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problems with potassium with b12 protocol

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by girlfromeurope, Nov 9, 2013.

  1. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    Hi ,when I started to supplement with b12 and metafolin I started to have severe low potassium symptoms.
    I got high anxiety, drained feeling, palpitations, muscle spasms, insomnia,...
    But I don't find great relief with supplements and foods high in potassium don't help at all. I'm scared to overdo potassium as I have adrenal fatigue, so high potassium can be a problem. I've also experienced a potassium overdose where I got relief from sea salt. So he problem is that my symptoms of high potassium and low potassium are the same. Now I don't know how much to take. I really need the b12, I felt wonderful the first week, until the potassium problems began.

    Please share your experiences with potassium
    What dose are the most on?
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2013
  2. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    also I stopped the b12 and metafolin for a couple of days now but I keep having the low potassium symptoms.
    I supplemented potassium yesterday and felt better. But today I feel bad again even though I haven't taken any b12/metafolin.
     
    celeste likes this.
  3. SickOfSickness

    SickOfSickness Senior Member

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  4. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    I've read most of the threads
    Im scared to supplement such a high dose because of my low aldosterone and i've experienced high potassium before

    does someone know how long it takes to potassium levels to rise?
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2013
  5. I am confused by low potassium symptoms - this morning when I went to supermarket I felt shaky and odd like I might expect from low blood sugar, thought I might faint, and I wonder if this was low potassium as I hadnt taken any this morning. It wasnt anxiety or palpitations though.

    I take a teaspoon of potassium gluconate in 500ml water (about 500mg potassium) so a lot more than a 99mg tablet!!! I have had 2 bottles since the episode and I feel fine now.
     
  6. Crux

    Crux Senior Member

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    I suspect it's the folate causing the problems. Not everyone will need it. If there is B12 deficiency, folate can build up to excessive levels in many people. It may take some days to reduce it.
     
  7. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    I had a blood test a while ago and my folic acid was on the low side. So I think I do need it
    I think you will always need folate if you supplement with b12
     
    Al Klein likes this.
  8. Star-Anise

    Star-Anise Senior Member

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    @girlfromeurope
    unfortunately in my experience and reading this methylation thing is not always linear and it doesn't always feel good.
    I, too, started with extremely weak adrenals, and I think that my weak adrenals are part of the equation.
    There are so many opinions about different points to start (i.e. focus on methylation as a priority, focus on healing adrenals... and so on). I have worked with a number of health professionals, and what I have learned is that you have to experiment, and not give up. Unfortunately, I find they often can only give you a good tip, or point you in the right direction, but the real answers will come when you fiddle with your own unique set of issues, and experiment until you find something that works.
    That being said :) I can offer you the following advice mostly based on my own experience..
    a) for methylation getting my genetic testing was key. I thought that I knew what my results were going to be based on my own extrapolation from reading my symptoms and I was wrong. I was experimenting with methylation supplements prior to getting the testing done & was having somewhat mixed results. As it turns out I was COMT -/- all around, versus COMT +/+ as I thought because I would have such severe fatigue resulting from methyl donors. The fatigue was likely detox reactions, versus an intolerance to methyl.
    b) I read somewhere that some people are not able to proceed with increasing methylation supplements until they address their mercury issues, and they have all kinds of issues with excito-toxicity (over-stimulation) and relapses with fatigue due to heavy detoxification. This definitely was the case with me. I could only tolerate a fraction of the methyl supplements prior to getting the amalgam filling left in my mouth removed.
    c) as per genetic testing addressing my CBS status was key. This is somewhat of a controversial mutation, as many believe that it is not as problematic as some people like Dr. Yasko claim it was. I dunno. I don't have enough of a science brain to get into that debate. What I know, is that avoidance of sulphur is key for me. If I don't, then I get real sick, real fast.

    With respect to potassium, I absolutely agree with @SickOfSickness above. In my experience, I am averaging about 700-800mg per day supplemental, and as much as I can get into my through diet. And, I'm still craving more, and am still experiencing potassium drops periodically, especially when I have upped my methyl donors.

    I did read a post awhile back that was asking that question that I think you have in regards to salt vs potassium especially in the case of adrenal fatigue. I thought it was interesting, and something worthy of consideration as well. Again, I'm limited with respect to the science, so it didn't go much farther than that! Lol :)

    What I'm doing is still adding loads of sea salt to almost every meal I eat, and still continuing with the potassium supplement/diet as outlined above. My hope is that they would balance each other out as to not create any extreme excess or deficiencies in my body. I'm not sure that by eating added salt one would completely void the value of the potassium, as even though I'm eating lots of sea salt, I seem to derive great benefit from the potassium (decreased fatigue, decreased water retention, decreased cravings).

    *I think the real trick is to find a dose of methylfolate and methyl-B12 that doesn't give you such severe potassium drops and start-up symptoms (high anxiety, drained feeling, palpitations, muscle spasms, insomnia). When I first started I could only tolerate 1/16th of my 1000mg methylfolate pill (62 mg) every 3rd day. I also could only tolerate 1/4 of my 1000 mcg B12 (250mcg) on opposite days - *I wouldn't take the B12 and methylfolate on the same day*.
    I also stared with hydroxy-B12 and folinic acid instead. I think I was extremely deficient in all kinds of folate, and had detox symptoms just from the small amount folinic acid I started with.
    The real important thing is to follow your symptoms, but ensure that you are not panicking. Experiment with very small doses. Open up the capsules, and split them into tiny doses as to not create such a roller coaster of symptoms.
    Don't subscribe to the "one-a-day" mentality with supplements. I have heard of some people only being able to tolerate once/week methyl supplementation in tiny, tiny doses to begin with.

    When you are experiencing the anxiety, agitation, insomnia it doesn't necessarily mean that you are going down the wrong path, but likely, that you are over-supplementing, and need to decrease your doses.

    If you find that you are just not making headway, maybe you want to dial the methylation supplements right back and focus on building some adrenal health whether that be through adaptogen or glandular supplementation. Ensure that you are well rested, and not engaging in stressful activities. I have recently been benefiting greatly from IV Vitamin C, which is such a supportive therapy for adrenals/liver, and anti-inflammatory - great for whole system. In my mind since methylation can cause additional stress as it starts to ramp up one's natural detoxification pathways, & there often can be a huge backlog in toxins that have accumulated over the years, one must have healthy enough adrenals to support the detox process once it has been initiated.

    Hopefully that helps ;) All the best,
     
    Snowdrop and girlfromeurope like this.
  9. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    Hi, thanks for your reply
    How much folate and b12 are you taking now?
    The reason why I take methylation supplements before building up my adrenal health is because I have severe b12 deficiency. I took methyl b12 5mg a day for one week and I tolerated it well. But then I got the potassium problems and after adding methylfolate I got a potassium crash. And now after 5 days of not supplementing b12 and methylfolate I still feel very bad.
    I add sea salt everyday to try balancing things out, like you do.
    I wish there was a doctor who knew all the answers , but I guess we have to keep on experimenting ;)
     
  10. Star-Anise

    Star-Anise Senior Member

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    @girlfromeurope
    Split into 3 doses: 3500 mcg methylB12, and 600 mg methylfolate per day

    *5mg* or 5 mcg?
    1 milligram = 1000 micrograms (mcg)
    In mg I'm taking 3.5 mg/day and it took me most of a year to build up to that.
    5mg is a *Huge* dose of methylB12 to start with, and it makes sense that you are not feeling well now as it likely caused a *huge* detox reaction. Those large doses work for some people that do not have compromised systems, but not for most of us on this forum for various different reasons. I would stop all methyl supplementation for right now, and work on supporting a gentle detox for your system right now. Drink water, do something if you can tolerate that causes a light sweat like light yoga or infrared sauna (small amount, short times), and rest, rest, rest. Use moderate amounts of potassium and don't try to ramp up any of your other supplements or introduce anything new. And most importantly don't panic. We have all been where you are right now.
    I understand that you are worried about your low B12, and low folic acid. However, these are chronic deficiencies that have existed likely for a long time. As well, it will take some time to turn around. It took me one two years to double my B12.

    Once you feel a little more stable, then look at introducing B12 again first. But at a fraction of the dose :) Don't add any methylfolate until you are at a stable B12 dose for a few weeks. And then again, tiny, tiny, tiny doses. When I first started I took the B12 and methylfolate at different parts of the day, and then worked up to taking them at same time. As well, I didn't take the B12 and folate on the same day. Same goes for hydroxy and folinic acid. I didn't start with even taking them both on the same day. If I were you I would think about starting with the hydroxy B12, and folinic acid. But there are varying opinions on this forum and in general about this approach.

    It might take several weeks after you stop methyl supplements to feel back to your baseline. Don't panic :)
     
  11. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    I took 5 mg. I felt great on it without toxic effects before I got the potassium crash.
    I think I'll stop taking the methylfolate for a while. As that gives me the most problems.
     
  12. Star-Anise

    Star-Anise Senior Member

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    Ya read some of Ben Lynch's stuff on his website if you have some surplus in energy. It's common to feel great when you first start methyl donors and then crash a few weeks later. :) I did the same thing - got stabilized on b12 first and then introduced the folate in tiny doses :) all the best,
     
    Violeta likes this.
  13. Star-Anise

    Star-Anise Senior Member

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    you'll still be deriving benefit from the b12 supplementation w/o the folate :)
     
    Violeta likes this.
  14. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    hope so :)
     
    Star-Anise likes this.
  15. Plum

    Plum Senior Member

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    I'm very weary of taking potassium as a supplement - it really messes with yr stomach. Coconut water is good for potassium. Also for adrenal issues I've hard taking the potassium at night can help to calm the adrenals for sleep. I too have major adrenal issues. Due to not being able to supplement with potassium I stopped methylation.
     
  16. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    I tried coconut water but it does not seem to help enough
     
  17. I thinbk the potassium gluconate is making me feel nauseous? this isnt the first time!!! I am not sure what to try next! This morning I got what I think were low potassium symptoms (felt weak, like low blood sugar, shakey), but now driniking it makes me nauseous.
     
  18. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    I got nauseous too today . I took 600 mg potassium but still feeling bad
     
  19. Do you think the potassium is making you nauseous?
     
  20. girlfromeurope

    girlfromeurope Senior Member

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    I don't know, I get nauseous when I'm low on potassium but the symptoms of low and high potassium are the same
     

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