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Reverse Mitochondrial Damage 101

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS Discussion' started by Radio, Feb 11, 2014.

  1. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    OK, I have just ordered some NT Factor EnergyLipids Powder from Amazon UK, 150 grams for £52 including shipping. I am looking forward to trying it. Thanks for all your efforts in posting this up Radio.

    How long does one of these 150 gram tubs last for, Radio? What's your monthly costs on this regimen?
     
  2. Butydoc

    Butydoc President

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    Hi Radio,

    I appreciate that you are fully recovered and you are trying to help others, but you still didn't answer my question. Would you kindly reply if you are a paid consultant or employed by Iherb?

    Regards,
    Gary
     
  3. Radio

    Radio *****

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    I am not a paid consultant for I-herb or any other vitamin supplement company.
     
  4. Butydoc

    Butydoc President

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    Thanks Radio. :)
     
  5. Radio

    Radio *****

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    150 grams last me around 6-8 weeks. I am on maintenance dose right now. I do get this question a-lot. If you or other forum members don't mind tracking how much you take and how long it last and estimating the cost, that would be very helpful information to post. I am currently working full time and involved in other areas of research and unfortunately don't have time to collect this data. I do appreciate any information that can help others who have these dosing questions.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2014
  6. Hip

    Hip Senior Member

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    @Radio
    When my NT Factor powder arrives, I will weigh how much powder goes into each scoop (I have a milligram weighing scales), and then it will be easy to work out how long a 150 gram tub will last, if you take 2 to 4 scoops each day.

    If NT Factor (plus the trace elements and methylation) leads to a really substantial improvement, then I should think that people will not mind paying. For me, if something makes enough improvement so that my mind becomes sharp enough to engage in gainful work or employment, it's a no brainer that it will be worth the price.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2014
    merylg likes this.
  7. Radio

    Radio *****

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  8. Radio

    Radio *****

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  9. heapsreal

    heapsreal iherb 10% discount code OPA989,

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    Mitochondria and hormones, i have been looking into their connection as well as cholesterol. My cholesterol fluctuates abit from high to within normal range but high. Recently my cholesterol came back quite high and my doc offered a statin, not keen. Then i realised there was a couple of things i had stopped which could be the reason for the high cholesterol.

    One was i stopped acetyl carnitine. I had put of 10kg since i stopped this at the end of last year with no change in diet or activity. carnitine is suppose to help the mitochondria with fat metabolism??

    The other thing was i stopped pregnenolone, now pregnenolone is made in the mitochondria from our friend cholesterol. Pregnenolone then filters down and is used to make other hormones as well as having its own functions in the body. High cholesterol can be a sign of low hormone issues as the liver increases cholesterol production( thats right its made in the liver not from that juicy piece of meat) to compensate for these hormones, in hope that pregnenolone will be made in the mitochondria and then used to make other hormones such as sex and adrenal hormones. Something is missing or going wrong between the cholesterol and the pregnenolone, could it be alot of these co factors such as carnitine, q10, nad and others that are frequently mentioned in mito disorders.

    Im guessing that supplying pregnenolone will lower the need for cholesterol so the liver will reduce production, i guess its hit and miss as to which co-factors are missing to help the mitos produce pregnenolone, for me i think carnitine is a peice of the puzzle?

    cheers!!!
     
  10. Radio

    Radio *****

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    Radio: What is the best natural anti-inflammatory that can reduce inflammation with out inhibiting methylation?

    I came to the conclusion that green tea extract was the best anti-inflammatory with the lease cross inhibition potential. I have been using this supplement to help control inflammation for many years.


    Life Extension, Mega Green Tea Extract, Decaffeinated

    http://www.iherb.com/life-extension-mega-green-tea-extract-decaffeinated-100-veggie-caps/7723?at=0

    Beneficial Effects of Green Tea Extract on Liver and Kidney Functions,Ultrastructure, Lipid Profile and Hematological Parameters in Aged Male Rats

    http://idosi.org/gv/gv11(2)13/10.pdf
     
  11. Radio

    Radio *****

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    Yes, Carnitine is important to the mitochondria krebs cycle function. I have found a possible sulfate deficiency is a key factor as well. I'm actually more concerned with the possible silent organ damage that could be the main contributing factor.

    The CFS/ME puzzle
    ...

    I have been chasing my tail trying to identify these deficiencies and cofactors. Until we know that root cause of these metabolic imbalances. It will be almost impossible to over come these chronic deficiencies.

    What is the missing link to this acquired mitochondrial disease puzzle?


    I think Fred Davis is on point with regards to methylation. RichVank did understand that there was more to this syndrome than just a methylation block and glutathione depletion.

    The missing link to CFS/ME puzzle in my opinion is Hypochlorhydria / Dysbiosis and the domino affects goes on and on and on. Yes we have a disease my friends, that not only damages the mitochondria cells. It also affects the kidney, brain and liver as well. I have fully recovery from CFS. But, I did not escape with out collateral damage. See more at the links I posted below.


    Radio:
    This concludes my broadcast for today :balanced: Pay it forward and never give up!


    H.pylori-Hypochlorhydria-Dysbiosis-Liver-CFS/ME Connection

    http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?forums/general-me-cfs-discussion.80/
    How-I-Recovered-From-CFS-part 2
    http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?threads/how-i-recovered-from-cfs-part-2.28684/
    Could Sulfur Deficiency be a Contributing Factor inObesity, Heart Disease, Alzheimer'sand Chronic Fatigue Syndrome?
    http://people.csail.mit.edu/seneff/sulfur_obesity_alzheimers_muscle_wasting.html
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2014
    heapsreal likes this.
  12. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

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    Radio,

    Did you do any of the h pylori or Dysbiosis tests before starting treatment?

    Also, you said you have collateral damage, can you explain?
     
  13. Radio

    Radio *****

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    Yes, I have done an endoscopy and comprehensive DNA stool testing. Also, I have worked with a functional medicine doctor and ran many labs test I post in this forum. I still have fibromyalgia symptoms, gastritis, liver and kidney insufficiency. Also, dysbiosis never goes away...We can only inhibit that pathogenic bacteria and supplement HCL and try and maintain the right gut pH. My new research has identified that gastritis is a much bigger problem than anyone ever realized. I am now recommending everyone be tested for Anti-parietal and anti-IF antibodies. You can use your normal practitioner to run these test and a endoscopy is highly recommend.
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2014
  14. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

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    I'm working with a good doctor now who is very investigatory but he hasn't done too much in regards to digestive tests. I'm looking for a doctor who can get real in depth with that. Would a general naturopath be sufficient? Or is there a specific type of doc who would fit this bill.
     
  15. Radio

    Radio *****

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    Yes, A good Naturopath Doctor will have some understanding of gut dysfunction. But, you will need to hold there hand and tell them what test you want, together you can build a protocol that addresses your health concerns. If you have the money functional medicine doctors do have more understanding of chronic disease.



    Find A Functional Medicine Practitioner

    https://www.functionalmedicine.org/practitioner_search.aspx?id=117
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2014
  16. amaru7

    amaru7 Senior Member

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    Serious mitochondrial damage cannot be reversed, that's my view from all the research I did. There are some studies claiming that HGH, EPO and Nutrients like NAD, CoQ10 etc can help with mitochondrial biogenesis, but if the majority of mitochondria are defect, there is no way, because mitochondria replicate and if it's sick, the new mitochondria will also be defective. Have to have a look also into fission and fusion of mitochondria, overwhelming amout of scientific info, but no real medical interventions as of yet.
    My ATP is extremely low and I'm afraid that'll last until the day I die, if there's no new medical discoveries.
     
  17. amaru7

    amaru7 Senior Member

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    btw radio, I totally agree the basic issue for CFS/ME is mitochondrial dysfunction that need to be adressed. I did have my ATP measured 2 yrs ago, and now my hope is leaving me a bit, although I didn't try all of the possible things yet for financial reasons. That NT Factor thing I don't buy into even though I'm desperate for a solution, because just googeling for "nt factor mitochondrial" gives me mostly results of claims of the company and people selling that stuff. (not saying that you're one of them)
     
  18. Radio

    Radio *****

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    Hey amaru,

    We are not talking about mitochondria DNA defects here. We are talking about acquired mitochondria damage. Yes, serious mitochondrial damage cannot be reversed. You are reference to Mitochondrial Apoptosis cell death and you are right. But, keep in mind we can have a large percentage of Mito damage with out symptoms. Also, you need to understanding how methylation works and how important phosphatidylcholine and phospholipids are to every cell in the body. We can still make new Mitochondria DNA and repair old still functioning mitochondria we have left. There is still hope for many to recovery some of there still functioning mitochondria. The main focus is on preventing apoptosis cell death and it's imperative that we start mitochondria supportive therapy at the on set of CFS/ME. Damage mitochondria can be repaired with food as well. Research...

    Minding My Mitochondria
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2014
  19. Aerose91

    Aerose91 Senior Member

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    How is one supposed to know when they are at a point where the mitochondrial damage is too far to reverse? From what I'm reading, too many episodes of over exertion is what kills the DNA in the mitochondria
     
  20. amaru7

    amaru7 Senior Member

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    Hi Radio,

    yes of course as I'm focused on mitochondrial research I've seen that from Terry Wahl, it's a wonderful success story, even though I doubt she gets all the nutrients as she did claim for remyelination only from food, therefore her Multiple Sclerosis was to far gone. Food+supplements combined helped her back up. It's a classic for aquired mitochondrial dysfunction is probably what you mean, when intervention comes in place soon enough, there's a chance to recover. But if it's too far gone or even the mtDNA is corrupt, then it's a bit more difficult and probably impossible to treat unfortunately.
     

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