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POTASSIUM- when does the Hypokalemia stop ??????

Discussion in 'Detox: Methylation; B12; Glutathione; Chelation' started by ldn, May 2, 2012.

  1. ldn

    ldn

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    Have been on the methylation program for about four weeks now-definite drops in potassium- supplementing with approx 1600mg tabs per day plus one or two bananas.

    Will the hypokalemia correct itself after a certain period on the active B's or will it only stop when I come off the methylation tablets ?

    What length of time are people taking active B's for ?- the theory is that they are a kick start for the methylation cycle which after a period should become self-regulating - is this correct ?

    Apologies if this has been answered elsewhere- have been searching but can't find specific result.

    Thank yea kindly.
  2. nanonug

    nanonug Senior Member

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    If hypokalemia continues to persists, I would suspect magnesium deficiency. Proper levels of intracellular magnesium are necessary to keep potassium levels in your body.
  3. daisychain

    daisychain

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    Thankyou LDN, I was going to ask this same question! I've been taking the methylation supps for about the same time that you have, and I still get symptoms of low potassium if I don't take enough of it. I use transdermal magnesium oil but maybe it takes a while to build up your mag. levels?

    PS. I see you're in the UK. You can get a type of sea salt here called Solo that has less sodium and more potassium & magnesium.
  4. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

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    I'm going on 5 months, and still need about 5000mg potassium per day. I don't think it ever stops.

    I have a problem with the theory that this potassium need is a "signpost of healing". I believe something else is going on, though I'm not sure what. Low ATP levels are my guess at the moment.
  5. daisychain

    daisychain

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    Interesting, adreno. Do you supplement with magnesium at all?

    Would the low ATP levels be caused by the methylation protocol according to your theory, or is it a separate health issue?
  6. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

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    I take about 800mg magnesium daily.

    I believe the low ATP is a general issue in ME. You need ATP to drive the sodium-potassium pump. Without enough energy, potassium leaks from cells.

    Methylation should increase ATP levels though.

    I'm going to experiment with NAD and ribose, to see if this decreases potassium needs.
  7. ldn

    ldn

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    Hi Adreno and Daisychain

    I take about 2400mg magnesium chloride a day and notice a real difference for me compared to other forms of mg. I have had the mitochondrial function test done twice now ( ATP to ADP conversion etc ) through Breakspeare and Dr Myhill both with extremely poor results so I know ATP is a big part of my problem .Took d-ribose ,coq10, alpha lipoic acid on the back of these results but with no benefit. Maybe these supplements would now be of help now that my methylation is apparently getting a kick start.Any ATP wisdom out there ?

    As we've been on the active B's for a similar period it would be interesting to compare progress/side effects with you Daisychain - if you'd like to PM me. Feel like im flying in the dark a bit right now not knowing how long potassium weakness is going to persist et al. I will have a look at the Solo salts- thanks for the recommendation.

    Ldn
  8. ldn

    ldn

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  9. Adster

    Adster Senior Member

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    To raise ATP a couple of options are sublingual ATP(Douglas Labs) or Creatine powder.
    SaraM likes this.
  10. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

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    If I do any exercise, I find that I need much more potassium. I often have to double my dose in that case (to about 10g). Maybe this is due to a drop in ATP.
  11. jimmerjammer

    jimmerjammer

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    Adreno,

    What do you think is the max daily dosage of Potassium? I've been up to 4-5 grams with good results, but am paranoid about going higher. I also do feel a "crash" after re-starting to workout again. BUT, I have many other variables going on- so I can't be sure this is the cause(I'm also not sure that I have CFS-just know I am improving from the knowledge here). It would be nice to know I could go a tad higher with Potassium though.

    You are not worried about high dose potassium? Please let me know your normal daily and daily max(I recognize your username from other forums, so I know you have sound reasoning for what you are doing).... thanks!
  12. adreno

    adreno 3% neanderthal

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    I haven't seen any evidence that potassium is dangerous in moderate doses, unless you have kidney problems. I have read studies estimating paleo diets to comprise 10-15 grams of potassium daily, so I am sure our bodies can process that. I also read about some tribes who have a daily intake over 10g still today.

    I have read a warning that more than 18 grams in a single dose can be dangerous, but I never go that high.

    I make my own electrolyte drink, mixing 1/4 ts sea salt, 1/4 ts calcium citrate, 1/4 ts magnesium citrate, and 1 ts potassium citrate per liter of water. Then I drink 8oz every hour of the day, except with meals (plain water). One 8oz glass holds about 350mg potassium.

    After a workout, I find I need more potassium, so I basically double my dose. For every glass of electrolyzed water, I add another 1/4 ts of potassium citrate. This will bring the dose to about 700mg per glass/hour. When I feel fine, I go back to my regular dosing.

    By spacing the potassium doses every hour, you can make sure that you don't go too high.

    Oh, and one way I can judge my potassium needs, is by heart rate. I get tachycardia when my potassium is low. So I continue dosing potassium until my heart rate calms down (resting heart rate of 60 bpm).
    SaraM likes this.
  13. jimmerjammer

    jimmerjammer

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    cool. thanks for the info!
  14. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Adster,

    Adb12 plus l-carnitine fumarate plus cofactors usually will bring up the ATP in body and brain. If it doesn't there is usually a reason.
  15. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi IDN,

    IN my experience most folks need 2000-3000mg daily on a pretty stable basis as long as healing continues which can go on for years. If the body returns to a state of no need healing, some people have come off of any extra potassium and also decreased metafolin and mb12 but still take a maintenance amount.
  16. Adster

    Adster Senior Member

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    Both of those seem to cause issues with my sleep unfortunately. ATP supplementation also does this, but creatine seems to be ok, and gives noticable impovements in muscle endurance.
  17. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi adster,

    The sleep issues resolve. The difference is that the adb12 with LCF gets the mitochondria working again in the mitochondria and liver, thereby supplying the energy for these things to do their jobs and correcting a fundamental deficiency. ATP and creatine don't correct the deficiency but instead at are attempting to fix some of the results of the fundamental deficiency but no doubt does not fix all of them. Muscle endurance accounts for perhaps 1/6-1/3 of the adb12-LCF usage in the body.
  18. Adster

    Adster Senior Member

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    I know that the sleep issues theoretically should resolve, but after several years of methalation treatment they have not. Therefore I am unable to take useful dosages of these things and maintain the functional state of health required to care for myself.
  19. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi Adster,

    What were you taking and perhaps more important, what were you not taking. We know a whole lot more now about certain things now than 2 years ago. What dosages were you able to take or taking? Order can be important. Also, perhaps a different theroetical basis than "methylation" might have better results. Perhaps it would be worth looking at again from a different basis.
  20. Freddd

    Freddd Senior Member

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    Hi LDN,

    The active b12 protcol uses adb12 and l-carntine fumarate to get the mitochondria working which it usually does very well. along with mb12, Methylfolate, and basic vitamins, minerals, fats, etc. It takes adenosylb12 and l-carnitine fumarate which have everything to do with ATP production but nothing at all to do with methylation. If you take enough potassium there isn't potassium weakness. Low potassium can get a lot worse leading to paralysis and death.

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