Ron Davis featured in "nature" journal of science article

[AndyPR]

I feel like the movie could have an even bigger impact in Britain.

I certainly hope this is the case but I have my doubts. From the outside, it seems to me that the Scandinavian region was already starting to have a greater awareness of ME and the issues surrounding it, so maybe Unrest coming along was perfect timing, while in the UK we are still stuck in the Dark Ages regarding ME. But I'm more than happy to be proved wrong, so let's hope that is what happens.

 

[adreno]

From the outside, it seems to me that the Scandinavian region was already starting to have a greater awareness of ME

The case of Karina Hansen would suggest otherwise.

 

[Sidereal]

Scandinavia strikes me as ground zero of psychosomatic mind-body bullshit.

 

[AndyPR]

The case of Karina Hansen would suggest otherwise.

Sorry, I disagree. While I wouldn't ever wish Karina's experience on anyone, one aspect of it is an increase in awareness, due to articles written and printed about it. Now I'm sure there would have been varying reactions from the general public who saw those articles, ranging from conversion to "our" side, through apathy, to a "well, she was obviously making it up so she got what she deserved". But now add Unrest to that, and the number who view ME in a more appropriate light will have increased.

What happened to Karina happened, in part, due to a lack of general awareness of ME, her release happened, in part, due to an increase of that same awareness.

 

[A.B.]

I certainly hope this is the case but I have my doubts. From the outside, it seems to me that the Scandinavian region was already starting to have a greater awareness of ME and the issues surrounding it, so maybe Unrest coming along was perfect timing, while in the UK we are still stuck in the Dark Ages regarding ME. But I'm more than happy to be proved wrong, so let's hope that is what happens.

What about France, Germany, etc.? I've seen a few articles by German authors and they seem to be even worse than their UK colleagues. Europe seems to be infested by Freudian thinking.

 

[AndyPR]

What about France, Germany, etc.? I've seen a few articles by German authors and they seem to be even worse than their UK colleagues. Europe seems to be infested by Freudian thinking.

Lol, where did I deny that anywhere else has an issue? I'm just expressing my opinion of the situation in the UK, in reply to a comment that hoped that Unrest would have a positive effect in the UK.

 

[Solstice]

Lol, where did I deny that anywhere else has an issue? I'm just expressing my opinion of the situation in the UK, in reply to a comment that hoped that Unrest would have a positive effect in the UK.

It could atleast get the ball rolling. Get some coverage, give us a podium to come 'round with some facts etc. Gotta start somewhere .

 

[Tally]

Not much of interest so far. Consists mostly of comments from a grad student criticizing Davis for being an amateur and a newbie.

It's on front page of /r/science. That's quite an achievement. I am not surprised there are not many comments, general population doesn't know enough about ME/CFS to add to the discussion.

That comment was very prejudiced and moderators removed it since it broke the very strict rules of commenting on /r/science.

 

[Solstice]

It's on front page of /r/science. That's quite an achievement. I am not surprised there are not many comments, general population doesn't know enough about ME/CFS to add to the discussion.

That comment was very prejudiced and moderators removed it since it broke the very strict rules of commenting on /r/science.

I'm curious as to what he typed, but I guess i'll never find out. Seems he is countered well though.

 

[A.B.]

I'm curious as to what he typed, but I guess i'll never find out. Seems he is countered well though.

He said his mentor had worked on CFS and that his mentor had seen these claims, which ultimately didn't replicate, many times before.

He made a long list of presumed red flags which seemed to be mostly due to his own ignorance on the subject. He cautioned against pseudoscientific explanations involving the microbiome, and suggested that the involved authors were inexperienced. He obviously said this without looking up their names.

I don't think he was malicious, he was just poorly informed and carried some prejudice against the illness.

In the end he even acknowledged that he may have misjudged the situation but the moderators removed it anyway it seems.

 

[trishrhymes]

He said his mentor had worked on CFS and that his mentor had seen these claims, which ultimately didn't replicate, many times before.

He made a long list of presumed red flags which seemed to be mostly due to his own ignorance on the subject. He cautioned against pseudoscientific explanations involving the microbiome, and suggested that the involved authors were inexperienced. He obviously said this without looking up their names.

I don't think he was malicious, he was just poorly informed and carried some prejudice against the illness.

In the end he even acknowledged that he may have misjudged the situation but the moderators removed it anyway it seems.

I read it too, and you summarise it well.

This was the first time I'd ventured into reddit, and I was very unimpressed by this person's post, so I'm interested to know the mods removed it.

I must admit reading it made me think reddit was not for me!

 

[Solstice]

I read it too, and you summarise it well.

This was the first time I'd ventured into reddit, and I was very unimpressed by this person's post, so I'm interested to know the mods removed it.

I must admit reading it made me think reddit was not for me!

You're gonna meet people like that on pretty much every newsoutlet or social forum. I've stopped seeing it as a threat or a nuisance and started seeing it as an opportunity to educate. If you stay polite and come well-equipped with facts you might not change a biased person's view, but you might persuade any impartial onlookers that are lurking around.

 

[valentinelynx]

Not much of interest so far. Consists mostly of comments from a grad student criticizing Davis for being an amateur and a newbie.

 

[RogerBlack]

This was the first time I'd ventured into reddit, and I was very unimpressed by this person's post, so I'm interested to know the mods removed it.

Reddits front page is almost entirely driven by user ratings.
If you have a comment on something that sounds 'sciency' and 'truthy' and you go along with prejudices of the crowd, it is very easy to get upvotes on what is in fact nonsense. Hopefully the worst nonsense is caught later by moderators, but it can be up for some time on the frontpage.

 

[arewenearlythereyet]

This is the problem with most sites of the type. It's becomes a popularity contest and the best PR operator wins. Often facts are the last thing to be considered. I find these sites depressing in the main mainly because I'm not very good at that sort of thing.

 

[adreno]

I find reddit utterly uninteresting. I don't think I ever read anything of value there.

 

[Cheshire]

What about France, Germany, etc.? I've seen a few articles by German authors and they seem to be even worse than their UK colleagues. Europe seems to be infested by Freudian thinking.

Nothing (or nearly nothing) is happening in France. No psychobabble (on ME, I mean, because for the Freudian babbles, we're still the best. I'm pretty sure we beat the Germans, what a feeling...), but no biomedical research (for the moment) either.

 

[Rick Sanchez]

I certainly hope this is the case but I have my doubts. From the outside, it seems to me that the Scandinavian region was already starting to have a greater awareness of ME and the issues surrounding it, so maybe Unrest coming along was perfect timing, while in the UK we are still stuck in the Dark Ages regarding ME. But I'm more than happy to be proved wrong, so let's hope that is what happens.

While it is true that there was increased awareness, the coverage of the Karina in Denmark was actually borderline abysmal. The only good coverage of the case was actually in one of Denmarks famous tabloid papers. Most major outlets barely covered the case, and if they did so the coverage was extremely poor, and was hardly about CFS / ME at all. The worst of the 'Funktionelle lidelser' crowd were given time to just spew out BS completely unchallenged in interviews, and CFS / ME patient groups and sufferers were dealt with in an incredibly condescending and patronizing manner.

So, importantly, not only has 'Unrest' led to a lot more coverage of CFS, especially by mainstream news, but the coverage itself is also a whole lot better. It is a lot more informed, it comes with interviews from foreign researchers, and challenges the psychosomatic 'Funktionelle lidelser' narrative.

I would say the single most important thing for CFS / ME awareness in Denmark before Unrest wasn't the Karina case. It was around half a year ago when 4 foreign scientists wrote an article in one of the biggest Danish newspapers basically berating the entire Danish health-care system for extremely poor treatment / neglect of CFS / ME sufferers. The article coincided perfectly with the most recent research which showed CFS / ME to be physiological in nature, and helped Danish journalists be properly informed on contemporary ME research, which is to be fair, quite confusing, especially to a Danish speaking journalist who might never have heard of ME and who probably does not have a scientific background.

 

[ryan31337]

I read that criticism before it was removed too. I actually found it quite amusing how stupid he made himself look, structuring careful argument with big words and scientific principles but not having realised he was conflating the work of 3x separate teams and making very little sense indeed!

I'm sat here wondering what motivates people to engage in such lengthy, time intensive criticism like that without clearly having read the article properly, let alone investigating any of the research detailed. Oh right, his mentor told him CFS is a lost cause, so it must be so... sounds familiar.

 

[Sidereal]

I read that criticism before it was removed too. I actually found it quite amusing how stupid he made himself look, structuring careful argument with big words and scientific principles but not having realised he was conflating the work of 3x separate teams and making very little sense indeed!

I'm sat here wondering what motivates people to engage in such lengthy, time intensive criticism like that without clearly having read the article properly, let alone investigating any of the research detailed. Oh right, his mentor told him CFS is a lost cause, so it must be so... sounds familiar.

I find Reddit in general to be like this. Full of young angry males writing lengthy diatribes about things they know absolutely nothing about, fighting with each other pointlessly. What's needed for Redditors is less video games, get out of mom's basement more, get some vitamin D, calm down & get a life.