Research update from Prof. Ron Davis (video!)

[lauluce]

Just watched the Davis video.

Highlights:

1. Seeing genetic differences, including in locations related to infection (kur locus (spelling?)). sample size only 20 though so doing a validation study in 2018.

2. Finding no pathogens. In fact fewer viruses than in controls. Continuing to look though, using new technology.

3. Detail on the sample size for the imepdance assay: 11 patients, 10 controls. So far all patients show the unique signal (decrease then increase in impedance), and none of the controls. They are getting more controls in.

4. findings in blood flow. They're finding different characteristics in patient blood: it's "strange, a little sticky", "a little different in colour" (!!!) and flows differently through artificial capillaries. And they are developing technology to measure this.

[seriously if our blood is a different colour that's the easiest biomarker I ever heard of. A person with a pair of scissors and a few paint swatches could diagnose anyone!)

5. working eventually toward not only distinguishing patients from controls but also from other ilnesses like MS, Lyme etc.

thanks for the summary! different colour??? WOW!

 

[gregh286]

Heart output significantly controlled by cell volume. Small study but highly significant. Correlated to CFS severity.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/19469714/

The cell volumes have been extensively studied.and consistent with POTS.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4664448/

I think from memory taurine has significant effect on cell volume regulation.
Personally when i expose myself to cell volume enhancers..(or my perception of.cell volume improvers)..hot countries..humidity....baths and sauna my symptoms improve dramatically.

 

[Learner1]

Curious about KIR locus...I found this description here: https://bmcgenomics.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12864-015-1949-7

The major histocompatibility complex (MHC) and the killer cell immunoglobulin-like receptor (KIR) are important regulators of human immune responses and are involved in many human diseases. These loci are highly polymorphic, allowing an extensive antigen-presenting repertoire that enables strong immunity against a wide range of foreign antigens, pathogens and tumor cells. At the same time, its immunogenic heterogeneity can also create incompatibility in allotransplantation procedures, causing graft rejections and graft-versus-host disease (GVHD). Furthermore, many of the hundreds of genes within these immunogenic loci are increasingly recognized as major susceptibility genes for drug hypersensitivity reactions and appear to play a significant role in numerous diseases, including cancer. Taken together, the clinical implications of these loci make it useful to determine the sequence type of these molecules.

Does anyone know more about the KIR locus?

 

[Nickster]

This video truly gives us a view of Rons office and seeing the equipment he uses. Interesting about the "sticky" blood being in all of the cfs/me patients. Also, he mentioned that viruses were not a main factor driving the disease. If that is the case it may be the body attacking itself or malfunctioning. This may turn out to be completely different than we all thought.

Thank you for the video Dr Ron Davis! I will continue to donate to OMF.

 

[gregh286]

This video truly gives us a view of Rons office and seeing the equipment he uses. Interesting about the "sticky" blood being in all of the cfs/me patients. Also, he mentioned that viruses were not a main factor driving the disease. If that is the case it may be the body attacking itself or malfunctioning. This may turn out to be completely different than we all thought.

Thank you for the video Dr Ron Davis! I will continue to donate to OMF.

Incredible to try to visualise in your head the detrimental effect sticky blood would have on the microcirculatory system.

 

[jpcv]

I Will donate too!

 

[ljimbo423]

Interesting about the "sticky" blood being in all of the cfs/me patients. Also, he mentioned that viruses were not a main factor driving the disease. If that is the case it may be the body attacking itself or malfunctioning. This may turn out to be completely different than we all thought.

I believe, as Chris Armstrong says here-

Well we all experience a bacteremia when we exercise. The type of bacteria that enter your bloodstream are usually quite controllable by your immune system but if your gut is further compromised they may release more bacteria into your blood or more pathogenic species or your immune system may already be depleted. This is the concept for the chronic sepsis or SIRS and this is what I think may be behind PEM.

http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...20-2016-metabolomics.47485/page-6#post-791828

Coagulation problems in sepsis are well known-

Coagulation abnormalities in sepsis

Although the pathophysiology of sepsis has been elucidated with the passage of time, sepsis may be regarded as an uncontrolled inflammatory and procoagulant response to infection. The hemostatic changes in sepsis range from subclinical activation of blood coagulation to acute disseminated intravascular coagulation (DIC).

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1875459714001106

I think a low grade sepsis might be the cause of the "sticky blood". I Also think it's the reason they can't find any pathogens. Because there are none in the blood, only lipopolysaccharides (LPS) from gram negative bacteria in the gut, leaking into the bloodstream, causing an immune system reaction.

Just one more thought. LPS can also cause the Warburg effect, also known as the "cell danger response".

How does LPS promote Warburg metabolism in macrophages and DCs?
Activation of macrophages or DCs with a range of stimuli, including LPS10, the TLR3 ligand poly(I:C)11, and type I interferon (IFN)11, induces a metabolic switch from OXPHOS to glycolysis, in a phenomenon similar to the Warburg effect

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4493277/#__sec3title

 

[me/cfs 27931]

Dr. Davis around the 12 minute mark says, "some of the biochemistry going on looks a little bit like diabetes".

Does anyone know if Dr. Davis referring to Type 1 or Type 2 diabetes?

T-cell abnormalities have been implicated in both types of diabetes.

 

[Nickster]

I believe, as Chris Armstrong says here-


http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...20-2016-metabolomics.47485/page-6#post-791828

Coagulation problems in sepsis are well known-


https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1875459714001106

I think a low grade sepsis might be the cause of the "sticky blood". I Also think it's the reason they can't find any pathogens. Because there are none in the blood, only lipopolysaccharides (LPS) from gram negative bacteria in the gut, leaking into the bloodstream, causing an immune system reaction.

Just one more thought. LPS can also cause the Warburg effect, also known as the "cell danger response".


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4493277/#__sec3title

The sepsis theory could be true. My adult son with severe me/cfs says that when he eats and as the food moves thru his system, he feels something gets released and than the fibro pain, over sensitivities and more come out,

 

[Binkie4]

I have sticky blood in the form of factor v leiden. It clots too easily so I inject heparin before long haul flights. I have today looked up factor v leiden and there seems to be some association with me/CFS.

I wonder if Dr Davis is seeing sticky blood peculiar to mE/CFS, or whether his 10 severe ME patients have factor v leiden.

 

[msf]

I believe, as Chris Armstrong says here-


http://forums.phoenixrising.me/inde...20-2016-metabolomics.47485/page-6#post-791828

Coagulation problems in sepsis are well known-


https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1875459714001106

I think a low grade sepsis might be the cause of the "sticky blood". I Also think it's the reason they can't find any pathogens. Because there are none in the blood, only lipopolysaccharides (LPS) from gram negative bacteria in the gut, leaking into the bloodstream, causing an immune system reaction.

Just one more thought. LPS can also cause the Warburg effect, also known as the "cell danger response".


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4493277/#__sec3title

Hey, you nicked that last bit from my blog (and I nicked it from Cort's blog)! But then I think Armstrong nicked his theory from KDM, Maes and Hanson. Seems like something of a consensus is forming...

 

[MonkeyMan]

Mark Davis and Mike Snyder have already been filmed, but the editing isn't done. Likely very soon after the holidays.

This is wonderful to know!! We are blessed not only to have someone of Dr Davis' caliber focusing on CFS, but also that he is interested in keeping us in the loop. (I can name more than one other prominent researcher who never bothers to share their work with the patient community!)

 

[ljimbo423]

Hey, you nicked that last bit from my blog (and I nicked it from Cort's blog)! But then I think Armstrong nicked his theory from KDM, Maes and Hanson. Seems like something of a consensus is forming...

Seems like it!

Jim

 

[Diwi9]

Love these updates and looking forward to hearing more from Mark Davis. Another donation just landed at OMF from me. I want 2018 to be a breakthrough year for ME research. OMF is treatment-focussed. Amen.

 

[Gingergrrl]

@Ben H or @Janet Dafoe (Rose49) Do you know if someone did not have sticky blood if Dr. Davis would consider them not to have ME/CFS (or could this assumption not be made yet)?

Regarding coagulation, aspirin is still one of the my top supps.

That is interesting and I have never tolerated aspirin (life-long, before I was even sick) but I think this is b/c I probably always had sub-clinical MCAS.

Personally when i expose myself to cell volume enhancers..(or my perception of.cell volume improvers)..hot countries..humidity....baths and sauna my symptoms improve dramatically.

I also do not tolerate heat, saunas, etc, but I think this is b/c of POTS.

 

[Janet Dafoe]

I haven't watched the video yet but what did Dr. Davis say re: finding no pathogens? Did he mean by antibody testing or PCR?



Did he say if they tested the subjects for anti-phospholipid or "Hughes" Syndrome? My understanding was that this tests if you have thicker blood or more at risk of a blood clot. I had this testing done prior to starting IVIG (in early 2016) and was negative on all tests/auto-antibodies and my blood was not considered sticky (whatever this means)?

ut what did Dr. Davis say re: finding no pathogens? Did he mean by antibody testing or PCR?

By PCR and by DNA sequencing. Not antibodies.

They haven't yet tested subjects for "Hughes" Syndrome. They are planning to do this.

 

[Janet Dafoe]

Maybe the thick blood is due to low vitamin D or cholesterol
Does anyone know how to spell kur Khur Kerr locus or where it is

It's spelled KIR locus. It's very similar to HLA. It affects the immune system.

 

[picante]

Also, he mentioned that viruses were not a main factor driving the disease.

Oh, I'm not sure he did. Didn't he say that he wasn't finding any viruses? But that they would continue to search with different tests. He said we now know that if there's an infection anywhere in the body, you end up with that pathogen's DNA in the blood. So they want to look for bits of DNA. That goes for any type of pathogen.

 

[Gingergrrl]

By PCR and by DNA sequencing. Not antibodies.

They haven't yet tested subjects for "Hughes" Syndrome. They are planning to do this.

Thanks and I assumed it was PCR/DNA testing but was not sure.

Interesting to hear what they find re: Hughes Syndrome in the future.

I think I asked this in another post, but would Dr. Davis say that if someone does not have "sticky blood" then they probably do not have ME/CFS?

 

[Janet Dafoe]

this video gives hope that they will find a conclusive test for M.E patients if the costs can be brought down to a level that health systems would actually pay hopefully not far from there we shall see an end to all the psych bs in the press. anyway it was enough for me to make a donation in recognition of all the hard work put in by ron davis and the many others working with the support of omf.

Ron says, "Thank you for your support. It's so valuable!"