Phoenix Rising tells QMUL: release the PACE trial data
Mark Berry, Acting CEO of Phoenix Rising, presents the Board of Directors’ open letter to Queen Mary University of London (QMUL) urging them to release the PACE trial data, and hopes that other non-UK organisations will join British charities in the same request...
Discuss the article on the Forums.

Searching for liver congestion tips

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by jason30, Jul 10, 2017.

  1. jason30

    jason30 Senior Member

    Messages:
    214
    Likes:
    85
    The Netherlands
    Hi all,

    Most of my health problems (MCS, mold illness, CFS) have to do with my liver problems.
    I have liver congestion plus a fatty liver.

    I am searching for tips to deal with this congested liver. Does anyone have any experience dealing with these liver problems?

    Currently I take choline bitrate for rasing choline and malic acid for the energy. Both gives me temporarily relief.

    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. xrayspex

    xrayspex Senior Member

    Messages:
    973
    Likes:
    242
    u.s.a.
    some people like milk thistle tincture but I became sensitive to it, just feel sort of reactive to it like some foods, yuck
    I use charcoal a lot to mop up toxins, helps, drink lots of water and dont take with supplements

    some people like dandelion tea

    I think simple is good, avoid meds, chems, and go easy on the supplements, low and slow and pulse like Dr Cheney advises

    I am curious what others say as have been thinking I want to do more if possible...with MCS I just need to be cautious
     
    ChrisD and jason30 like this.
  3. Crux

    Crux Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,101
    Likes:
    768
    USA
    In the past, I had MCS, I think it was from liver trouble brought on by iron overload. Of course there was CFS.
    I used to be highly sensitive to mold, which was caused by copper deficiency.

    I had a lot of liver pain brought on by a lesion. I believe the iron overload was causal.

    I don't think I've had a fatty liver yet, because I've been lowering iron and increasing copper.

    Here's a good article about high iron, low copper, and NAFLD :
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4342600/
     
    xrayspex and jason30 like this.
  4. jason30

    jason30 Senior Member

    Messages:
    214
    Likes:
    85
    The Netherlands
    @xrayspex Thanks!
    I react to milk thistle unfortunately. The reason could be that Milk thistle is very high in salicylates.
    Will look into dandelion tea.

    @Crux Thanks!
    Which tests determine your iron overload? I have high iron saturation (51%) but a good ferritin level of 120 ug/L (range: 0 - 250).

    How did you threat your high iron and low copper? Did you also took Zinc with it?
     
    xrayspex and Crux like this.
  5. ljimbo423

    ljimbo423 Senior Member

    Messages:
    482
    Likes:
    736
    United States, New Hampshire
    Hello @jason30 - I take a lot of supps for my liver. Dandelion root, alpha lipoic acid, NAC, Acetyl carnitine, SAM-e, TMG, methylcobalamin and methylfolte.

    Anything that improves methylation or helps to increase glutathione, helps the liver to detoxify toxins. All the things I have mentioned here are good for liver health.

    Jim
     
    ebethc and jason30 like this.
  6. Crux

    Crux Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,101
    Likes:
    768
    USA
    Hi,

    I had two iron panels done , 3 months apart. Each included : Serum Iron, Iron Saturation %, Serum Ferritin, TIBC, and UIBC.

    My serum iron was in normal range. It shows recent iron intake.
    First time, Iron Sat. was , 51 %.
    Ferritin was 328 .
    TIBC and UIBC were low, indicating iron overload.

    I had been taking copper for a month, so, I'm sure the results would have been worse. ( history of symptoms )

    After taking copper for 3 more months,
    Iron Sat. % was 42,
    Ferritin was 285, still too high
    TIBC and UIBC moved up into normal range.

    Apparently, copper normalized the iron panel, though ferritin was still high.

    After the 2nd test, I began to take some supplemental iron chelators :

    R-lipoic acid - ~ 60 mg. daily
    Green tea - for tannin and EGCG* varying amounts.
    Quercetin - 250 mg.
    Melatonin - 1 mg. ( it chelates iron )
    I eat foods with phytates and oxylates to chelate iron.

    I take B12 and Zinc - They compete with iron in the intestines for absorption.
    I take the copper and zinc separately so they won't compete.
    B vitamins are needed for iron metabolism - I take a low dose B complex.

    I vary the chelators amounts and skip some days here and there.

    *I just tried EGCG alone this weekend, and had some bad insomnia. I forgot , it is strong. It can be hard on the liver in high amounts, so it may be better to just have a cup of green tea daily rather than straight EGCG.

    - I take 2 mg. copper glycinate.
    I may lower it because I've been eating copper foods more.

    I would be more concerned with the elevated Transferrin Saturation % than the Ferritin. It's more indicative of iron overload .
     
    jason30 likes this.
  7. Tammy

    Tammy Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,070
    Likes:
    1,401
    New Mexico
    What is your diet like? Animal fats really clog up the liver. I'm not saying you have to go vegan..........just consider cutting down to give the liver a break.
     
    jason30 likes this.
  8. TenuousGrip

    TenuousGrip Senior Member

    Messages:
    179
    Likes:
    600
    xrayspex likes this.
  9. Critterina

    Critterina Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,202
    Likes:
    700
    Arizona, USA
    Vitamins A, C, E, Alpha-lipoic acid - over time.
     
  10. jason30

    jason30 Senior Member

    Messages:
    214
    Likes:
    85
    The Netherlands
    Thanks @ljimbo423 , I will look into those.
    What does L-carnitine for the liver? I have used L-carnitine in the past for inflammation, it worked really well.
     
  11. jason30

    jason30 Senior Member

    Messages:
    214
    Likes:
    85
    The Netherlands
    Thanks for your extensive reaction @Crux . Helps me a lot.
    I'll do some new testing and see if I still have iron overload. And will look into the iron chelators.
     
    Crux likes this.
  12. jason30

    jason30 Senior Member

    Messages:
    214
    Likes:
    85
    The Netherlands
    Thanks @Tammy !
    Didn't knew animal fats clogs up the liver. I am currently busy with changing my diet, wants more good fats and less carbs.
     
  13. jason30

    jason30 Senior Member

    Messages:
    214
    Likes:
    85
    The Netherlands
    Very informative link, thanks @TenuousGrip !
     
    TenuousGrip likes this.
  14. jason30

    jason30 Senior Member

    Messages:
    214
    Likes:
    85
    The Netherlands
    Thanks @Critterina , what does E for the liver?
     
  15. ljimbo423

    ljimbo423 Senior Member

    Messages:
    482
    Likes:
    736
    United States, New Hampshire
    Fats are broken down to fatty acids to be used as fuel by the mitochondria.
    L-carnitine or Acetyl-l-carnitine, help transport fatty acids across the mitochondrial membrane to be used in the krebs cycle for energy, helping to lower fat levels.



    link


    I've also seen a few studies where carnitine helped non-alcoholic fatty liver disease.
     
  16. PatJ

    PatJ far and free I gaze

    Messages:
    1,897
    Likes:
    5,179
    Canada
    This article from Dr. Berkson might be useful to you. He is/was known for helping people avoid liver transplants throught the use of ALA, Silymarin (milk thistle), selenium, and LDN. He also has this to say about lecithin and the liver:
     
    Little Bluestem likes this.
  17. Basilico

    Basilico Florida

    Messages:
    827
    Likes:
    1,974
    I know I have the beginnings of some liver issues, since my liver enzymes are always mildly elevated even though I rarely drink alcohol and have a very healthy diet, so I'm always interested in things that can help the liver perform better. I suspect my husband also has some liver issues, since he often has trouble processing even low levels of alcohol, though his liver enzymes are always normal. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23643929

    It has been widely hypothesized that one big issue for CFS patients is low glutathione levels, which is necessary for liver detoxification, among other very important things. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2596047/

    To increase endogenous glutathione, my husband just started a new probiotic called Lactobacillus Fermentum. I started a post about it here: http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...ione-improves-heart-health.52393/#post-868166.

    Perhaps this probiotic is something you might want to consider taking.
     
    PatJ likes this.
  18. Critterina

    Critterina Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,202
    Likes:
    700
    Arizona, USA
    It's an antioxidant like vitamin C, I think.
     
  19. ebethc

    ebethc Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,206
    Likes:
    785

    Have you tried EGCG? what dosage?

    ALA + Vitamin C (from Tapioca) have been amazing for clearing oxidative stress; SAM-e works, then poops out, plus it's hard on my stomach

    Are you affected by damp weather? we're back to high humidity (98%) but we hardly ever have the dreaded combo of high heat + high damp here, so at least there's that :)
     
    ljimbo423 likes this.
  20. ljimbo423

    ljimbo423 Senior Member

    Messages:
    482
    Likes:
    736
    United States, New Hampshire
    Hi ebethc- I have tried egcg but I never really gave it a chance to see if it would help. I'm pretty sure I am TH2 dominant and egcg is suppose to increase TH2 immunity, so I didn't take it very long.

    I had the same experience with SAM-e seemingly not working after a while. When I cut back on it though I feel noticeably worse, so it must be doing something.:) I take the enteric coated so have no problem with the stomach.

    I used to be affected by damp weather but I don't notice it any more. High heat and humidity though, will wipe me out!:eek::sleep:
    98% humidity with heat would almost kill me.:lol:

    I'm still working on my gut and slowly improving. I started inulin (prebiotic) a few days ago and so far so good. I'm feeling better and my IBS-D has improved a lot!

    One of the best ways to take a huge load off the liver is to get rid of dysbiosis and a leaky gut.

    Jim
     
    ebethc likes this.

See more popular forum discussions.

Share This Page