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Can You Come for a Visit? My ME/CFS Says No
My daughter and son-in-law just had a baby last week. We are thrilled. But we won't be able to see the baby or hold her any time soon. We won't be able to take over little gifts or help out with housework or babysitting.
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Rethinking Probiotics.

Discussion in 'Mast Cell Disorders/Mastocytosis' started by Ema, Aug 8, 2013.

  1. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

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    Tundras of Europa
  2. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

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    @Asklipia just brought to my attention that lactobacillus plantarum is listed as both histamine producing and degrading. Talk about confusing...
    Wayne and maryb like this.
  3. davidfibdou

    davidfibdou

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  4. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    I think it is because it is tyramine producing...and tyramine is also a biological amine like histamine. You often see them both to be avoided on low histamine diets.

    http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2180/12/199

    That's all I can figure anyway...

    I should probably edit the first post to reflect that as well.
  5. davidfibdou

    davidfibdou

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    oh boy.. ok anyone wanna suggest a good one thats histamine or at least being neutral to it?
  6. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    Here's the citation for the article the Low Histamine Chef quoted regarding L plantarum...I've requested the full article and will keep you all posted!

    Screening selected strains of probiotic lactic acid bacteria for their ability to produce biogenic amines (histamine andtyramine).(Report)
    Priyadarshani, Wadu Mesthri Deepika ; Rakshit, Sudip K.
    International Journal of Food Science and Technology, Oct, 2011, Vol.46(10), p.2062(8) [Peer Reviewed Journal]
    Asklipia likes this.
  7. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    I spent a couple hours on iherb in Nov/Dec, searching for lowhistaminechef's qualities. I settled on the first 2 of the 3 linked below. My other requirements were ability to ship w/o ice, and no lactose, no prebiotics, to suit my GAPS diet. In addition to these two, I alternate w/ soil-based Prescript Assist.

    http://www.iherb.com/Nature-s-Way-Primadophilus-Reuteri-Pearls-60-Pearls/14704
    1 Billion CFU Lactobacillus acidophilus; Bifidobacterium longum; Lactobacillus reuteri; Lactobacillus rhamnosus)

    * http://www.iherb.com/Ortho-Molecula...798#p=2&oos=1&disc=0&lc=en-US&w=lactobacillus plantarum&rc=184&sr=null&ic=47
    Proprietary Blend
    20 Billion CFU++
    Lactobacillus acidophilus, Lactobacillus paracasei,
    Bifidobacterium bifidum,
    Bifidobacterium lactis
    Lactobacillus plantarum
    Lactobacillus rhamnosus
    Saccharomyces Boulardii

    http://www.iherb.com/Solgar-Advance...ggie-Caps/14215#p=1&oos=1&disc=0&lc=en-US&w=l. paracasei&rc=36&sr=null&ic=3
    L. acidophilus, LA-5
    B. lactis, BB-12
    L. paracasei, L. CASEI 431
    L. rhamnosus GG, LGG

    http://www.iherb.com/Solgar-Advance...eggie-Caps/8751#p=1&oos=1&disc=0&lc=en-US&w=l. paracasei&rc=36&sr=null&ic=6
    Advanced 40+ Acidophilus Complex providing
    L. acidophilus, LA-5
    L. rhamnosus GG, LGG
    L. paracasei, L CASEI 431
    B. lactis, BB-12
    S. thermophilus, TH-4
    Helen, Hanna and Asklipia like this.
  8. maryb

    maryb iherb code TAK122

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    @ahmo
    do you think these 2 have helped?
  9. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    @maryb, I can't say. When I ask my body, it seems happier w/ these than w/ the ones I'd been using. I'm finally on top of my histamine responses after more than a decade of near-constant outbreaks. I've also been using rutin, royal jelly, and quercetin to good effect. cheers, ahmo
  10. maryb

    maryb iherb code TAK122

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    Thanks - I guess its just a question of trying different ones. Glad to hear you're body likes them:)
    its so hard to find the right combination - its out there somewhere though.........
  11. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    Here's what I think is a relevant part of that article:

    They grew the strains in isolation, which seems to be an issue that they acknowledge in food.

    I will post the article in the appropriate location.
  12. knackers323

    knackers323 Senior Member

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    Anyone tried taking probiotics rectally?

    I read that it can be better that orally.?
  13. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    I occasionally add them to an enema. but it's not my regular method of taking.
    Wayne likes this.
  14. knackers323

    knackers323 Senior Member

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    Do you find any added benefit from this method?
  15. ahmo

    ahmo Senior Member

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    I did this when I was having diarrhea, and used S Boulardii caps, which are often used for this purpose. It was effective. I was doing coffee enemas 1-2x/month. Now, I'm at the opposite extreme, and have been actively detoxxing, doing coffee enemas 4 days on, 2 days off. I initially emptied one of my other probi caps in, but I'm not self-testing + to add them, so I'm not.
  16. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

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    This can be good if you have SIBO, because you avoid feeding the bacteria in the short bowel. Also, the probiotics won't be killed by stomach acid.
  17. davidfibdou

    davidfibdou

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    so is the best low hystamine probiotics what ahmo suggested?

    anyone have any thoughts on prescript assist. I want something of good quality!!!
  18. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    I'm woefully under-educated and under-informed on histamine, and all it's aspects. I did however, start taking Liposomal Vitamin C recently, in part because it's known to reduce histamine levels. In searching for a quick reference to this, I ran across an article that mentions iodine can also be responsible for high histamine levels in the body. So... here's a link: :)

    Seven Fomenters of Brain Fog
  19. Peyt

    Peyt

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    be very careful with that... first of all, not all bacteria has a place in colon. Generally strains of Lacto belongs in Small Intestine and Bifido belongs in the large intestine.... so I hope you made sure to look at the label to see what kind of bacteria you are putting up there... putting what belongs in the small intestine in the large intestine will cause new problems!
  20. Thinktank

    Thinktank Senior Member

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    I'd be cautious supplementing Cu, or at least take zinc in a good ratio with it.
    WillowJ likes this.

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