and more intense PEM.

    Experience will show you the parameters within which you should remain--and doubtless a VO2 max test would give more accurate figures.
    I also learned that the best way to trigger real PEM is to exercise again before you are fully recovered from the first bout; again, experience will show how long you have to wait. Exercise of course can mean anything from a marathon to preparing supper. The Monitor is a great learning tool. Chris
     
  10. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

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    You can see what your normal is when you're feeling (relatively) decent. A good time to check for that is when you've been laying down for a while, or soon after waking up (but not immediately when waking up). Generally I don't think there should be a lot of fluctuation from one moment to the next.

    When my very healthy fiance uses it, his oxygen saturation is always 96% and his heart rate is around 65 to 70. These values stay very steady and do not fluctuate. When I use it, my saturation is either at 99 or my heart rate is rising to try to keep my saturation at 99%. When I've been too active, my oxygen saturation will constantly dip, then rise again as my heart rate rises, at which time my heart rate will slow down a bit and oxygen will dip again, followed by heart rate rising again. Over and over again for hours or days.
     
  11. Little Bluestem

    Little Bluestem Senescent on the Illinois prairie, USA

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    Thanks all. My morning heart rate is in the upper 60s or occasionally low 70s, so I think I am good there. It doesn't take much to bring it up. Getting up and walking to the next room to answer the phone can take it to 110. It does come down to at least below 100 within a few minutes. I think the highest that I have seen it (that I believed) was 120. The instructions with the meter say that it may not work accurately when you are moving, so if I am wearing it while doing things and it really spikes, I assume it is an error.

    I do not have any clock with a second hand, but I just now did about a ten second check while sitting at my computer. It ranged up and down between 83 to 87 in that time. It seems to change about once/second.

    My saturation is usually 97 or 98. From the things I have read about possible poor blood flow to the brain in ME, I wonder if my brain is getting as much O2 as my finger.

    Here is a way I have found to reduce my HR when lying or sitting still. It works less dependable when I am up and about.
    I slowly take a deep breath, hold it about 3 seconds, then slowly exhale. My HR will drop 10 - 20, then start climbing back up. If I take another slow breath immediately, it makes no difference. If I wait a minute or two and do it again, it drop lower than the first time and come back up less high. Doing this 3 or 4 times will drop my HR 5 - 10.
    I did it 4 times while I was writing this and my HR is now ranging 78 - 80 in about 10 seconds.
     

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