Invest in ME Conference 12: First Class in Every Way
OverTheHills wraps up our series of articles on this year's 12th Invest in ME International Conference (IIMEC12) in London with some reflections on her experience as a patient attending the conference for the first time.
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Self-Critical Perfectionism Predicts Lower Cortisol Response to Experimental Stress in Cfs Patients

Discussion in 'Latest ME/CFS Research' started by voner, Dec 23, 2015.

  1. voner

    voner Senior Member

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    I think this quote from the abstract explains all....."We conducted a quasi-experimental study to examine the association"

    i'm always wondering – "how do these ridiculous studies get funded?"..... quasi-experimental study!!!! association!!!
     
    Roseblossom, leela, PennyIA and 3 others like this.
  2. duncan

    duncan Senior Member

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    This study write-up would seem to suggest none of the authors suffers from SCP.
     
    Woolie, Roseblossom, leela and 15 others like this.
  3. A.B.

    A.B. Senior Member

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    People who have taken cortisol have probably noticed that it increases stress tolerance. From the wording I'd guess the authors believe it's the other way around.
     
    Scarecrow likes this.
  4. TiredSam

    TiredSam The wise nematode hibernates

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    Uncritically.
     
  5. Aurator

    Aurator Senior Member

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    Unfortunately, they forgot to do a preliminary study to establish whether SCP actually exists.

    This study has earned its place in the same category as studies such as how many angels can dance simultaneously on the head of a pin. The only difference between the two is that the theological study probably caused less harm than the present one will.
     
    Scarecrow, Webdog, A.B. and 2 others like this.
  6. worldbackwards

    worldbackwards A unique snowflake

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    The irony is that there's nothing like ME to get rid of any perfectionist traits that you might have. Under-achieving? Other things to worry about. Done the dishes? Another time...
     
    JaimeS, Grigor, Gemini and 21 others like this.
  7. Snow Leopard

    Snow Leopard Hibernating

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    JaimeS and biophile like this.
  8. TiredSam

    TiredSam The wise nematode hibernates

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    Say Amen, Somebody.
     
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  9. voner

    voner Senior Member

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    another question is why do these ridiculous/ unrigorous studies get published? Who is wasting $ by funding these journals that publish these ridiculous studies?
     
    JaimeS likes this.
  10. JayS

    JayS Senior Member

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    And then there's this. Happy Holidays.

    Significant other behavioural responses and patient chronic fatigue syndrome symptom fluctuations in the context of daily life: An experience sampling study.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26700742


    "Significant other responses to patients' symptoms are important for patient illness outcomes in chronic fatigue syndrome (CFS/ME); negative responses have been associated with increased patient depression, whilst increased disability and fatigue have been associated with solicitous significant other responses. The current study aimed to examine the relationship between significant other responses and patient outcomes within the context of daily life."
     
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  11. TiredSam

    TiredSam The wise nematode hibernates

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    Why don't these authors get a job? Burger King. Anything.
     
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  12. worldbackwards

    worldbackwards A unique snowflake

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    Imagine telling people about what you do. "If I could make sure that one, just one, patient had their support networks cut off today, so they were left floundering in a world of pain, exhaustion and severe disablement with no help and no one to fight their corner, then I can truly say that I've done some good in this world. Some people may earn more than I do, but you can't buy this kind of job satisfaction, the ability to really make a difference..."
     
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  13. Cheshire

    Cheshire Senior Member

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    Significant other behavioural responses and patient chronic fatigue syndrome symptom fluctuations in the context of daily life: An experience sampling study.

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26700742



    The paragraph about limitations of the study is interesting. It contradicts all of their claims.

    But they nonetheless keep implying this causal link exists throughout all the study.

    So the significant others response has in fact no long term impact. And therefore is negligible...

    Anyway, they in fact don't have sufficient data to establish any sound conclusion.

    But... the first line of the abstract is "Significant other responses to patients' symptoms are important for patient illness outcomes in chronic fatigue syndrome".

    It's time these people stop feeling allowed to claim what they fancy despite null results.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015
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  14. voner

    voner Senior Member

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    I agree. I once again ask the questions "how do these studies get funded?" , "How do these studies get published?"

     
  15. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    There are two ways that you can interpret a statement like the above.


    • The first interpretation, which I do not agree with, is that the mental stance of perfectionism could play a role in the development of the mental and cognitive symptoms of ME/CFS.

    This proposed causality operates at the level of mind: it posits that a mental disposition or trait like perfectionism could, via a mental causal mechanism, play role in triggering the mental symptoms of ME/CFS.

    I disagree with this, because by and large, in abnormal psychology, I don't think the mental level is where we should be looking for the causes of mental symptoms. Where we should be looking is at the physical (brain) level for the causes of mental symptoms.


    • So the second interpretation of the above statement is that the underlying brain disposition that causes perfectionism traits may also play a role in the development of ME/CFS mental symptoms.

    Now this is a different interpretation, because it proposes a possible cause-and-effect relationship at the level of brain, not the level mind.

    It suggests that whatever the physical setup in the brain that gives rise to perfectionism traits, this physical setup might also play a casual role in ME/CFS.
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015
  16. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member

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    Should this get a new thread? Could copy/paste posts. Seems to have gone OT in here.
     
  17. TiredSam

    TiredSam The wise nematode hibernates

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    I'd say there's at least a third interpretation, which is that the above statement about "previous studies" doesn't contain any references, it's merely a claim. There may well be other "studies" of a similar quality to this "study", in which case nothing was established, so there is nothing to interpret.

    If we really need an interpretation, mine is that some whack-jobs just wrote some stuff.
     
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  18. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015
  19. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member

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    Do you think that any of them hold up to any real critical analysis? I've seen a lot of bad and spun work in this area.
     
    JaimeS, Valentijn and TiredSam like this.
  20. Snowdrop

    Snowdrop Rebel without a biscuit

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    Is there some mechanism for suggesting a paper for retraction? I know retraction watch just keeps track of the papers that have been retracted but how does the process work for choosing what needs reviewing.

    Anymore papers like this and I'll need to rest my eyeballs from all the rolling they do.

    And if this 'theory' is so robust perhaps they should have used air traffic controllers as a sample group. Do they have a higher than average incidence of ME? Their job pretty much requires perfection.

    You would think that this stuff would be weeded out simply because it causes psych researchers to look like blundering fools. Or do the leaders in the field/those responsible for journals consider this real research?

    And if so why?

    Should we blame a personality trait perhaps?
     
    jimells, TiredSam and voner like this.

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