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Rife Machines: Discussion--cancer, Lyme, ME/CFS

Discussion in 'Alternative Therapies' started by brenda, Jul 3, 2014.

  1. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    Note: This thread has been split from the original thread:
    Which is here.


    The 'alternative' method of frequency generation, which has been curing cancer since Royal Rife set up his device in the 1930's is gaining in interest:

    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21812011

    http://www.kurzweilai.net/electrical-pulse-treatment-pokes-holes-to-treat-tumors

    http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/72/8_MeetingAbstracts/5387

    http://lbk.fe.uni-lj.si/pdfs/jmb2012f.pdf

    I get on a forum where a computer program to run a cheap device ($114) is given free of charge, and regulars report proven success that theirs and family members tumours shrink/disappear using this method.

    I am using it for Lyme.

    http://www.spooky2.com/forums/index.php
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 7, 2014
  2. Kina

    Kina Moderation Team Lead

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    Rife seems to be yet another dangerous fraud perpetrated by unscrupulous alternative therapy practitioners. In a nutshell, a rife machine produces radio waves. The radio waves emitted by a rife generator do not have sufficient energy to destroy bacteria/viruses/fungi. Useless for any disease, even ones caused by bacteria/viruses/fungi, due to the ineffective current generated by the rife machine.

    RE: this study -- http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21812011

    RE: this article -- http://www.kurzweilai.net/electrical-pulse-treatment-pokes-holes-to-treat-tumors

    RE: this study -- http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/cgi/content/meeting_abstract/72/8_MeetingAbstracts/5387

    -until human trials have been done, not much can be concluded re: cancer treatment

    RE: this study -- http://lbk.fe.uni-lj.si/pdfs/jmb2012f.pdf

    It's a study that demonstrated bacteria can be inactivated in a petrie dish using electrical pulses not radio waves.

    All of this is very interesting and all agree that further investigation is required before any definitive statements can be made. None of these studies support the use of a rife machine because they aren't using a rife machine in the studies and it's not replication of the type of currents produced by a rife machine. At this point in time, cancer is cured by destroying tumours either chemically or by radiation. What researchers are looking for are less invasive means by carrying out research the way it's meant to be done. Unfortunately, people are using such studies to support the use of rife. Very misguided in the least and horribly dangerous to those using such therapies over proper medical treatment.

    From this article -- http://lymediseaseguide.org/rife-machine-therapy-for-lyme-disease

    Other articles:

    http://www.healthwatcher.net/Quackerywatch/Cancer/Cancer-news/smh001230rife-aus.html

    http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/stor...o9&s=e284dd4c188ec5cf876f03f460cc2166d530e0dd

    http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/books/reviews/bl_rife.htm

    http://altered-states.net/barry/rife/rifeoppsued.htm

    http://www.devicewatch.org/reports/radionics.shtml
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  3. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    Yeah right Kina, please yourself - it works for me. Only yesterday, I dropped something heavy on my big toe and broke it, so have used healing frequencies overnight, so today the pain has drastically reduced and I can walk.

    There are loads of testimonies showing it cured cancer, from people who have no financial interest in what they are saying. If there are some scams out there, they have nothing to do with the proper devices.

    And they don't produce radio waves.
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  4. Kina

    Kina Moderation Team Lead

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    @brenda -- did you get x-ray. I broke my big toe and there was no pain, I just couldn't walk on it. If it's broken, you might want to splint it or it may not heal properly or does rife align broken bones too?

    It's also a much different thing to claim symptom relief over claiming it cures cancer, lyme, AIDS, etc.

    There is absolutely no clinical evidence that rife works. People have died. People have been put in prison. Take a critical look at the evidence.
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2014
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  5. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    @Kina
    There is no way I will go to a hospital unless it is to save my life, so no, it has not been x-rayed but with a long history of stubbing my toes, I know the difference and have looked it up - there is throbbing as well as pain. Yes it has been splinted.

    There are recorded cancer cures with clear x-rays and of course doctors claiming that the original x-rays were incorrect or something else. In fact just like your attitude. If some people have died using rife, and they are almost certainly the ones who are medical failures to start with, then that does not prove it does not work if you use your critical thinking which is usually missing in doctors. It does not cure everyone whereas allopathic medicine damages many and does not cure many cancer cases, using falsified statistics.

    There is evidence in fact on You Tube of borrelia bacteria breaking up in experiments. I have taken a great deal of critical looking at the evidence. Nobody has died but yes people have been persecuted by pharma and even destroyed like Raymond Rife.
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  6. Kina

    Kina Moderation Team Lead

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    I think the issue is Brenda that you are making some claims regarding the use rife to decrease pain in a 'broken toe' which may or may not be broken. The only way to diagnose a broken bone is via x-ray. It's a moot point any ways because what we are discussing here are cancer cures not broken toes. Using your logic, a splint would be effective at treating cancer as well as rife.

    I am not having an 'attitude' -- it's about scientific evidence and the lack of evidence when it comes down to rife for curing cancer. What are the facts, what studies exist to support that it works, what does science say about Rife's initial work and so on.

    I have looked at both sides -- those who believe in rife, those who do not and when it comes down to it there is no scientific evidence to support it and even the basic premise of rife is very faulty. My only attitude and this comes from working in palliative care -- patients need to be aware that there are many people out there offering dodgy ineffective treatments with no scientific evidence to back up their claims and people are going to die if they rely on these treatments to cure their cancer. I am all for complementary therapies used along with proper cancer treatment. This is not a bad attitude and really there should be no anger over it.

    People have died. That's a fact. They haven't died from using a rife machine because it has a very weak wave, what they have died of is eschewing proper medical care because unscrupulous people on the internet saying it cures cancer when it clearly does not.

    Clearly trying to have a debate regarding the scientific efficacy of any treatment for cancer is useless when you invoke 'attitude', 'falsified statistics', 'persecution'... . The thing is mainstream medicine has its faults and so does alternative medicine. Each has good and bad issues associated with it. I can produce clear and rational scientific evidence that only suggests that rife does not cure disease. In return, youtube links, anedotal comments really aren't helpful in such a debate and neither is producing studies that don't replicate or validate rife and claiming rife works from these studies. It's not only 'allopathic' medicine that damages people, so does 'alternative' medicine but people want to ignore this. Neither is perfect. Take the best from both worlds and really they don't have to be independent from each other.
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  7. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    It is ridiculous to imagine that people have not died using rife devices. Most if not all people diagnosed with cancer start off with allopathic treatments and the ones who are failures, sometimes come along to find out about rife, but sometimes it is just too late for anything to cure them and all because they put their trust in doctors who did not give them the choice of modalities to use. Very few with cancer start off with alternative medicine.

    My success with rife is not only about a possibly broken toe, it is just the latest in line.

    My confidence in rife is not going to sit around waiting until it is 'proven'. I don't have the time and am happy to go by the evidence provided by neutral reports by people that I know from forums, one of whom I guessed had cancer and a check up proved it, so he is now very happy that his throat cancer tumour is shrinking weekly using his device.

    I am not denying that there are quacks out there and one must be careful but there is also a lot of medicine that I would run a mile from and that includes chemotherapy or any conventional cancer treatment if only for the fact that it is big business with a high degree of failure.

    If I found out I had cancer tomorrow I would get out my rife and use other useful substances like B17 and bicarbonate of soda with full confidence that I could beat it.
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  8. Kina

    Kina Moderation Team Lead

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    I feel sad for you @brenda because chemotherapy, surgery and/or radiation are the only proven treatments for cancer and even if they are a huge crap shoot with some forms of cancer, it's better than nothing. Your biases one day just might end your life. If I were diagnosed with cancer, I would get a biopsy if necessary, I would explore the best treatments with an oncologist, I would use nutritional support and supplements that might help maximize my immune system. (Go here for discussion of other alternative treatments for cancer)

    Here is a true story of a person who didn't choose conventional treatment. Her name was Betty. She found a lump in her breast. She was in her early seventies and was for some reason too embarrassed to go and get it checked out. She decided to treat it with all sorts of alternative therapies with the hope the tumour would go away. It did not. It grew right through her breast tissue and I was the person that had to apply the dressings to it when she finally decided to go to the doctor. It was nasty and it stank. The cancer also metastasized and she died a horrible painful and nasty death. If she had gotten treatment, she would have a huge chance of survival. She could not cure it with any of the many things she tried. Betty was my friend and I miss her.

    What has your rife device actually cured you of lyme?, ME/CFS?. That's their claim -- cure.

    I really would like to have a conversation regarding the science.

    Thank you.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 7, 2014
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  9. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    @Kina
    I am sorry to hear about your friend and can understand why you are emotionally involved with the subject, but for that one sad tale there are countless ones of success in alternative treatments.

    I am incurable by any medical standards, being most likely past the stage where my mitochondria can cope with the damage which would be done by antibiotic therapy so any improvement to my quality of life is a bonus and rife is enabling it for me. My specialist of 3 years has done nothing to improve things for me with her mitochondria treatments but my rife device has enabled a number of improvements. If it does cure me of Lyme then that is a bonus. I am using it for detoxifying my body before I can go in with killing frequencies over the last few months and it works. I am covered in spots at the moment which is a very good sign for me and I am sweating and improving in sleep and energy levels so that I am exercising daily and improving in cognition.

    I know others who have cured Lyme having negative tests after rifing, and others who are improving. I reckon it will take 5 years for me to see a significant improvement which at the current age of 64 is quite something. I am reversing aging and it is due to my rife device.

    Here is a very good article concerning the choices we have in treating cancer and the lies that the cancer industry spouts out. I would urge everyone to read it and be enabled to make educated choices as there is a high change that they will have to face cancer for themselves or a close relative.


    http://web.archive.org/web/20070607...duction_to_Alternative_Cancer_Treatments.aspx

    I will look for more information on rifing in the meantime.
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  10. Kati

    Kati Patient in training

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    (For discussion of other alternative methods of treating cancer go here)

    @Kina my mom went that route too. She was 44 and I was 16. She opted out of medical care for her breat cancer. She tried diverse alterinative therapies, one of which was 714X ( in the same line as Burzinsky's antineoplastons), She died 4 years later.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 7, 2014
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  11. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    Can you actually provide even one link anywhere on the Internet to a case where a cancer that has been cured by a Rife machine has been medically documented (with biopsy data, etc) both before Rife treatment, and after this treatment.

    Think about this:

    If it were true that Rife machines can cure cancer, you would expect individuals who achieved such cures to properly document them online, with all the before and after medical data proving that the cancer disappeared — that is, assuming that Rife users are ethical individuals who care about humanity. Because if anyone found a genuine treatment for cancer, unless you were morally reprehensible, you would want to make the effort to properly document it, so that others could see the scientific proof and then benefit themselves. This is just logical.

    The fact that you don't find any such properly documented cases of Rife cancer cures either means that:

    (1) Individuals who use Rife machine users are the most morally reprehensible people on Earth, and don't care at all for others.

    (2) Rife machines don't cure or treat cancer.

    So which is it? Are these people totally morally reprehensible? Or are Rife cures of cancer just bunk?

    In fact they do. Many Rife machines for sale have a solenoid that creates a magnetic field oscillating at radio frequencies (typically around about the MHz range I believe). Any such oscillating magnetic field will also emit radio waves of the same frequency. And there are other types of Rife machine for sale that directly generate and emit radio waves.
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2014
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  12. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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  13. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    The history of the Rife device. You need to know the history to understand the issues.







    etc.
  14. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    @brenda, I asked a very simple and straightforward question, which is:

    Can you actually provide even one link anywhere on the Internet to a case where a cancer that has been cured by a Rife machine has been medically documented (with biopsy data, etc) both before Rife treatment, and after this treatment.

    The answer is either yes or no.
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  15. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    The 16 cases of late stage cancer that R. Rife cured were all medically documented. Watch the vids. I am not looking for further evidence, that is enough for me, and I don't have the time.
  16. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    So it appears the answer is no, you cannot provide any links to any evidence whatsoever, in spite of the fact that you said earlier on this thread that "frequency generation has been curing cancer since Royal Rife set up his device in the 1930's".

    It is customary to only make medical statements if those statements are supported by verifiable facts or reliable evidence.
  17. brenda

    brenda Senior Member

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    It was not a medical statement, it is what I have been witnessing from reliable evidence of people who are using rife for cancer. I gave a link to the forum.
  18. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    Not a medical statement? Can you explain how a statement of the form "X cures cancer" is not a medical statement? The word medical is the adjective for the noun medicine.

    As for reliable evidence, I explained what this is above. You have not provided any reliable evidence.
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  19. Kina

    Kina Moderation Team Lead

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    @brenda -- it seems you can't access the forum you linked to unless you are a member. Are these forum members providing objective evidence in the form of blood results, scans for proof of cure. If not, then the information should not be regarded as reliable or valid.
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  20. zzz

    zzz Senior Member

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    Oh boy, Rife machines.

    First of all, my apologies to CFS_for_19_years, who tried to get this thread back on track. (Note: thread is now split--the original discussion is here.) I just thought that the earlier discussion of Rife machines would be incomplete without a little more information from someone who has used one of these machines extensively.

    I will report only on what I know; this includes very little of the political history, as I didn't find it very relevant to me.

    First of all, there is no single "Rife Machine" today. The machine that Royal Rife built was eventually banned (I believe by the FDA), and even today it and all related machines are considered "illegal medical devices". By the time of Rife's death, his machine had fallen into disrepair, and only a few parts remained. So none of the Rife machines available today work exactly like Royal Rife's machine, as the operating principles of that machine have been lost. (Note: I just discovered this site, which claims to have used existing parts and schematics to rebuild the original Rife machine. I haven't had time to read much here, but I haven't found anything outrageous so far.)

    I came across Rife machines in the Yahoo groups when I was trying to figure out whether I had Lyme disease or ME. While reading the posts there, it was clear that whatever I did have, these machines were working very well for people, and should be useful for either disease. In general, throughout my illness, I have not waited for peer-reviewed studies to be published, as the information about the treatments in these studies is usually available years before these studies happen, if they happen at all. This is why, in 2001, before Valcyte was available, I took a seven-week course of IV ganciclovir (the active metabolite of Valcyte). Ganciclovir had been used a lot with AIDS patients, but there were some nasty side effects, such as people sometimes losing their kidneys.

    I managed to talk to Nancy Klimas directly to get her views on this treatment. She strongly recommended against it, citing the known side effects she had seen in her AIDS patients, and recommended that I wait for the results of clinical trials. However, clinical trials weren't even planned at that point, and the first one by Dr. Montoya didn't take place until five years later. Meanwhile, I was going downhill really fast. The anecdotal reports I had seen ranged from mildly positive to essentially curative. I talked to one of the two doctors in the U.S. who was doing these treatments, and he said that he had never seen kidney or liver damage in any of his patients. He thought that this was because the individual organs tended to be healthier in ME patients than in very sick AIDS patients. He did occasionally see neutropenia, but he said that this was easily reversed with a brief respite from the treatment.

    So yes, I realized there was some risk of losing my kidneys (although kidney function tests were performed daily during the treatment), but at the rate I was failing, it soon wouldn't matter whether my kidneys survived or not. So I took the seven-week course, and almost got to the point where I could go back to work. My health has never declined to the point it was before that treatment.

    Similarly, when I saw all the reports of people being helped by Rife machines on the Lyme boards (and I believe that there were at least hundreds of these reports), and no permanent ill effects, I decided to try Rife. I was having severe problems with my gut for the first time in my illness, and antibiotics, probiotics, and supplements just weren't cutting it.

    Now there are all sorts of products that call themselves Rife machines. As for the quote:
    Well, I can't say what's going on in Australia, but that's certainly not a "typical" Rife machine in the U.S. Such a machine could not conform to any of the general principles used in Rife machines. I have never seen this type of "Rife" machine.

    If you want to learn about the different types of Rife machines that have actually helped people, Lyme Disease and Rife Machines is the standard text. The author's grasp of physics is somewhat imperfect, but not too bad. Fortunately, he's not the one building the machines or using them.

    A number of the books on Rife are complete nonsense, unfortunately. There are also a huge number of machines calling themselves "Rife" machines that are of questionable value. It's hard to do research in the field when use of these machines for treatment is banned.

    As for whether these machines emit radio waves, well, some do and some don't. It depends on the type of machine. Some effective machines certainly do use waves in the radio frequency range, including the original Rife machine.

    One of the two Rife machines I have is an advanced Doug Coil Machine, named after the eponymous Doug, who cured himself of Lyme disease using a machine built along these principles. I don't know how much you can tell from the pictures on the site, but these machines are very high quality; they are built by a former NASA engineer who used one to cure himself of Lyme disease. Now he makes a living selling these machines. And whereas a typical microwave oven uses 1100 watts, this machine uses 1500 watts, so it is certainly not underpowered. I calculated that the strength of the magnetic field delivered to the target area of the body by the electromagnets is about 2% of that of an MRI machine. Consider that MRI machines require a liquid helium coolant (and often liquid nitrogen as well), this machine is extraordinarily efficient; the magnets are cooled sufficiently by a couple of small fans.

    Although the magnets aren't strong enough to snap metal out of your hands, the dozen times or so that I've forgotten to take off my watch before using the machine, the watch always stopped. (I was always able to revive it.) Recently, I was doing a treatment around my belly when I felt my belly getting very warm. Investigating, I found that my metal belt buckle wasn't centered, and was actually within a couple of inches of one of the magnets. When I touched it, I almost burned my finger. After the treatment, I examined my belt, and found that the part under the buckle had been completely burned. I had to throw the belt away.

    OK, so these are powerful magnets. But what about the results?

    The whole machine was a big gamble, but fortunately it worked out very well. It takes a while to build up to the therapeutic treatment length; if you go too fast, you can make yourself quite ill for a while. So I took it slowly, and my gut started to quiet down, as long as I remained on the antibiotics, Within a year, I was able to eliminate one antibiotic, and then the other. Eventually, I was able to move the Rife treatment from once every four days to "as needed", which isn't very often.

    Sometimes when I did the earlier treatments, my whole GI tract would be making rumbling and splashing and gurgling and various other noises. When I turned the magnets toward my stomach, these sounds would stop within seconds. This happened many times. I no longer get those sounds.

    One of the times I was talking with Alex (the builder of my Rife machine), he mentioned that there was some evidence that this type of Rife machine also worked as an immune system booster. He said that once Doug had cured himself of Lyme disease (remember Doug?), he would use the machine about once every six months, and he never came down with any colds or other infections.

    Well, my immune system could certainly use a boost. It had crashed completely in 2001, and although I was able to jump start it with pulsed Valcyte, it clearly still had a lot of problems. For example, over the next eight years, I came down with pneumonia five times.

    But by the fifth time, I was well into my Rife treatment, and that last case of pneumonia was rather mild. It was also the last case I had, and that's now five years ago. In the intervening five years, I've had no colds, no cases of the flu, no other new infections. But the old ones are still there - they make themselves evident from time to time. It would seem that the Th1 side of my immune system is still problematic.

    Starting shortly after the beginning of my illness, like many men with ME, I started developing prostate problems, which gradually got worse until they were like those of an 80-year-old-man. (I'll spare you the details.) By the middle of my Rife treatment, all these problems had almost completely disappeared, and my prostate was actually doing a lot better than average for a man of my age. This was completely unexpected. Now, if my prostate starts to act up at all, I just use one Rife treatment, and it's immediately back to normal.

    That was an unexpected bonus. I had never heard of people using Rife machines to treat chronic prostatitis.

    Finally, rather recently, I discovered that I had taken Ritchie Shoemaker's Visual Contrast Sensitivity test twice back in 2005. The two numbers were almost identical - 52% and 54%, respectively. That's a strong positive for neurotoxins. I noticed I still had one test left, so I took it. This time I scored 91% - a clear negative. Was this due to the Rife machine? I have no idea. But apparently I've been doing something right.

    What about using the Rife machine for all my other ME symptoms? I've certainly tried, but so far I've not had success. The whole key to proper Rife treatment is knowing which frequency or frequencies to use. (Interestingly, Royal Rife's frequencies are used these days in a number of laser therapy protocols.)

    The standard book for Rife frequencies, which includes much more than Rife's original frequencies, is The Handbook of Rife Frequency Healing. It's got frequencies for every illness known to man, which in itself is rather suspicious, especially since there's no documentation as to where these frequencies came from, how they were determined and tested, etc. (In contrast, Rife himself has a modest list of frequencies.) I've tried various frequencies from this book (including the ones for "CFS"), but they seem ineffective. Additionally, the textual part of this book is utter nonsense; it ignores all medicine developed in the last two hundred years, distorts the scientific method completely, etc. So overall, I think the book is worthless, despite its 4.7 out of 5 stars at Amazon. (I just noticed that a new copy of the paperback edition of this book is selling for $486.80. That's more than ten times what I paid for it! Her other books on Rife are "only" $134 dollars each.)

    As for where I got the frequencies that work so well for me, these came from Doug, who determined them experimentally; they're in the Lyme Disease and Rife Machines book.

    So where does that leave me? I haven't given up on getting further relief from ME, but there are about 2000 frequencies available on my machine, and some may need to be used in combination. So I don't have any firm leads in that area right now.

    What about cancer treatments? I have no idea. Theoretically, there's no reason why that would be impossible, as cancer cells are different from normal cells, and certain frequencies might be able to exploit this difference. The ability of the Rife machine to boost the immune system could also be helpful here. I just don't know enough personally to say one way or the other. These machines have benefited enough people, though, that I think serious research (at least on the best of them) is warranted.

    What about the theory behind these machines? Unlike many forms of alternative medicine, these machines are based on standard, known physics. Pulsing electromagnetic fields affect living cells; this is how MRI machines work. After all, they're Magnetic Resonance Imaging machines. Just like Rife machines, they make the cells of the body vibrate. The difference is that a Rife machine makes certain cells vibrate by using a resonance that's fatal to them. As for being able to destroy certain cells, this post by Hip gives one example, and once the principle is demonstrated, it would seem unlikely that that would be the only example. Doug also determined his frequencies by seeing which ones killed bacteria in vitro. So these machines don't come into conflict with known science, or require any new forces; they are simply based on a phenomenon that has already been scientifically demonstrated under various circumstances. What their potential is has yet to be fully demonstrated, but further research should clarify this. In the mean time, I am quite happy with my Rife machine, as it has benefited me greatly in many ways.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 7, 2014
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