The 12th Invest in ME Research Conference June, 2017, Part 2
MEMum presents the second article in a series of three about the recent 12th Invest In ME International Conference (IIMEC12) in London.
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Results for Lyme...

Discussion in 'ME/CFS Doctors' started by dga5000, Jan 2, 2015.

  1. dga5000

    dga5000

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    Just received my results back.. It would seem I tested negative for all the classic lyme disease tests including the SPOT test. I have however tested positive for the following:

    Midichloria mitochondrii - Positive
    D-lactate 4.74 (0.0 - 1.6)

    Has anyone else tested positive for these or know anything about them?

    Many Thanks
     
  2. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    The MM is a pathogen thought to be a part of the ixodes ricinus tick bite. This is a tick more commonly found in Europe and the testing may not be as sensitive as for the more common deer tick (ixodes scapularus).

    If you are positive for the MM, I would say that Lyme cannot be ruled out because one without the other would be unlikely. This is why Lyme is still a clinical diagnosis that must be made by a doctor familiar with the limitations of testing and often peculiar presentations of the disease.

    D-lactate is often high in ME/CFS and may reflect gut dysbiosis. There are several threads on the form that you can find by searching like this one:

    http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...-the-same-symptoms-as-d-lactic-acidosis.8159/
     
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  3. Daffodil

    Daffodil Senior Member

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    please get the LTT ELISPOT for Borrelia. this is the definitive test for Lyme
     
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  4. dga5000

    dga5000

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    Hi Daffodil. I've had LTT ELISPOT for Borrelia and it came back negative. I've now had more than 20 tests for lyme over three rounds of testing, covering differing varieties each time - all negative. Which makes it strange that I've tested positive for Midichloria mitochonardrii.
     
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  5. dga5000

    dga5000

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    Any one else tested positive for Midichloria mitochondrii?
     
  6. dga5000

    dga5000

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    Thanks so much Ema. Really useful.
     
  7. Daffodil

    Daffodil Senior Member

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    wow..negative on the LTT too? dang.
     
  8. Research 1st

    Research 1st Severe ME, POTS & MCAS.

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    It increasingly appears the development of chronic disease ME in previously health people is not classical 'Lyme disease', (Borrelia Burgdoferi), caused by nature.

    But something else. :whistle: ;)
     
  9. Research 1st

    Research 1st Severe ME, POTS & MCAS.

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    Some research on Midichloria Mitochondrii in insects and humans I wanted to show you all:












     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2015
    green_monster, Mel9, Helen and 5 others like this.
  10. Research 1st

    Research 1st Severe ME, POTS & MCAS.

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    Maybe this is related if impaired ATP occurs in the brain.


    'CFS' & BRAIN Lactate.(Not Gut D-Lactate).







    Prions and Lactate (Non CFS):

    It's of interest severe ME sufferers appear to have very low or absent PrPC in their blood on an experimental test, with feedback from patients. These people need misfolding assays, but they aren't available.

    It's interesting to note increase Lactate in the brain of 'CFS' research, in non severe patients, and D-Lactate elevated in people on this forum, all implying potentially crippling metabolic energy dysfunction would ensue from this. I guess the best treatment for this, is more exercise and CBT. Yes, a brilliant idea!

    It would interest me to see who else has Lyme or similar pathogens who have a diagnosis of 'CFS' and have been left to rot in society with horrendous neurological symptoms and signs of autoimmunity and infection/chronic immune activation.

    It wouldn't be beyond possibility that severe ME may hide a novel prion disease (loss of PrPC), caused by? That's the 100 million dollar question - perhaps the amount of dollars saved by offering CBT/GE per state., per year as an 'evidenced based' therapy for 'CFS' and turning ME into CFS in the first place and never veering away from the script.

    Now how's that 2-day CPET test research evidence for 'CFS' at the IOM/P2P coming along?
    The one the CDC rejects outright as useful.....the one that proves mitochondria dysfunction and thus an organic disease is untreated.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2015
  11. dga5000

    dga5000

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    Some more info about Midichloria Mitochondrii

    Discovery

    A couple of years ago, Australian postdoc Nate Lo was working at the University of Milan, looking for human pathogens in the tick species Ixodes ricinus, the main vector for Lyme disease. It was all routine until the day his PCR screening protocol revealed a novel 16S rRNA sequence. When his team took a tick apart to look for the new bug, they found it in the ovaries. And, when they looked closely at electron micrographs of infected ovarian tissues, they could see that the microbes were intracellular - living not in the cytoplasm of tick ova, but within their mitochondria.

    http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/24528/title/Use-the-force--bacteria/

    Where?

    "They seem to get in between the inner and outer mitochondrial membranes and eat the mitochondria up. In the end you've just got this empty sack."

    http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/24528/title/Use-the-force--bacteria/

    "It's pretty surprising to see a bacterial species living inside the mitochondrion, which itself was a bacterium," he says. "I think it is significant." Bill Ballard, a mitochondrial specialist from the University of New South Wales, agrees. "This is, as far as I know, the first [bacterium] that actually infects within the mitochondria," he says. "It's a pretty cool paper."

    http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/24528/title/Use-the-force--bacteria/

    Prevalence

    Lo moved to his current post at the University of Sydney, and then wrote to scientists across Europe, Russia, North Africa, and the Middle East, asking them to send ticks for him to screen. Sure enough, he found his bugs, nestled into the ovaries of 100% of female ticks.

    http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/24528/title/Use-the-force--bacteria/
     
  12. maryb

    maryb iherb code TAK122

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    @dga5000
    which lab did the testing, Infectolab?
     
  13. Valentijn

    Valentijn Senior Member

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    I had blood drawn again today, and one of the co-infections being tested is Midichloria Mitochrondrii. Very interesting stuff, and it sounds like it's been found all over the place, even though the original ticks it was found in were European ones.

    I'll try to remember to post here when I get my results.
     
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  14. dga5000

    dga5000

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    The MM test was done by GIGA Sequencing at the University of Liege.
     
  15. Hanna

    Hanna Senior Member

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    Interesting @Valentijn , and which is the lab that will perform the test ?
     
  16. Valentijn

    Valentijn Senior Member

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    Red Laboratories, in Belgium.
     
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  17. Katherine

    Katherine

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    If MM has not been proven to be pathogenic in humans how are they going to interpret those results if positive and what treatment prescribed? Did you ask for the test or was it recommended?
     
  18. Valentijn

    Valentijn Senior Member

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    It was recommended by the doctor. But basically it's a common co-infection (100% of some species of female ticks have it), and it's quite unique in penetrating and hijacking the mitochondria of cells. ME/CFS has a lot in common with mitochondrial diseases, which are typically genetic rather than infectious, so midichloria are a pretty interesting possibility.

    I'm not sure what the implication would be for treatment, if proceeding with the assumption that it's causing symptoms.
     
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  19. acer2000

    acer2000 Senior Member

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    Have they shown MM can infect humans?
     
  20. Katherine

    Katherine

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    It is possible to be bitten by a tick and not have a Borrelia burgdorferi infection but you should probably check out other pathogens that the ticks carry too, such as this one - 'Evidence for Disseminated Mycoplasma fermentans in New Jersey Residents with Antecedent Tick Attachment and Subsequent Musculoskeletal Symptoms'
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17041434

    I don't know what your symptoms are but the above abstract available in full here http://journals.lww.com/jclinrheum/..._Disseminated_Mycoplasma_fermentans_in.3.aspx is a very interesting read.
     
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