POLL: How far were you living from a mobile phone base station mast when your ME/CFS first appeared?

[Hip]

You may want to take a closer look at that site, and then compare their curated collection to studies which were undertaken without any desired conclusion in mind.

Unfortunately a lot of websites that focus on the possible ill health effects of electromagnetic radiation tend to be somewhat alarmist, or work on the unproven assumption that electromagnetic waves are a health concern. But posting a list of studies from such websites is not an endorsement of their views or opinions.

The list of studies I posted was just to show that electromagnetic waves can have a biological effect at power levels that are below any thermal heating effect. Having a biological effect does not necessarily mean EM waves cause harm though.

Nobody should look at the above list and feel alarmed or worried.

 

[sb4]

You may want to take a closer look at that site, and then compare their curated collection to studies which were undertaken without any desired conclusion in mind. To put it in the mildest terms, that site is science less than Honey Crunch Granola Bars are healthy food. To put it in forthright terms might not be appropriate for a forum where most of us have brain fog and not much to be cheerful about, it would involve references to reptiles that walk upright and such.

Considering that we have brain fog, no single reliable source of information, frequently no formal training that included lab time (rather hard to do when one is too sick to stand, much less think) and that many of us have few venues to hang out other than around the internet (aka The International Bovine Manure Trebuchet Operator and Catcher's Association), we can wander down the rabbit hole a bit too easily. There's no shortage of characters with a desire to lead a crowd into theirs.

Whilst that is true this is just one site, there are thousands of studies and several doctors I trust who think emfs are a real problem.

Nobody should look at the above list and feel alarmed or worried.

I would argue you should feel worried as that would give you the motivation to do more research into it and to protect yourself.

 

[HowToEscape?]

Whilst that is true this is just one site, there are thousands of studies and several doctors I trust who think emfs are a real problem.



I would argue you should feel worried as that would give you the motivation to do more research into it and to protect yourself.

It's a bit hard for any of us to do such research. How would I, for example, get it done? I'd have to design a controlled experiment, but I don't know how to do that. I could learn, albeit slowly, but then mail isn't getting answered. I'm also going to forget pieces of whatever I learn, but won't recall which pieces (brain fog). I'd have to get 10,000-ish volunteers and 10 years or so. Then I need to gather subjects and do the experiment ... oops, ethical problems.
Ah, well, not today.

How about a retrospective experiment? Look back on stuff that's already happened and decide if it fits my theory? That's harder, because it's too easy: too easy to find evidence in favor of any conclusion I have in mind, if I shine the flashlight the right way. Such no-experiment studies can be done, but it's easy to produce garbage that way, and there are thousands of garbage studies of that nature. You can, for example, conclude that we MECF types are probably just a bunch of child abuse victims or other weak sorts with such methods, especially if you were looking for evidence to support that hunch.
Ouch, headache. I'll pass on this one.

Well, I could just Google, Facebook etc and pick out whatever piques my interest. That lets me access a special kind of knowledge, once called gossip. By that method people once "knew" that diseases were caused by witches, Jews and widows.

 

[sb4]

It's a bit hard for any of us to do such research. How would I, for example, get it done? I'd have to design a controlled experiment, but I don't know how to do that. I could learn, albeit slowly, but then mail isn't getting answered. I'm also going to forget pieces of whatever I learn, but won't recall which pieces (brain fog). I'd have to get 10,000-ish volunteers and 10 years or so. Then I need to gather subjects and do the experiment ... oops, ethical problems.
Ah, well, not today.

How about a retrospective experiment? Look back on stuff that's already happened and decide if it fits my theory? That's harder, because it's too easy: too easy to find evidence in favor of any conclusion I have in mind, if I shine the flashlight the right way. Such no-experiment studies can be done, but it's easy to produce garbage that way, and there are thousands of garbage studies of that nature. You can, for example, conclude that we MECF types are probably just a bunch of child abuse victims or other weak sorts with such methods, especially if you were looking for evidence to support that hunch.
Ouch, headache. I'll pass on this one.

Well, I could just Google, Facebook etc and pick out whatever piques my interest. That lets me access a special kind of knowledge, once called gossip. By that method people once "knew" that diseases were caused by witches, Jews and widows.

This is true, the best solution is to read a lot, try to increase your ability to decipher good sources from bad, experiment on yourself and make your decision based on that.

 

[ellecognito]

There was no such thing when I became sick. I voted 500 meters or more, but it's a bit misleading.

 

[Hip]

There was no such thing when I became sick. I voted 500 meters or more, but it's a bit misleading.

It does say that the poll is only really open to people whose ME/CFS started in the last 10 to 15 years. (But I perhaps should have put an option in for people whose ME/CFS started before mobile phones appeared).

 

[Carl]

I dislike mobile phones and do not own one, they are dangerous that I have no doubt but mobile phones have nothing to do with CFS development. That I am absolutely certain! The cause is a bacteria and not mobile phones!

BTW I chose my home based upon it's distance from mobile masts. I am that against them. It's not easy finding a home which is away from mobile masts and mobile masts can be placed anywhere even right outside a persons home.

I am just over 426 meters away from the nearest mast but it is on top of a hill and reception is quite poor where I am. There are 3 within 500 meters. People working on my home have had trouble when using mobile phones. However when problems first surfaced I was living at a different property which was just over 324 meters from the nearest base station. The mobile masts were far more concentrated at my previous address with 4 within 424 meters, 3 of which were within 400 meters (324+).

 

[sb4]

That I am absolutely certain! The cause is a bacteria and not mobile phones!

What makes you so sure?

If EMF affects the immune system , and it's looking more like cfs is autoimmunity problem , then a poorly immune system could be unable to control the bacteria in the gut....

 

[Carl]

What makes you so sure?

Because I worked out the cause of CFS 3 years ago and have been attempting to destroy the infection ever since. They are highly resistant and adapt extremely quickly which makes beating them very difficult. I have had a partial success using colloidal silver and I am attempting to make my own CS and reducing it using various things to beat them. Many people complain of stomach upset and poor digestion, low stomach acid and.........burping and runny noses when eating. I noticed all of this and put it all together. Many take supplements for ammonia but fail to address the cause of the ammonia ie Urease and urea from saliva.

If EMF affects the immune system , and it's looking more like cfs is autoimmunity problem , then a poorly immune system could be unable to control the bacteria in the gut....

That's just it, it isn't the gut that is the problem. Any changes to bacteria are the result of poor stomach function and poorly digested food. Also when these bacteria attack the stomach they cause a reflex effect in the colon, to be precise the right transverse colon which can cause IBS in some people. However destroying the stomach infection causes the nervous system to repair and the effect in the colon is resolved. This is what happened for me at the end of last year when I used particulate ie reduced CS. Ionic silver had no effect because I tried that but reduced CS had a distinct feeling in my stomach which I have experienced before when taking essential oils but those never had the dramatic effect that CS had. CS did not destroy the whole infection, the centre of it was not destroyed but I do have a few cards up my sleeve which I think will beat them. The infection which was largely destroyed was not the infection which causes my CFS because my stomach has multiple infections, 5 in total. It's one distinct area of infection which causes CFS as it is another area which affects the pituitary and hypothalamus. If you look in my treatments you will see one herb which helps the pituitary, hypothalamus, adrenal/kidney which helps me a lot. It's the biofilms which cause the leaky gut because they allow undigested food to enter the circulatory system, provoking histamine release which triggers a runny nose and increase in saliva which provides the urea that they need to neutralise stomach acid. This is where the burping comes in to it. I worked all this out in January 2014.

My stomach infection is so severe and the permeability so great that it is enough to show in the iris. Radii Solaris only show when the infection is severe and permeability is very high. I have 5 markings in my irises and the largest was mostly eliminated at the end of last year. I am attempting to now destroy the rest.

Some people can have success using bacteria, bacillus subtilis and other soill based bacteria can be effective but they are not all that effective against severe and established biofilms. The responsible bacteria prevent the healing of the digestive system and it is only when they are destroyed that the stomach AND colon can heal. All the leaky gut cures are useless because they fail to address the infection and L-Glutamine can never work.

There are many things which can have an effect against biofilms. NAC, acetic acid ie vinegar, asprin salicylic acid, enzymes such as interfase+, nattokinase, serrapeptase which is in interfase+ and chelation among many others. Chelation can help mop up calcium, magnesium and iron and other heavy metals which are used to build biofilms. Interfase+ contains EDTA which can mop up calcium and magnesium. I think that people who go the chelation route are indirectly addressing these infections but without something to kill them are rarely effective. The bacteria steal nutrients such as important magnesium and have the first choice of nutrients, leaving for CFS sufferers only what they do not want or need.

I did try getting 5 d- form amino acids which are very effective at triggering the break up of a biofilm but was unable to find any place that would sell them to me as most will only sell to companies and educational establishments.

It's been very frustrating knowing the cause and not being able to purchase what I need to defeat it. Things have changed though and I think that persistence has paid because I believe that I now have what I need to do that...... However I think that I have broken my ankle so yet more delays.

 

[sb4]

@Carl Very interesting,

I too have had slight success from CS. I also got ill when I had tonsilitus and a stomach ulcer over 2 weeks. I suspect I have bacteria problems also.

However I put this to you,
What causes the poor stomach function?

I think the virus gets in and fucks up our immune systems, Virus dies but immune system is left unbalanced and antibodies are produced. Some vicious circle causes system to stay out of balance (emf enters here) and antibodies lead to POTS or muscarinic antibodies. This is what cause slow digestion and this results in bacteria overgrowth.

Is it possible cs is reducing immune load by killing bacteria and therefore easing antibodies = feel better

Also have you tried using supplements transdermally (magnesium)?

 

[Hip]

Because I worked out the cause of CFS 3 years ago and have been attempting to destroy the infection ever since.

Generally speaking, the cause of ME/CFS is not known (although ME/CFS is linked to chronic active infections with enterovirus, EBV, HHV-6 and cytomegalovirus). In certain cases, such as parvovirus B19 induced ME/CFS and Chlamydia pneumoniae-induced ME/CFS, there is perhaps stronger evidence that these infections may be causes of ME/CFS.

So saying you "worked out the cause of CFS" is just wishful thinking.

What infections were you tested for, and which ones were positive?

My stomach infection is so severe and the permeability so great that it is enough to show in the iris. Radii Solaris only show when the infection is severe and permeability is very high. I have 5 markings in my irises and the largest was mostly eliminated at the end of last year. I am attempting to now destroy the rest.

I see, so you are basing your diagnosis of a stomach infection on the pseudoscientific nonsense that is iridology? Are all your diagnoses based on pseudoscience, or did you have some actual medical tests?

Many people complain of stomach upset and poor digestion, low stomach acid and.........burping and runny noses when eating. I noticed all of this and put it all together.

At best you might have a theory or hypothesis of what causes ME/CFS, but claiming you know the cause is the wrong use of language. In science, it is important to distinguish between what is known to be true, and what is an idea or hypothesis.

It's the biofilms which cause the leaky gut

Do you have a reference for that?