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Silenor (Ultra Low Dose Doxepin) for Insomnia

Discussion in 'General Treatment' started by TheMoonIsBlue, May 15, 2011.

  1. TheMoonIsBlue

    TheMoonIsBlue Senior Member

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    Has anyone tried Silenor- which is just Doxepin (just they found a new way to patent it as a sleep med) in ultra low dose 3mg or 6mg.

    It seems to be indicated for "sleep maintance" problems (i.e. problems staying asleep)

    Has anyone used it in addition to a sleep initiating medication?

    Some people were posting that 1mg of Doxepin helped them sleep! I don't think the brand name (Silenor) would be needed if the generic is in tablet form and you can cut it into very small doses.

    I am VERY scared of AD's because of previous bad side effects but am wondering if a very very low dose like 3mg, or less, might be helpful without the bad side effects.
  2. Nielk

    Nielk

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    I'm in the same boat as you as far as taking ADs.
    Cheney recommends taking low dose Doxepin along with Klonopin. It's supposed to act as an AD, help with sleep and also acts as an antihistamine.
    Since I'm already on Klonopin my doctor prescribed me Doxeprin 25mg.
    This just happened two weeks ago. The first few days were ok but then I started feeling worse to the point where by day ten I hardly slept even though I continued my other sleep regiment of Klonopin and Ambien. It obviously didn't agree with me so I went off it and it took a couple of days to get back to where I was before.

    This is my personal experience. I'm sure everyone reacts differently. In addition, you are talking about a much smaller dosage.
  3. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    probably cheaper to just by doxepin then the silenor. Can get doxepin in 10mg dosages which is quite low. When i first used it for sleep i still needed 50mg but now it doesnt work at all. But i will say it was a great sleep med for a few years and no side effects other then feeling abit groggy when i first wake up and also once the sedation effects stopped woking for me that is when my appetitte started to go up, probably because instead of falling asleep i was eating, lol.

    cheers!!!
  4. Rooney

    Rooney

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    Doxepin is also available in liquid form with a dropper so you can take exactly what you need. A life-saver for me to keep me asleep in the early morning. I started with 5 mg.


    Good luck.
  5. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    The sedation effect of doxepin is through its action as an antihistamine, its antidepressant effects apparently dont start working until u get into the 75mg dosage and up. This is how most tricyclic antidepressants work for sleep as well as the serotonin receptor 5ht2 receptors if my memory is correct, some serotonin recptors are stimulating which is why some ad's are not sedating.

    Most meds work through either gaba receptors, histamine, 5ht2, melatonin, or dopamine, usually its a combo of 2 of these. Also calcium channel blocking effects of anticonvulsants too.
    So i try to use medications that cover 2-3 of these mechanisms for sleep. So Cheney's recommendations of klonopin and doxepin would cover gaba receptors, histamine and 5ht2 recptors and should improve sleep, but there is also drug tolerance that can build up so eventually will need to change these meds to something different.

    cheers!!!
    Questus likes this.
  6. TheMoonIsBlue

    TheMoonIsBlue Senior Member

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    Hi Nielk, That's too bad it didn't work out for you :( I wonder if a lower dose would be worth trying? Many people online who posted negative things said it only worked for sleep if they took very low doses...like between 1-3 mg. The Silenor only comes in 3 and 6 mg.

    I wonder sometimes how many medications we may "miss out" on because our prescribed doses are too high and we have bad reactions. I guess I'm talking about people who are very sensitive to meds and perhaps slow metabolizers (I think I am both). --Heapsreal, it sounds like you are a fast metabolizer LOL!

    Sometimes I wonder about the older generation of sleep meds which are practically obsolte now, if there may be something there?

    What did they take in 1900 for Insomnia? :)
  7. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    The moon is blue, i have found baclofen a good add on to other sleep meds to improve sleep quality and length, i have also used lyrica and neurontin in the past with success. Supplements of phosphatidylserine and tryptophan have also helped.

    cheers!!!
  8. Nielk

    Nielk

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    They probably took a shot of whiskey and they probably didn't have the sickness of CFS in those days.

    Did you try Ambien for sleep?
  9. TheMoonIsBlue

    TheMoonIsBlue Senior Member

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    Hah, You're probably right. That is one remedy I won't be trying.

    I only tried Ambien CR a few times. I only remember it took foreverrrr to kick in. I can see why some people may get up and do weird things. I never tried regular Ambien. Is it true it only gives about 4-5 hours sleep? I wouldn't mind at all adding it to clonaz but I don't know if my doc would go for it. Trazodone used to work but the last time I tried it I had a horrible reaction.

    Barbiturates got replaced by -azepam drugs because the lethal toxicity level is so much higher, but are they just messing up our ability to sleep even more in the long run? People seemed to sleep better on barbits.
  10. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    If u want to get knocked out look into seroquel, its great for that. I use it once a week for catch up sleep.
  11. TheMoonIsBlue

    TheMoonIsBlue Senior Member

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    I know my doc will never go for Seroquel and frankly, I would be too terrified to try it. If even low doses of AD's for sleep make me *crazy like* I'd be afraid what it would do to me. Be careful about your blood sugar with Seroquel....

    Heaps, I think you are Superman when it comes to sleep meds! The doses you take would have me out for a week. Maybe that is what I need!
  12. Nielk

    Nielk

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    my bedtime cocktail every night is 3mg Klonopin, two Tylenol PMs and 12-5 Ambien CR and I usually get 7 hours of sleep. I still wake up tired but, I do get those hours of sleep.
  13. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    I was very apprehensive of seroquel but after researching it more, side effects tend to occurr at higher doses then used for insomnia like 800mg a day, apparently sedation is limited to 200mg and higher doses dont help. I only use it very sparingly in doses between 50-100mg and for some reason 50mg is working better then 100mg??? My gp has a few hardcore insomniacs who he prescribes it for and they havent had any drama's. But dont let me talk u into it. I just got to the point of getting very desperate for sleep and now find using seroquel once a week helps reset my sleep and traditional sleep meds then tend to work again. But like i have mentioned, i need to rotate my sleep meds regularly or they dont work.

    cheers!!!
  14. hollie9

    hollie9

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    I LOVE doxepin and have been taking it for almost 16 years (since I caught CFS). I use the liquid form which is very cheap and a person could do very low doses easily with the liquid.

    It gives me deep, long lasting sleep and I get antidepressant benefits from it too. I can't take any SSRIs, so this is the only AD I can handle.

    I've gone down to 12 mg, and the highest I've been is now, 45 mg. I've been through a very stressful time (husband and mother died recently, moved 3 times) so had to raise the dosage for the AD benefits, and it works for me. I tried dropping my dosage not long ago but started getting quite depressed due to grief and moved back up.

    Many docs love Doxepin. I've been told by a neurologist and internist separately, that it is good for the immune system. I went through menopause with no symptoms at all, and my primary told me it was because of the doxepin.

    The main bummer of doxepin is that it makes it hard to lose weight and may slow the metabolism as far as weight loss goes. But I have lost weight with it if I reduce dosage.

    When starting doxepin it's important to start with really small doses since it takes awhile for the body to get used to it and I get really groggy and unbalanced if I take too much.

    I found the antidepressant benefits don't kick in for a month or so.

    Hollie

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