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Olive Leaf Extract

Discussion in 'Antivirals, Antibiotics and Immune Modulators' started by Michelle, Sep 8, 2009.

  1. Michelle

    Michelle Decennial ME/CFS patient

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    Hydroxytyrosol promotes mitochondrial biogenesis and mitochondrial function in 3T3-L1 adipocytes Journal of Nutritional Biochemistry (In press).


    I was actually reading this initially in the Lee Swanson Research Update, which focused on the benefits this has on obesity and cardiovascular complications of diabetes. However as I was reading the study, it sounds like it could be applicable to us. To be sure my biochemistry is remarkably rusty. But with a conclusion like this -- "These data suggest that HT is able to promote mitochondrial function by stimulating mitochondrial biogenesis" -- as well as how it does it "HT is an activator of 5′AMP-activated protein kinase and also up-regulates gene expression of PPARα, CPT-1 and PPARγ" and reading about how all of those are involved in energy metabolism, I keep feeling there's something possibly quite interesting here that I can't put my finger on.

    Or not. LOL! Who knows?
  2. Min

    Min Senior Member

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    That's very interesting, thank you for posting it.
  3. Chris

    Chris Senior Member

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    Thanks, Michelle

    Michelle, thanks for this; I am still trying to think through this fatty acids stuff; this adds to the mix--and the confusion! but working through that is how progress is made. Chris
  4. mindwing

    mindwing

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    It looks interesting, especially since it isn't recommending a suplement, just using olove oil in cooking.

    mindwing
    http://mlburch.wordpress.com/
  5. euroka

    euroka Guest

    I find Olive Leaf Extract (herbal tincture of the leaves) very helpful for infections. Ever since I started using it at the first sign of something, I've stopped relapsing every time I get a bug. Also sometimes the infection disappears before it even got a footing.

    Unfortunately it drops blood pressure so you have to be careful if you're already hypotensive, I only take it before bed or if I was planning on not being upright for several hours anyway (which I always do if I'm coming down with something).

    Because of the swine flu scare coming at the same time as the Australian flu season, I actually started taking Olive Leaf Extract every day back in April or May. Interestingly my health has improved drastically since then. I have done several other things with the potential for a big impact, but it'd be interesting if the OLE was playing a part. I suppose it could treat any chronic infection I was carrying around.

    A few times I've decided to stop taking it and have just not felt as great the next day. Bit yucky in the throat... I don't remember whether I always felt like this before taking the OLE.... it's so easy to adjust to a new level of illness severity and forget what it was like before! I've also been having a lot of intense night sweats so I really do think it's fighting something. For the first time in my whole illness I am starting to get the odd occasion of waking refreshed (after a night of intense sweating)

    I think it's definately one of the good ones anyway, and great that it is not a synthetic supplement. I will be keeping this in my toolkit for life even if totally recovered, it's just that good for infections. :)
  6. euroka

    euroka Guest

    No problems Sarah!

    Yep the OLE can be a real blood pressure problem. I don't know whether it's some substance within it, or the alcohol in the extract. Probably both.

    I do best taking 5ml right before I get in bed. The BP effect happens within just a few minutes so I make sure I've done everything I need to do and am lying down. This way you can get the positive effects of treating acute or chronic infection, without increasing your daily disability by dropping already too low blood pressure.

    I find it helpful though actually when I have an acute infection as it FORCES me to lie down and rest. Olive Leaf Extract and total down time are extremely effective for me at the first sign of infection.

    Good luck with it :cool:
  7. liverock

    liverock Senior Member

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  8. acer2000

    acer2000 Senior Member

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    OK who has tried Olive Leaf Extract and what have the results been? What was the dose you took? I am asking because:

    Moloney Murine Leukemia Virus redirects to "MLV" or Murine Leukemia Virus - a close cousin of XMRV.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murine_leukemia_virus
  9. liverock

    liverock Senior Member

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    OLE is also supposed to be effective against HIV so it may well be worth considering, although I have no personal experience of its effect on viruses. I take OLE to control parasites and candida in the gut.

    http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-111303996.html
  10. SDD1244

    SDD1244 Guest

    I also take olive leaf extract. I can't really post any personal experiences, but I take it because an Immunologist recommended it to me and I've also done research on it and figure it can't hurt and can only help.
  11. cfs since 1998

    cfs since 1998 *****

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    I definitely think olive leaf extract has huge potential. I started taking it in February to fight what I suspected was chronic EBV infection. I had some severe reactions to it that were nearly identical to those taking Valcyte. In vitro studies found it to be effective against herpes viruses. It was also found to inhibit MLV DNA polymerase and more recently HIV integrase. It is also an antioxidant and anti-inflammatory. It was found to normalize gene expression that had been modified by HIV in infected cells. It has even been patented for use as an antiviral treatment: http://www.google.com/patents/about?id=3ugKAAAAEBAJ

    However I found that not all the brands are the same. I took the NSI brand from vitacost.com for several months because of the price, but it did not work and also upset my stomach. I use Nature's Way. They make several kinds and the one I use is the most potent one they make, it has 250mg olive leaf extract standardized to 20% oleuropein and 235mg plain olive leaf in each capsule. I started with 2 capsules 3 times per day. I'm now taking 6 capsules every 6 hours.
  12. cfs since 1998

    cfs since 1998 *****

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    Update

    Okay, here's an update. Well I've been on OLE for almost a year. I wasn't really seeing improvements, yet I wasn't herxing or anything like that either. Just nothing seemed to be happening, so I thought it wasn't doing anything anymore. Therefore, last week I finished off the rest of the olive leaf I had on hand--my last dose was Thursday I think. I figured maybe if I took a break for a week or two, then went back on it, it might start working again.

    What a terrible idea THAT was--big big mistake! About 48 hours later I had extreme pain in my head and the next day it spread to my spine. I think the viruses in my brain and spine started partying. I was still taking a half dozen other supplements and they didn't seem to be helping. I suffered with the pain Saturday and Sunday and today I just had to go the health food store and buy some more. It costs twice as much as what I pay online but it was worth it.

    So even though I haven't improved substantially yet, I think olive leaf extract is doing its job in keeping at least certain viruses at bay. It truly seems to be one of the most powerful natural antivirals out there. I guess it will just take a long time to see improvement; the people on Valtrex/Valcyte seem to have the same problem for the most part.
  13. Hysterical Woman

    Hysterical Woman Senior Member

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    CFS Since 1998

    Hi CFS Since 1998,

    Thanks for the update, I appreciate it and I am sure others do too. It is encouraging to know that the olive leaf extract is "working" for you. It is certainly a lot cheaper than valcyte! :Retro smile:

    I would be back trying it myself, but am currently on a combo of inosine and artesunate. Don't think I should mix the olive leaf in since I am so sensitive to everything.

    Please keep us updated on how you are doing.

    Take care,

    Maxine
  14. froufox

    froufox Senior Member

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    Hi CFS Since 1998 and all

    Thanks for sharing your experience of olive leaf, its interesting that you didnt realise it was doing something until you stopped taking it. I've been taking it too Ive tried it many times before but not stuck to it for very long because of the expense. I've always taken the East Park Research one (the one that is patented and was used in some of the original research) though I didnt know there were cheaper brands that worked just as well so will definitely try a different brand when I finish the one I have off. It will be interesting to compare. The one I take contains about 22% oleuropein so I have been told.

    I've been taking 6 caps a day for a few weeks this time and just this past week I've come down with really severe flu/cold like symptoms. I also recently started LDN and have been on the methylation supps too for a while but I'm pretty sure its the olive leaf that has triggered this immune reaction though obviously it could just be the combined effect of everything I'm doing.

    Apart from the flu symptoms and cold sores I'm getting lots of emotional/aggressive outbursts and my adrenals feel shot. I look pretty ill too. Before the flu symptoms I was getting lots & lots of nausea sometimes lasting all day some days. Anyway I've stopped taking it for a few days now and hopefully the sx will calm down in a few days time. What herx sx did you get?

    One of my ex practitioners was very ill with ME/CFS for 10yrs and was house and bedbound a lot and she credits olive leaf with getting her well alongside a form of homeopathy that she did too. She took 6 caps a day of the East Park Research one for 2 yrs. So it does seem that for it to work at least for some people anyway you do have to take it for quite a long period.

    It definitely does appear to work on retroviruses too I agree - I remember finding some info on the Mark Konlee Keep Hope Alive site a while ago where some people with HIV had a huge reduction in their viral loads when they introduced olive leaf. They used olive leaf tea, not capsules - Konlee recommended the tea over the capsules due to the inconsistency in quality of the batches of the caps due to the varying levels of the active ingredient oleuropein.

    I just wondered if you got any improvements intially after you got past the herx or did it just seem like it was doing nothing as you said?
  15. mezombie

    mezombie Senior Member

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    Olive Leaf Extract would be my first choice if I were to try a natural anti-viral. I've researched it and have come to the same conclusions as the other posters here. Swanson has a standardized version on sale right now -- two for one.

    However, I managed to buy some Valtrex while generously reimbursed by my Rx plan and probably will try that next as I have it on hand.(I know, I know, it doesn't hit HHV-6 nor retroviruses) I don't like DIY treatment, though. I would like to have a doc who actually knows something about ME and CFS monitoring me. My current doc doesn't know squat about viral infections and still is going after my supposed "Lyme". He is running out of ideas. I have one more drug to try before I heave a big sigh and start over...again.
  16. Hysterical Woman

    Hysterical Woman Senior Member

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    Hi Marie,

    I don't think that valtrex hits CMV either. Still - might be worth trying for you. Please let us know how you do with it. As you know, this forum is an incredible repository of information.

    Take care,

    Maxine
  17. cfs since 1998

    cfs since 1998 *****

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    Lots of questions here but I'll do my best.

    I've only used two brands of OLE, Nature's Way (20% oleuropein) and NSI--the generic brand from Vitacost.com. The NSI brand seemed to not work and also upset my stomach more. I think it's made in China. I don't know where Nature's Way is made. As far as the expense, yes it is on the expensive side, however there are places online that you can buy bulk olive leaves or bulk olive leaf powder. You can then put it into capsules or make your own extract by steeping it in warm water. This page from the Keep Hope Alive site that you mentioned has some instructions for making it (under the heading, "HOW TO MAKE YOUR OWN OLIVE LEAF EXTRACT" a little more than a quarter down the page). I've seen bulk olive leaf just under $10/pound which is a significant savings. I haven't tried this method yet but would like to soon.

    You said you are taking 6 caps a day. Are you spreading that out over the course of the day? I think this is important, so I take mine every 6 hours. I have tried setting my alarm so I can take it on schedule during the overnight hours but I usually just shut it off and fall asleep again, so I usually only take it 3 times per day.

    You also said you had flu symptoms and cold sores. Do you mean cold sores of the herpes simplex kind? There is a person on the HHV6 Foundation forum, timaca, taking acyclovir. She said she gets cold sore outbreaks whenever she raises her acyclovir dose. I think someone posted here that they thought LDN makes olive leaf extract work better, not sure why.

    As far as my herx, it was quite surprising. About 24 hours after starting the Nature's way brand, 2 capsules every 4 hours, I got an extreme headache, and eventually pain in the back of my neck, like my brainstem hurt. My jaw and other joints start popping and it hurt to turn my head (many of these same symptoms were reported by a few people when they started Valcyte). The scariest part was the extreme TMJ I got, it felt like electrical impulses zapping my jaw and making it open and close! (No on else reported this to my knowledge). About 5 days later, extreme fatigue set in and lasted for about 3 days. My headache began to subside slightly, but I raised the dosage several times and this pattern repeated. I eventually came to the point where raising it even further did not produce any additional "herx" so I stayed on a maintenance dose of about 18 caps/day until, as I posted, I decided to try to stop it for a few weeks and start it again. About 48 hours after stopping it, it was like I began herxing in reverse. Once I started taking it again it took another 48 hours for my "reverse herx" to subside.

    You mentioned that your adrenals feel shot. I believe that this treatment made my adrenals worse as well, especially during the 3-day periods of extreme fatigue (which I'm actually going through again with Tagamet, see the Tagamet thread in the general treatment section). But I suspect this would happen with any antiviral treatment. I had been taking adrenal supplements for years and stopped all of them when I shifted to an antiviral approach so that probably compounded the problem.

    Overall I really don't feel any better or worse than I did a year ago, but there must be SOMETHING happening. I hope what's happening is that my viral load is slowly decreasing and it will eventually make a difference--like you said it took your former practitioner 2 years so that gives me hope! I has been almost one year for me. About 11 months I think. So maybe it will take another year.

    I understand why you would not like DIY treatment. You might consider taking a low to modest dose of OLE along with the Valtrex--they might be synergistic. Maybe one or two capsules of OLE with each Valtrex dose. Of course I'm not a doctor so don't take that as medical advice :Retro smile:
  18. froufox

    froufox Senior Member

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    Hi CFS since 1998, thanks for repying in such detail. Yes that was the page that I read on the Keep Hope Alive site. I did think of trying to make the tea but then never did in the end but like you would really like to if I can get hold of some good quality leaves. As you say its a lot cheaper! Let me know if you do and if it feels any different to the capsules.

    Yes I was taking 2 caps 3 times a day and spread out about 4-5 hours apart.

    Thats interesting that LDN might enhance the actions of olive leaf....I'll try and find that post - it might explain why Ive been feeling so bad the last few days since adding in the LDN...it has felt like a huge immune reaction.

    Those symptoms you got sound pretty awful and thats very strange with the TMJ symptom too, wow. I've never heard of that either. Thats very interesting about the 'reverse herxing' too, just shows what a powerful effect it was having on you.

    I know that they tell you to start slowly like on 1 cap a day and build up so maybe thats why you got such a strong reaction. When I started back on olive leaf last yr I took 3 caps all at once and had a terrible reaction then too I was in bed all day with severe gut pains, narcolepsy and suicidal depression presumably from inflammatory cytokines. Then I definitely did feel better but it didnt last unfortunately. Funny as other times I've taken it I've felt better almost immediately energywise so I've had lots of different reactions to olive leaf.

    I always get cold sores when I take OL tho and its interesting to know that people get a similar reaction from acyclovir. Maybe this is just part of the herx and some symptoms temporarily appearing/worsening?

    I think olive leaf can lower blood pressure too - I wonder if thats another reason why the adrenals worsen.

    Good luck with it anyway, it will be interesting to hear if it does eventually make a difference to how you feel.
  19. cfs since 1998

    cfs since 1998 *****

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    It seems that when someone, at least someone with CFS, starts an antiviral, it temporarily causes the virus to reactivate. I am not sure of the mechanism involved. You can't inhibit latent virus anyway so this is probably a good thing. This probably only applies to herpes viruses, and maybe only happens in people with an immune deficiency.

    Yes I have read this too. I do have problems with postural hypotension especially in the summer, and people with low blood pressure are advised not to take it. However, thankfully OLE did not make that problem of mine worse. My BP is the same as before, I don't think it went down, not even during "herxing".
  20. garcia

    garcia Aristocrat Extraordinaire

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    This is probably a good time to mention that a lot of the time I take isoprinosine I get a herpes "activation", i.e. a tingling in my lips a few minutes later. It's a strong noticable reaction. I put activation in quotes, because it doesn't feel like the kind of activation you get from immuno-suppression, but rather as CFS98 said it feels like its waking-up the virus then killing it straight away. It feels good.

    Conversely if I e.g. eat lots of nuts (high in arginine) I will get a proper herpes reactivation (with no killing) and a cold-sore. That most definitely does not feel good!

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