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Question re brain-fog

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by stridor, Sep 8, 2013.

  1. stridor

    stridor Senior Member

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    I was going to start this by telling you how many pills I take but I got a bit embarrassed. In 2007, I decided that Bipolar Disorder was a biochemical problem in need of a biochemical solution and that began a long journey with many ups-and-downs......oops, just deleted another line. I was going to tell you how much I have spent and got embarrassed again :) Let's just say that I have averaged over 50 pills a day since 2007 and you can guess.

    Anyway, as I loaded my pills for the day, I was trying to think of which ones I could cut back on. It made me wonder whether people here have had any eureka moments...any supplements, changes, magic bullets, that moved them forward or had a significant impact on brain-fog. Hopefully I am not alone in singling this symptom out as having the greatest impact on perceived quality of life.

    Looking for any ideas. My brain-fog has gone from 90% to 15% (as I sit here now) and I am not being ungrateful but it would be a shame to be standing on 3rd base if someone else possessed an answer for me.
     
    rosie26 and traray like this.
  2. traray

    traray

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    I am just like you....many many supplements for years trying to find healing. The two things that have made the biggest changes for me are iodine and Freddds entire B12 protocol. Been on it 2 months now, lots of ups and downs but the consistent improvement is clear thinking. Hopefully increased energy is shortly to follow! Good luck!

    I am too, eager to see if there is another missing piece or if time and patience is the answer. I've lost so many days, months, years, I don't want to wait any longer.....
     
    Antares in NYC likes this.
  3. stridor

    stridor Senior Member

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    I was sent home from work pretty much "brain dead" in July 2012. I had huge problems with standing - I could walk some by then, but I could not stand. If I did, my IQ would drop and I would start to feel panicky, looking around for a place to sit. This is very ME.
    I tried mB12 and I sensed that the "light was turning on" and hearing this, my "mercury Dr" put me on mB12 1 mg S.C. twice weekly. It allowed me to return to work and function well enough to be offered the lead hand job.
    Fast forward to June 2013. My 23andme results came in confirming what I predicted C677T++ and mB12 problems, in this case - MTRR x2 ....plus TCN2, which I did not predict. Known as "the frailty gene" it is needed to move B12 into the cell. Daily injections have brought me to where I am now. So mB12 has been the most help for brain-fog.
    A second thing, and I am not sure just how it factors in is butylate. I'll have to check the files to see if anyone has spoken about this. Good for the gut and helps decrease ammonia which contributes to fog as well. Not sure how much this helps.
    ONe of my problems is that I am losing objectivity when it comes to this symptom. I have been fogged long enough that I am losing memory about what life was like before it. Therefore, I am not always sure for sure if I have improved or if I have taken a step closer to accepting Fog as being a permanent part of my life.
     
    traray likes this.
  4. taroki

    taroki Senior Member

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    I too have spent many years and thousands of dollars on doctors/supplements trying to fix what was wrong with me. So don't worry you are not alone.

    My brain fog is still pretty bad also, though I think it will improve once the parasites are out. I heard hookworms cause brain fog, and that is what I am pretty sure I have based on my gut problems (gut tightening up after removing mercury from gut, digestion/bloating/acid reflux, etc).

    I know it is fixable because my brain fog completely disappeared for 12 hours after taking Quicksilver IMD (mentioned in my other thread), but it came back and I am pretty sure how it is because of the parasites/toxins left behind.

    Let me tell you how amazing it was to wake up with total mental clarity ... it was like Robocop waking up from his chair and suddenly knowing what exactly he needs to do to achieve what he wants! My ability to focus was so much better too. I am so looking forward to having my brain back again.

    For my boyfriend, Omega 3 fish oil helped him with "clearer thinking" after we had already done some detox, for me fish oil helped with "procrastination" but again only after doing some liver/kidney/lymph node detox. I guess it is different for everybody.
     
  5. taniaaust1

    taniaaust1 Senior Member

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    for me B12 was one of the answers (it improved my memory issues).. I was on hydroxyB12 injections twice a week. Im now thou on methylB12. Like yourself I have a double copy of MTHFR C677T . Another part of my answer has been treating my POTS, low blood volume is bad for mind fog .. and also treating my molybdenum deficiency which showed up on a hair analyses. Just after supplementing with molybdenum for 3 days, I gained back able to do maths in my head again, something I hadnt been able to do for 7 years.
     
  6. stridor

    stridor Senior Member

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    How much molydenum do you take? One of my early symptoms was insane itchiness and while I wasn't tested, I believe that SUOX is wonky. So I take one capsule a day to aid sulphite to sulphate conversion. I only get itchy now with certain foods - I have to be careful with coconut.
    Doing math in my head or waking up with a clear mind like taroki seem like the pot of gold at rainbow's end, right now. This is silly because I have made so much progress and I have learned not to bet against myself when it comes to figuring out what is wrong...I am just impatient for the final healing.
    It could be that I just have to wait for the remaining mercury to leave. brad
     
  7. wordweaver27

    wordweaver27

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    taniaaust1, how do you treat low blood volume? My instinct is telling me this is an issue for me and I plan on mentioning it to my doc. I feel like the day that I can stand again without seeing stars and grabbing on to something for fear of falling will be the day my brain returns.
     
  8. sregan

    sregan Senior Member

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    I got the pot of gold this morning! And it was amazing :) it's been so long... Yesterday for the first time took one 750mg cap of NAG. I know my major problem is my gut and a lot of my mental issues come from there. I think either the NAG binds with offending lectins to render them inert OR the offending lectins are taking all my NAG leaving none for building collagen or other things it's needed for. I plan to titrate to the lowest possible dose where I see a decent benefit. Others have already see effectiveness wear off in a few days. Someone reported having his BP increase. I understand there is a balance to be maintained in the body and almost every time I have taken something that has helped so substantially that it doesn't last.

    See this thread
     
  9. sregan

    sregan Senior Member

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    Wanted to answer this also. For me my best supps have been Prenenolone (small sublingual until fog dissappears) and DMAE (Phos-Choline or Lecithin might do just as well) and Huperzine-A also. Also have found some sustained relief with SMP particularly MethylB12. I take a very sparring dose of MFolate since I have 2 MTRR+/+ my problem seems to be with B12 not folate. I have dealt with what I believe is the methyl trap and it's not fun (see my blog).

    Cheers!
     
  10. stridor

    stridor Senior Member

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    I am on HC 25 mg and therefore not much wiggle room there. It did help some as I was not functioning at all before. I take 4 capsules of sunflower lecithin but have never tried huperzine-A. Some of those performance improving supplements work by improving blood supply to the brain (not sure about this one). With CCSVI I have trouble draining the blood from my brain as it is.
    mB12 has been good and I have only been at a therapeutic dose for 3 months so more improvement is possible. I take some mfolate because in addition to MTRR x 2, I have C677T++. I will have a look at NAG...never heard of it until today.
    I would like to try some mitochondrial supports but am not sure how to proceed. Historically, I have not done well with any of them. But that was before I increased the mB12 to daily. Anyone know of a site like this that deals with mitochondrial problems? brad
     
  11. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    I observe from the B12 website that brain fog is caused by thyroid problems. Do not say that you do not have thyroid problems until you have read this: http://www.lef.org/protocols/append...m?source=search&key=TSH reference range So until you have obtained a copy of your blood tests and compared your TSH to the reference range LEF posts which is based on SCIENCE, ou cannot say you have no thyroid problem.

    There are many nutrients needed in the right quantities to keep a thyroid functioning. In specific, these nutrients (except for ashwaghanda): http://www.iherb.com/Thorne-Research-Thyrocsin-Thyroid-Cofactors-120-Veggie-Caps/33639 You can get them anywhere and they should be in any GOOD multiple (except for tyrosine). Thus you will find that one person who was deficient in mB12 can find that fix their thyroid, while for another it will be iodine.

    Now zinc is "like a dial to turn up the thyroid" and the thing about zinc is that it doubles as an antioxidant and can be used up before your thyroid gets all it needs. So for instance I find that allergies substantially deplete zinc and I have to take a large dose of zinc picolinate (much more absorbable) to be able to breathe during allergy season. You will find that if zinc is the issue that you also have hypochlorhydria since zinc and P5P are needed to make stomach acid. If you eat a low protein diet as I do (required by my genes as I cannot easily excrete ammonia) then you may need extra tyrosine (I am prescribed 1g/day). This is in addition to what is in thyrocsin, which is a basic level of everything. You may find that if you are fighting off some virus like Epstein -Barr that it may consume zinc to do that - idk as I do not have that so I am only guessing. So I am saying that the above nutrients are everything your thyroid needs but not necessarily a high enough dose for you, depending on you. (Please be aware that if you take zinc you need to balance it with copper). Now to the person who said hormones helped...hormones govern gene expression. Anyway, they are game changers. In addition to the fact that they change gene expression, they even affect cytokines. For instance DHEA inhibits TNF-alpha (which could affect how much zinc is wasted fighting inflammation - your own dead and dying cells killd by your own immune system). idk what pregnenolone affects but one of the things it makes id DHEA.

    Frankly I think everything works better if you restore hormones as well as give the thyroid what it needs. But that's your call.

    I also find in myself that I can get brain fog from low salt (and I know we add iodine to salt but I don't think that's it). I find if I am getting the sort of migraine from dialted (leaky) blood vessels then salt helps constrict then or something. It won't work on a migraine from constricted blood vessels.
     
    sregan and stridor like this.
  12. stridor

    stridor Senior Member

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    Thanks, I agree.
    Thyroid was the first thing that I went after in 2011. My TSH was in the so-called normal range but by body didn't get the memo. My eyebrows were affected and I couldn't get my temperature over 96F. I take 90 mg of dessicated thyroid and 50 mcg of synthroid daily and my T3 and T4 are both pegged at the very top.
    I have a theory.
    I was mercury toxic. In the brain mercury is stored in the astrocytes away from the vulnerable neurons. The astrocytes are living cells too and get sick. Things that they are supposed to do suffer. This includes the formation of the lion's share of glutathione for the neurons, T4 to T3 conversion and removing glutamate so that it does not become toxic.
    If my theory is right then it doesn't matter what my peripheral blood work says. I am only interested in whether my brain is getting enough T3. Particularly since I used to have Bipolar Disorder and the norepinephrine and limbic systems which are involved in this little problem have the highest T3 receptor site count.
    With damaged astrocytes, I can expect problems with glutathione production as well and this may be why I can not tolerate some of the supports like Q10 and carnitine that help in energy production.
    I will be on thyroid pills for the remainder of my life. My TSH runs around 0.02 - my thyroid is asleep.
     
  13. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    Um...I hope that's a typo. TSH of 0.2 means HIGH thyroid. I do not know what the range is at that end but I'd check to be sure that's not Hyperthyroid.
     
  14. CFS_for_19_years

    CFS_for_19_years First Do No Harm

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    Having been hypothyroid for a time, I can tell you that I didn't "wake up" until T3 was added to my regimen. I had to beg for it, as my doctor was convinced giving me T4 was sufficient.

    Have a look at this website and consider getting the book about recovering with T3:
    http://recoveringwitht3.com/
     
  15. stridor

    stridor Senior Member

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    Hi, That's what I am saying. My thyroid meds have pushed my T3 and T4 levels as high as my Dr will allow = tippy-top of the normal range. This tells the brain to slow down the thyroid function and the hypothalamus releases less and less TSH.
     
  16. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    Well the next thing to check would be your adrenal gland...since they are in some ways connected and may cause similar symptoms when they have problems. I am only guessing. When my adrenal gland is out I get low blood sugar and anxiety (always) and blood pressure sometimes (even though I normally have terrific problems with high blood pressure). I crave salt then and w/o salt I get a type of brain fog. Have you checked out your adrenal? I used to have a lot of problem with mine prolly because of all the coffee I drank, since DHEA (an adrenal hormone) needs to be in a 10:1 ratio with cortisone/cortisol (I'm afraid I don't know which form of cort this is) in order to avoid an over-stress response (stress your system cannot handle). Coffee is liquid cortisol (2 cups raises cortisol 33%). No - cancel that - I was having low blood sugar problems all my life - prolly due to untreated allergies (My parents believed in ignoring problems and that if I wasn't so STUBBORN and SELF-ABSORBED they would magically go away!) I now only have this happen during allergy season but I used to have to suck down salt every PMS.

    Inflammation "crabs up" the brain. Just something to consider as this is what causes sinus headache. (And I am looking into it regarding my allergies because I suspect it is platelet aggregating factor that does it). If you suspect inflammation, try aspirin. It works better than anything I've tried although taking too much or long term can cause stomach bleeding (so be wary). Or try Ginkgold (a honkin big dose of Gingko proven to increase brain circulation, and it does). Milder anti-inflammatories include boswella. I have not tried curcumin but it also is supposed to have this effect. Curcumin interferes with CYP3A4 so don't take it every day or if you take any medications that are excreted via CYP3A4.

    You can measure your homocysteine...if it's much over 6.3 it could be that clogging your brain. Although mine has ridden higher w/o that problem. TMG will clear out elevated homocysteine quickly so you can tell if that's the issue (and then proceed to a more sensible protocol based on B vitamins...you cannot rely only on TMG - it will cause brain edema if you do not get the mfolate+mB12 pathway and the P5P pathways working as well).
     
    stridor likes this.
  17. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    To explore adrenal issues, read up here:http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info/faq/

    1) What are the symptoms of adrenal problems? Fatigue, anxiety, light-headedness, shakiness, dizziness, nausea, and difficulty dealing with stressful situations. Dr. Rind says “Most people have a mixture of poor thyroid and poor adrenal function rather than purely one or the other, and therefore a mixture of symptoms”. He also says that poor thyroid and/or adrenal function is the most common cause of low metabolic energy. Metabolism is defined as the chemical changes in living cells by which energy is provided for vital processes (Websters). Please refer to this chart of symptoms http://www.drrind.com/therapies/metabolic-symptoms-matrix
    2) How can I tell if my problems are adrenal, or thyroid? The body’s temperature drops as the metabolism drops. Low temperatures are caused by low thyroid. If the adrenal hormone cortisol is low, the average daily temperature will fluctuate when comparing one day’s average to the next. (See Discovery Step Two, number Four, here.) We are not talking about temperature changes during one day – it is normal to wake up with lower temperatures and hitting a peak in the later afternoon. Take your temperature 3 hours after waking, again 3 hours later, and again in another 3 hours. You average those 3 readings to get one single number for that day. Please read Janie’s page http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/temperature/ and follow her link to Dr. Rind. Look at his examples and download his blank chart. Begin filling in your temperatures. If you post a question about your dosing, someone is going to ask about your temps.

    3) What is Adrenal Insufficiency? In 1855, Thomas Addison first described adrenal insufficiency, which was subsequently named after him. Originally, tuberculosis was the most common reason for the adrenal gland failure. Currently, Addison disease most commonly results from autoimmune destruction of the adrenal gland. The adrenal hormones Cortisol and Aldosterone are vital for life, so Addison’s disease can be fatal.
    If you search for information on Addison’s disease, you fill find quotes such as this one: “Adrenal insufficiency occurs when at least 90 percent of the adrenal cortex has been destroyed.” http://endocrine.niddk.nih.gov/pubs/addison/addison.aspx

    4) Is Adrenal Fatigue the same thing as Adrenal Insufficiency?
    No. The person with Adrenal Fatigue may have less severe symptoms, and there are lots of shades of gray. Here is an example from a medical site: “A significant number of patients with partial loss of adrenal function (limited adrenocortical reserve) appear well but experience adrenal crisis when under physiologic stress (eg, surgery, infection, burns, critical illness)” http://www.merck.com/mmpe/sec12/ch153/ch153b.html
    A person with a more serious case of adrenal fatigue may have chronic symptoms of fatigue. They may have symptoms associated with low blood sugar (one of cortisol’s jobs is to help regulate glucose). They may feel light headed upon standing, as another function of cortisol is to maintain blood pressure.
    Dr. Ron Kennedy says “Addison’s disease is so rare, and adrenal fatigue so common, that I prefer to spend most of our space here on the latter. This syndrome is marked by loss of energy with the experience of fatigue and oversleeping”. http://www.medical-library.net/content/view/75/41/
    Dr. Tintera was making comments like this way back in 1955 “a former hypothesis – that the adrenal cortex functioned according to the classic “all or none” law – is repudiated as being contrary to both clinical and experimental evidence. Hypoadrenocorticism may be congenital or acquired, complete or partial. The two former subdivisions frequently fail of recognition.” http://www.fred.net/slowup/tint01.html
    Many members discovered their adrenal fatigue when they started thyroid medication – because the increased metabolism strained the adrenals. http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/things-we-have-learned Doctor Broda Barnes describes this in his lectures “And the thing that we have to think of very often, is a partial adrenal deficiency too. If the blood pressure of a patient is 100 systolic or below, I hesitate, in fact I won’t start them on thyroid, without giving them 5mg of prednisone at the same time. Because, if you raise the metabolism a little as we’re doing with the thyroid, you also have to have a little more secretion from the adrenal. The normal gland, can furnish it and do all right. But if the blood pressure is too low in the beginning, the chances are that this patient is going to get worse, about four days after you start them on thyroid, they will become worse than they were.” (5 mg of Prednisone is = to 20 mg of hydrocortisone)

    5) How do I test the condition of my adrenals? Please read what Janie says here http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info/ If your doctor insists on blood tests for cortisol, they are only going to show the combo of bound and unbound. Doesn’t work. http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/recommended-labwork/

    etc. (there is lots more)
     
  18. triffid113

    triffid113 Day of the Square Peg

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    Hey - check out #4 above. It looks like POTS can be a symptom of insufficient adrenal function.
     
  19. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    I think your TSH is to be expected on the meds you are on and does not signal hyperthyroidism.

    But most people do not feel well with a FT4 at the top of the range. Most women seem to feel best with a FT4 of around 1.3 and men slightly higher.

    I might consider talking to your doctor about a reduction in the T4 med if you are feeling symptoms.

    Ema
     
  20. Ema

    Ema Senior Member

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    While I agree that the addition of T3 meds is invaluable for most, I do have concerns and reservations about the Recovering with T3 book and method. I don't think it works and many people have had bad experiences with it. Even Janie at STTM no longer recommends this method after being quite hot on it at first. Too many people having troubles caused her to revise her opinion.

    Ema
     

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