Phoenix Rising supports the Millions Missing global day of protest
Phoenix Rising is delighted to support the demands being made in the ME/CFS community’s first-ever global day of protest …
Discuss the article on the Forums.

Some concerns about homeopathy

Discussion in 'Alternative Therapies' started by Esther12, Sep 9, 2017.

  1. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    No it was given to me as homeopathic medicine. It was not labelled as whatever diluted in it. It had my name on it and when to take it during the day and how many. I remember there was a dilution ratio and a code maybe, I did not even understand what was that about as I had no idea about what homeopathy was at that time.
     
  2. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    Sorry to dilute the thread but the essence is religion is being good, the essence is marriage is love, the essence of law is fairness, etc it goes on like this.

    Myths We Live By, Mary Midgley is a very good book, have you read it?
     
  3. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    I think we are not communicating very well. Thank you for your time to write this though. I was asking your opinion but you are supplying me with stuff that I'm kind of aware of. So, I assume you are agreeing with the mainstream info and satisfied with it.

    I know NHS is not private, I am talking about NHS and bribes does not need to be financial. Certain individuals maneuvered into positions of power that advanced pharmaceutical agenda politically. Usually most bribes happens in this kind of way in the western world. This would not be called a bribe, it is announced as promotion. However in the third world there are blatant financial exchanges occur.

    In terms of protective health care you mentioned above, I haven't experienced it at all in my area in general in the UK. I'm not only talking about myself, my family as a whole, for examole my father in law recently almost left to die with a gall bladder problem. It was so obvious he had it, but he was given anti nausea medicine and sent home in several times. When diagnosed, although it was now an emergency he had to wait such a long time, he was almost dying. He had so many difficulties and complications because of this. I really felt that they wanted him to die! Similar experience with my mother in law poorly diagnosed and treated with pernicious anemia had died. I have more examples regarding this issue. So I do not believe that there is any protective health care in NHS. There is only chaos. I had to pay for my fertility treatment in the past. They change the rule after I finished with it. They just do whatever is on the agenda as they please.

    I'm sure NICE is not interested in homeopathic treatment, they do not care that it helps some. And you will not accept this.

    So why do you think NHS has to make such drastic cuts? Where is all the money going to?
     
    arewenearlythereyet likes this.
  4. arewenearlythereyet

    arewenearlythereyet Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,478
    Likes:
    7,571
    To prop up an artificially low and unfair tax threshold that doesn't balance the books...so cut people's healthcare and pretend it's not happening. I think this is deviating away from the purpose of the thread though.
     
    Skycloud, Valentijn, Wonko and 2 others like this.
  5. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    I agree with your answer and agree it is diverting the thread.

    But most things are down to money and business unfortunately, including the health and medicine. It can touch the subject. Maybe we can avoid it if you wish.
     
  6. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,930
    Likes:
    14,556
    I suspect quite a few of us would not have ME if the vaccines of today been around in our childhood. I'm looking forward to the time when all herpesvirses have a vaccine, including EBV. I suspect this will reduce the incidence of ME and also various autoimmune diseases like MS.
     
    AndyPR, IreneF, alex3619 and 6 others like this.
  7. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,930
    Likes:
    14,556
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
    AndyPR, Mrs Sowester, Wonko and 5 others like this.
  8. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    I really would like to see this. At the moment herpes viruses are not treatable properly.

    Compared to multinational pharmaceutical drugs it is not a huge market, it really is not.
    Why is it more upsetting if it is more used in developed countries? How can they expect the rise, I wonder?

    There is a huge uncontrolled homeopathic stage is present in India as well. But I can't call it a market really because the numbers are not known. However, I know a lot of Indians use homeopathy.

    The world is not consisted of the "West" you know. Health is everyone's problem. All over the world. People in the "underdeveloped" countries are human too.
     
  9. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,930
    Likes:
    14,556
    I think you missed the point here!

    What makes you more upset - to see a rich person conned out of some money by false promises? Or a poor person conned out of the same amount of money (which is a lot more to them)?
     
    AndyPR, TigerLilea, TiredSam and 2 others like this.
  10. Mrs Sowester

    Mrs Sowester Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,032
    Likes:
    7,278
    If I packaged Mrs Sowester's Colic Cure, 10g sachets of powdered calcium with a single granule of something else in a small glass bottle, charged £7 and sold them to horse owners as a cure for colic @erin would you think I was a lovely caring horse lover or an exploitative charlatan?
    If I was aware of a pet owner treating their sick animal, such as a horse with colic, with homeopathic treatments and not seeking real medical treatment I would call the RSPCA.

    Selling these calcium pills to developing countries is abhorrent because it is exploitation. It is a sham treatment. They do not work. People who think they work are misattributing coincidental fluctuations in their conditions to homeopathy.
    If you personally are happy to spend your money on homeopathy then that is your choice. But to suggest selling homeopathy under the guise of real medicine to desperate people in developing countries is utterly disgusting and morally bankrupt.

    Homeopathic treatment funded by the NHS is being withdrawn because it doesn't work in any capacity other than a placebo. It proved to be a waste of public funds.
     
  11. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    I actually did not try to make any point there. I just responded to your concerns.

    The question is very irrelevant, I'm not thinking in terms of money spent by individuals. I'm thinking in terms of public money and establishments. Because I got there by commenting on NHS spending in the first place and the politics of it.
     
  12. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member

    Messages:
    8,449
    Likes:
    28,522
    I think that there may have been confusion caused by a typo here:

     
    Hutan and Mrs Sowester like this.
  13. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    I disagree, because it worked with me.

    I could never deny anyone any treatment that it worked for them.

    I don't know anything about animal homeopathy, are you saying they are sold to humans in third world? Is this what's bothering you?

    I'm not familiar that homeopathy used in other "underdeveloped" countries apart from India. They produce the remedies themselves though. But there is a huge, I mean huge multinational pharma deals in "underdeveloped" world and there is a lot of corruption involved in it, quite openly actually.
     
  14. skipskip30

    skipskip30 Senior Member

    Messages:
    237
    Likes:
    1,409
    Personally id say selling sugar pills with no objective evidence at all that they work is corruption too. But thats just me.
     
    Hutan, AndyPR, TiredSam and 4 others like this.
  15. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,930
    Likes:
    14,556
    Oh woops, fixed!
     
    Esther12 likes this.
  16. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,930
    Likes:
    14,556
    My statement wasn't specific to individuals - it was to try and highlight for you what the problem is with marketing unproven treatments to poorer individuals/organisations. It doesn't matter whether payment occurs at the individual, organisational or government level. If money is tight, then every bit you spend on homeopathy is less you can put into proper medical treatment.

    I think you said that if you had a serious health problem, like cancer or malaria, you'd opt for conventional medicine, not homeopathy.

    If so, then surely you must agree that what the developing world needs is greater access to effective health care to treat serious health problems. Not to homeopathy, whose effectiveness has not been demonstrated - except for its effectiveness in making Western corporations fat with profits.

    Can I just further underline the evils of the CAM industry here? All industries are there to make money, including the pharmaceutical industry. Make no mistake, they're all bastards.

    But the largest homeopathy corporations actually turn a bigger profit than most pharma companies. Why? What they earn is pretty much pure profit. They don't have to plough money into R&D, they don't have to do major clinical trials, they don't have the administrative and legal costs of getting their products past drug administration regulations. Oh, and the ingredients are super cheap (the quantities are so small!). There are no rules to regulate the industry either, and the products are not only sold freely without proof that they work, but apparently without regular checks as to what's actually in them.

    That's outrageous in my opinion, and I'm really angry to think these companies will be getting even fattier at the expense of the developing world.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2017
    Hutan, AndyPR, Sea and 12 others like this.
  17. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    Well, sorry but you have written rich person, poor person but nothing about any organizational. What am I supposed to make of the statement What makes you more upset - to see a rich person conned out of some money by false promises? Or a poor person conned out of the same amount of money (which is a lot more to them)?"?

    Ofcourse, I have just had cortisone injection. I use conventional medicine regularly, I mentioned horrid synthyroids I have to take etc. I have a lot of adventures with conventional stuff. I was given abundant amount of them. Not necessarily helped. This does not mean I want them to be scrapped or anything like it.

    Oh don't worry, conventional medicine is abundantly used in "developing" world. But is it the effective health care? M.E. is not even recognized in many areas in the world that is not "developed" yet. So, alternative is absolutely luxury and not even known, and if it was known absolutely hated and not used in "developing" world. It is looked down on it as old fashion, backward because the "West" had to be followed strictly.

    So you really don't need to worry about homeopathy flourishing in "developing" world. If you do I'd say it is a huge over reaction.

    You can if you wish. But comparing them with the multinational pharmaceuticals is a bit like comparing the speed of the rabbit and the tortoise.

    I really can not agree on this. Honestly this sounds so far out.

    You need to bring solid details here, real numbers to make such a statement.

    Most conventional medicine used abundantly, prescribed by the NHS's of the world, even in some parts of the "developing" world are produced very cheaply. Most antibiotics, blockers, thyroid, bp medicine, pain killers, blood thinners. Yes, there are some expensive cancer medicine maybe profits are not big on them.

    I think you are over worrying about something is not there.
    But multinational pharmaceuticals had caused a lot of scandals in "developing" world by bribing openly and selling the conventional medicine 3 times more expensive to some countries. And this is seriously worrying.
     
    pamojja likes this.
  18. Woolie

    Woolie Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,930
    Likes:
    14,556
    You might be right that I'm worrying too much.

    I do agree that pharmaceutical companies are bastards too. I just don't think that let's the CAM industry off the hook.
     
    Hutan, AndyPR, Orla and 5 others like this.
  19. erin

    erin Senior Member

    Messages:
    749
    Likes:
    2,101
    Are you talking about refreshing mints, throat pastilles made from ginger, lemon, eucalipthus etc with so called soothing effect?:D

    Yes that's just you.
    To me homeopathy is not a sugar pill. So I can hardly relate to your sweeping statement. And that's just me. Sweeping statements and I, are not good together.
     
    pamojja likes this.
  20. Londinium

    Londinium Senior Member

    Messages:
    165
    Likes:
    1,367
    True, you don't even get any sugar as it's been diluted so much :D
     

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page