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PEM from long car trip

Discussion in 'Post-Exertional Malaise, Fatigue, and Crashes' started by soxfan, Nov 13, 2017.

  1. echobravo

    echobravo Keep searching, the answer is out there

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    Interesting. Do you have the link?
     
  2. echobravo

    echobravo Keep searching, the answer is out there

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    Coccyx?
     
  3. 2Cor.12:9

    2Cor.12:9 Senior Member

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    [QUOTE="soxfan, post: 933736, member: 236"
    Does anyone else get this from car rides?[/QUOTE]

    Absolutely! We had to take two long road trips out of state last summer for my husband's work. 10 hrs each way, but stayed in a hotel half way there and back. I didn't drive. Even though I was able to rest in bed the whole time we were gone, I'm still in bed recovering from the whole thing.

    I still have anxiety in the car resulting from a serious car accident over 40 years ago. I can sort of relax on quiet roads with little traffic.

    I'm very aware of how stimulating driving (even as a passenger) is on all of the senses - driving anxiety or not.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
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  4. lnester7

    lnester7 Seven

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    If it is not on this one let me know and I will find you the paper on his physio therapists treatment, but I think is covered in this one.

     
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  5. nettle_tea

    nettle_tea

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    Yes, definitely. PEM from long car rides (especially when I was driving) started long before I developed problems with exercise. Long public transit trips are the worst. Being out of the house for long periods of time, especially in situations where I didn't have the option to lie down, were my earliest triggers.
     
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  6. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    It takes less than an hour of driving to trigger my PEM. I live half an hour's drive from town, and driving there and back pretty much guarantees a lousy next day. I usually just go into town every three weeks or so, to restock food and library books.
     
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  7. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    What made a HUGE difference for a friend of mine was connecting an anti-static strip to the bottom of his vehicle (image below). He bought it at a local auto parts store for about $6 or so. I've not gotten around to buying and connecting one to my vehicle, even though I feel it should be a priority (I think we all know how that goes). :rolleyes:

    I just tried finding some good video(s) and or testimonials on them, but couldn't come up with anything particularly good. THIS VIDEO gave me the best insights so far. I'm looking forward to giving this a try though, as even short trips can easily do me in. My friend doesn't have CFS, but is very electro-sensitive. He swears by this grounding strip (also known as a "strap").

    @Hip, if this works as well as my friend says it does, it might be worth mentioning in your PEM Busters thread. -- I'd be interested if anybody else can find a good video and/or information. -- Thanks.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
  8. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    The grounding strap sounds silly to me. The vehicle is already connected to the pavement by four rubber tires, with far more total electrical conductance than a skinny strip. Also, the pavement probably is a lousy conductor, so connecting to it doesn't do much for draining static charge quickly.

    As for being sensitive to electric charges, that also seems unlikely to me. As far as I remember, if you build up a static charge on your body, it's only on the outside of your body, and thus can't affect biochemistry inside. Just checked what 'electrosensitivity' is, which is sensitivity to electromagnetic fields. Static charge is only an electric field, with no magnetic component, so it shouldn't affect people who are affected by electromagnetic fields. Of course, there doesn't seem to be any real scientific evidence for sensitivity to EMF either...

    The grounding strap sounds similar to the gadget marketed to 'protect vehicles from rust!' by giving it an electric charge. This totally ignores the actual physics of electrochemical corrosion protection which requires a second electrode and a conductive fluid. Connecting just one wire to a car does not give it electrochemical protection. I detest marketing scams based on incorrect science. :mad:
     
  9. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    I wasn't trying to force you or anybody else into believing in, or even trying the static strip. Just relaying what my friend told me, and he said it makes a huge difference for him. I'll trust him for now, and wait until I've tried it out for myself to discern whether it or not it works.

    If it does, then any "scientific evidence" to the contrary would be totally meaningless to me (as has happened in numerous other instances). -- If somebody's up for risking $6, it may be worth it to consider giving it a try. Given how much driving impacts most of the posters on this thread, it just might be worth the gamble--you never know.​
     
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  10. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    The same applies to magic healing crystals: you never know absolutely totally 100% for sure that it won't work...but you can be pretty sure that it won't. The static elimination strap just doesn't make any sense scientifically, since, as I said, it doesn't do anything that the conductive rubber tires aren't already doing.
     
  11. soxfan

    soxfan Senior Member

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    I can drive short distances with no problems ....but I can’t do highways as my brain can’t handle all the traffic . I can drive to get myself shopping but then it’s the shopping that tires me out so then I have to drive home with “shopping”fatigue.

    It’s just the loooong car rides that get me. I still think for me it is the passing scenery and cars that exhaust my brain. Too much mental stimulation?
     
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  12. Basilico

    Basilico Florida

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    My husband often gets really exhausted from being a passenger, but it's not consistent. Some times a 4 hour drive does't bother him at all while other times even just 2 hours really wrecks him (though not to the point of getting PEM).

    One thing we've found to be very helpful is that while I drive, if he starts feeling crappy, we stop the car and he gets in the back seat to lay down, and sometimes closes his eyes and listens to a podcast or some relaxing music. Doing this allows him to tolerate longer car trips without problems. Have you ever tried something like this?
     
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  13. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    Hi Soxfan,

    I have a bed set up in my van, and often use it when doing things "out in the world", such as shopping. I've often come out of a store, and collapsed in my bed in the parking lot for up to a half hour or more. Often I go to sleep when taking this break.

    When I know it's going to be an especially difficult task, I will take my alpha-stim appliance (micro-current therapy) with me, that helps a lot to recover while I'm resting in my van. I've posted fairly extensively about my alpha-stim experience here on PR.​
     
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  14. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    I ventured out into the world today, and saw a most peculiar thing on a vehicle at Costco. The owner had attached a belt to his bumper, and looked a lot like the static strip I mentioned above. As I and another shopper were talking about it, the owner of the vehicle showed up.

    He said he was using it as a static strip, and it worked because the leather in the belt acted as a conductor of static, grounding it to the road. He made a comment about how it worked similarly to the static strips that commercial propane delivery trucks use, to minimize the risk of sparks and potential explosions.

    I asked him whether he had noticed a difference since using the belt as a static strip. He turned to me with a smile, and said he no longer gets "car sick". He seemed happy as a lark! -- For those who don't want to invest $6 in a static strip at an auto parts store, an old leather belt appears to work just as well.​
     
  15. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    Well, for the placebo effect, even an insulating plastic strip will be just as effective.

    A quick check shows that there are some modern tires that aren't as conductive as the old ones, so I suppose that we might need conductive strips at some point, or tires with conductivity designed in, as some patents show. Static charge on a vehicle shouldn't make any difference to the occupants, since the vehicle shields them from it (the charge stays on the outside).
     
  16. Wayne

    Wayne Senior Member

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    If you do a little searching on Youtube, you'll run across several videos on vehicle static, referencing how it builds up in human bodies. They describe / demonstrate various grounding techniques to discharge static so you don't get static shocks after getting out of the vehicle.

    One technique is to grab onto the side of the vehicle before you get out, which apparently grounds the built up static, thus preventing any shocks afterwards. -- This is likely my last post on the topic. To each their own. I'll probably give it a try. Nothing to lose, perhaps plenty to gain, given how much driving depletes me.​
     
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  17. Stretched

    Stretched Senior Member

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    I think it’s sensory overload through stress on the eyes into the brain. I get the same effects in driving and in crowds which I especially try to avoid. Maybe multi changes in muscular focal length is involved as this can happen watching TV and moving around in and out of other rooms.

    I ruined a vacation a couple of years ago by driving 350 miles to the beach. I then spent the week on the sofa looking out while my understanding wife had to go out
    by herself and bring food back. My PEM was a ‘10’ until the last day... .
     
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  18. soxfan

    soxfan Senior Member

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    @Stretched ...I think you are correct that it’s sensory overload on the eyes and brain. I would never be able to drive that far! I would probably have brain crash half way through. I mostly drive back roads to anyplace I go to but my husband does almost all the driving.
    I think next time we have to take a long driving trip I will use an eye mask and maybe that will help with the next day PEM ...
     
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  19. Wishful

    Wishful Senior Member

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    Just out of curiosity, I checked my tires' conductivity. My old summer tires were about as conductive as a leather belt, but with much more contact area than a strap, so adding a strap would make no difference. My tractor tires were significantly more conductive. My snow tires are insulating, so a static charge could build up. I can't find a value for conductivity of pavement, so I don't know whether a conductive strap would drain a charge at a significant rate. Fuel trucks most likely have to connect a grounding wire to a specified grounding point (wires or rods in the soil) rather than expecting a little rubber strap to drain a charge.

    Of course, none of this affects the occupants of the vehicle, unless it's a plastic-bodied vehicle or an open (no top) vehicle. A regular metal-bodied vehicle is the most common place that an electrosensitive person would be safe, since they'd be shielded by the Faraday cage effect. Charge the vehicle to megavolts, and the occupants would be completely unaffected.

    The 'static charge causes car sickness' concept seems to be a silly superstition.
     
  20. Stretched

    Stretched Senior Member

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    <<...The 'static charge causes car sickness' concept seems to be a silly superstition....>>
    Well, at least there are ‘divining rods’ for finding water...;)
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2017

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