Home care is the theme for Severe ME Day on August 8th
Why should home care be the theme on Understanding and Remembrance Day for Severe ME on August 8? Helen Brownlie of the 25% ME Group has written an explanation for Phoenix Rising ...
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Discussion in 'Post-Exertional Malaise, Fatigue, and Crashes' started by Snow Leopard, Sep 24, 2013.

  1. Snow Leopard

    Snow Leopard Hibernating

    I occasionally exercise *shock horror* ;)

    I have noticed however that whenever I do a reasonable level of exercise (that 98% of the population would take for granted), that my urine is dark with a brownish tinge. Not nearly as dark as the image on Wikipedia, but heading in that direction:

    The colour is likely due to a breakdown of muscle products. I am wondering if this is common among people with ME or CFS?
    nandixon likes this.
  2. Valentijn

    Valentijn Activity Level: 3

    Amersfoort, Netherlands
    I always have trace amounts of blood in my urine, since I got sick. No idea if it would get more noticeable if I were to push my limits. I assumed mine was due to chronic inflammation.
  3. xchocoholic

    xchocoholic Senior Member

    I've had trace amounts of blood in my urine since getting this illness too. After getting
    a kidney stone that was too big to pass I decided this was probably from passing tiny stones on
    a regular basis. I have a leaky gut and oxalate problems so it made sense. I didn't realize
    this was a marker for chronic inflammation.

    On the dark urine, mine is dark unless I drink lots and lots of water.
  4. Ruthie24

    Ruthie24 Senior Member

    New Mexico, USA
    Having seen patients with rhabdo, I kind of dismissed this when I first read it, but on further reflection I am wondering if you aren't on to something. Maybe a mild form of rhabdo from muscle breakdown occurs?

    This summer when I was doing better and was quite active and pushing exercise, even though I was drinking a lot and getting IV saline regularly, my urine was always very dark. Now that I've relapsed and am mostly back in bed, I'm not able to drink as much, have stopped the saline and my urine is light and clear.
  5. Marco

    Marco Grrrrrrr!

    Near Cognac, France
  6. Marco

    Marco Grrrrrrr!

    Near Cognac, France
  7. Marco

    Marco Grrrrrrr!

    Near Cognac, France
  8. MeSci

    MeSci ME/CFS since 1995; activity level 6

    Cornwall, UK
    When I have over-exerted I get what appears to be osmotic diuresis, followed by apparent symptoms of mineral deficiency. I had an unusually-bad episode in the past week, which gave me a very bad night as I was having to get up so frequently, and passing a lot of urine so getting dehydrated. It is part of my PEM, and the urine is definitely more concentrated than usual, sometimes a bit cloudy, but not brown, although I had that once or twice in the early stages.

    The two episodes of severe hyponatraemia I have had were probably a result of repeated over-exertion.
  9. eastcoast12

    eastcoast12 Senior Member

    Long Island ny
    What's up snow leapord. I guess I can claim I'm some sort of expert when it comes to rhabdo. About three years ago I happened to get it 5 times which I needed to admitted each time.

    So most rhabdo is caused by over exertion. Like you I wasn't exerting myself anymore then I have done in the past. That year happened to correspond with a number of sever infections I had. Different viral infections can play a role in developing rhabdo. I'm inly speculating here but many of us have had pretty severe infections so there could b a possibility. It would b interesting to see if there was a higher prevalence of rhabdo in the cfs community.
    Last thing, which is the most important, is that this is an extremely dangerous situation. Think of your kidneys as a mesh screen. Most muscular byproducts are easily filtered. During rhabdo the muscular byproducts such as myoglobin are to big to pass through. This can lead to complete kidney shutdown and dialysis.
    Also when you get rhadbo the injured area becomes swollen with body fluids. This can lead to the constriction of blood vessels which in turn could cause the death of tissue from the lack of oxygen. This is called compartment syndrome. Then they have to perform a fasciotomy (look it up, it's nuts)
    Moral of the story, if you think you have rhabdo get your ass to the emergency room. Simple blood or urine test can confirm a diagnosis.
    If you have any questions let me know. Drink a shitload of water!!
    Snow Leopard likes this.
  10. anciendaze

    anciendaze Senior Member

    I want to add my weight to the advice in the above post. If rhabdomyolysis is actually taking place it is extremely damaging to kidneys. What is more we have a number of reports about people with ME who have died indicating kidney failure played a role. Typically this is blamed on patients becoming dehydrated due to "bizarre illness beliefs". Drinking enough water to cope can also be classified as psychogenic polydipsia. (Another example where patients can't win.)

    If there are tests showing those byproducts in urine, the whole clinical diagnostic and treatment picture changes. Doctors will pay attention.

    A friend with an entirely different disease, hypokalemic period paralysis, has experienced this after he became paralyzed while out cycling. He did not need to experience physical trauma, simply lying without being able to redistribute weight was enough. In this it resembled "crush syndrome". This also happens among the elderly who spend time lying on hard floors after a fall.

    I certainly hope this is rare among ME/CFS patients, because it is no laughing matter.

    You might also check on Chronic Exertional Compartment Syndrome.
    Valentijn, MeSci and Snow Leopard like this.
  11. nandixon

    nandixon Senior Member

    I have this same problem, which is definitely not related to dehydration. And likewise mine is not as dark as in the photo; perhaps half that intensity of brownish color at its worst.

    It think it started maybe about 12 or so years into what has been roughly an 18 year illness.

    I think in my case this is almost certainly some form of mitochondrial impairment the ME/CFS is causing, and essentially resembling a mild mitochondrial disease (myopathy).
    Mel9 likes this.

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