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OAT Results are In - Insights sought!

Discussion in 'Genetic Testing and SNPs' started by Journeyman, Jan 15, 2017.

  1. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior Member

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    Hi Folks,

    I've recently come into receipt of some much sought after Organic Acid Testing (OAT) results to compliment my existing 23 & Me data. I'm far less familiar with OAT interpreting compared to SNP interpreting (which I at least have a reasonable working knowledge of) so I welcome any keen insights you might have on my results per the attached report.

    I've got my own queries and ideas to test but before that I'll leave it to the more experienced/informed members of our community to give their insights into the OAT report. Please note that any insights would be much appreciated - so long as they're backed up by reliable information and even if you only wish to comment on one particular aspect of the report I still welcome your input.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. CCC

    CCC Senior Member

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    Sorry to be a pain, but would you mind doing the pdf of your results again? It's so blurry, I can't read it. If you can save a higher quality pdf, we might find it easier going.

    Many thanks
     
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  3. *GG*

    *GG* Senior Member

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    I am no expert on this, but found the Doc fuzzy as well. I had this testing done years ago! Willing to post for comparison, if someone is interested, but think they are very personalized, so probably no value in that.

    GG
     
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  4. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior Member

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    Thanks so much @CCC and @*GG** - without your responses I would have been wondering this whole time why I wasn't getting any replies... Have now uploaded a more legible version and look forward to your insights.

    Regards

    Journeyman
     
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  5. *GG*

    *GG* Senior Member

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  6. aquariusgirl

    aquariusgirl Senior Member

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    Still fuzzy ..but readable ....bad bacterial markers ..,,I think high DHhPA suggests clostridia... @ least according to one of my practitioners I think.

    I am not familiar or comfortable w/OATs ...but I was looking to see if you had markers for oxolate problems since this is what I am treating right now & it seems to be low hanging fruit.

    You do have low biotin so maybe worth asking over on the Trying Low Oxolate Facebook group.

    But were you taking Vit C when this test was done?
     
  7. aquariusgirl

    aquariusgirl Senior Member

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  8. aquariusgirl

    aquariusgirl Senior Member

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  9. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior Member

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    GG, Do you realise that folic acid is a synthetic form of folate that can actually be contra beneficial depending on your gene status. Get yourself a decent B supplement that has Methyl Folate rather than Folic Acid. Try this one - I think its the closest thing to a multi B that ticks all the boxes... http://au.iherb.com/Advanced-Orthom...eries-Advanced-B-Complex-90-Veggie-Caps/33062
    Other than that am I to make some inference from your post that these supplements address my specific issues as identified in the OAT??

    Regards
    Journeyman
     
  10. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior Member

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    I had a quick look at that page but am struggling to link it with any kind of OAT interpretation. Tell me more about the 'amigos' and which ones in particular might be linked with Autism...

    Regards
    Journeyman
     
  11. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior Member

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    I've been supplementing with about 4 x 250mg Vit C over the day for days leading up to the test and I'd been eating lots of peanuts and some almonds so I think this might explain the high oxalate readings. In any event, if it was serious wouldn't it be chronically elevated like multiple times outside the reference range??

    The bacteria markers stunned me because I honestly understood my intestinal flora to be near perfect given my years of wheat/dairy free diet and regular intake of power probiotics such as this: http://www.amcal.com.au/life-space-...86198&pkw=&pmt=&plid=&product=P_9331927003241

    coupled with this for the acidophilus and bifido: http://ethicalnutrients.com.au/Products/Product?groupkey=IHC

    This makes me wonder just how polluted I'd be if i lived like an everyday joe taking normal diet and no probiotics and perhaps even with antibiotics thrown in....

    It does seem, however, that I need to pin down what kind of bacteria are my problem and it seems we can rule out C. Difficile which is the only one positively associated with inhibiting DBH enzyme ??? Might need someone really clued up about OAT to answer this one....

    Regards

    Journeyman
     
  12. aquariusgirl

    aquariusgirl Senior Member

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    Typo....amino acids

    You lack some amino acids ..,,I linked to an amino acid formulation
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2017
  13. *GG*

    *GG* Senior Member

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    Not sure, not well versed in all this, just trying to help out. I had the OATs test done years ago, and very much trust my Drs advice. He helped me stay in the workforce for years more than I likely would have survived on my own!

    GG
     
  14. Paralee

    Paralee Senior Member

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    I've been wondering about the OAT test, thanks for showing that, @Journeyman . I was looking through the site and wondering why it doesn't show prices for a particular test if you're just going to pay yourself. I don't know enough about the test to advise, but it does seem to show some things I need. Paralee
     
  15. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior Member

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    After revisiting the report and noting a couple of my bacterial markers suggestive of small intestinal bacterial overgrowth (SIBO) it reminded me of the often neglected importance of gut health to the rest of our function. So with a bit of Googling I quickly stumbled across a great presentation by Dr Kurt Woeller on the Great Plains site itself:
    https://www.greatplainslaboratory.c...-treatments-and-using-the-organic-acids-tests

    He specifically refers to the marker #15 : 4-Hydroxyphenylacetic acid as being a clostridia marker and goes on to cite a 1970's journal article where the researchers were insightful enough to recognise a link between elevations of this marker (4-Hydroxyphenylacetic acid) and small bowel disease. Similarly the marker was associated with Giardia which is a common parasitic infection identified in about 10% of all stool samples submitted...

    He also pointed out almost instantly on showing the bacterial markers page of the OAT that elevated arabinose is associated with yeast overgrowth and this marker was elevated substantially in my OAT.

    It seems that simply pumping your digestive system full of probiotics is not the solution, and that when these beneficial bacteria find their way into the wrong compartment of your GI tract (from the large intestine to the small) that the problems start. Can anyone confirm this because I would have thought there's no detriment to having high levels of beneficial bacteria in the small intestine (even if they normally reside in the large)?? Perhaps they mean that by virtue of the beneficial bacteria being in the small intestine, it shows that theres a problem with the ileocecal valve causing backflow of large intestine contents to the small and so bacterial overgrowth is inevitable from the backflow of stool toxicities??

    Now I need to find the best value option for a comprehensive stool analysis so I can rule out Giardia or other parasitic infection before doing a hydrogen/methane breath test which is the gold standard for identifying SIBO. So far I've found http://www.gastrolab.com.au/ who offer single test types for $105, and since its recommended to test for Lactullose, fructose and lactose it looks like I'm up for $315 plus the costs associated with going for the 3 separate occasions mandated for each test (can't do them simultaneously apparently) Anyone have any other suggestions for both the CSDA (stool analysis) and a hydrogen breath test around Sydney Australia or indeed internationally noting that Great Plains turned out cheapest for the OAT (and good quality) ??

    Looks like a low FODMAP diet for me soon.. but not before some further tests...
     
  16. renski

    renski Senior Member

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    I think based on some of your markers being elevated you have SIBO of some form, the Hippuric, DHPPA, 4-Hydroxyphenylacetic acid. I don't think a SIBO breathe test is going to help anymore, they don't even detect the streptococcus type species, or the clostridia (which the OAT does). You could just do one of those 4R gut programs, just make sure you do it with a doctor, you can really mess things up (like I did and have not been able to recover since). Make sure you are taking probiotics while taking the anti-microbial.

    I noticed your dopamine is elevated (although a doctor I saw suggested if that marker is high it means you are low on dopamine), and that could be because of the clostridia or your adrenals could be pumping out cortisol. HVA is a marker of stress but if your inflamed (from the gut or something else) then your cortisol levels will be high. You could try an adrenal panel to confirm the cortisol bit.

    Looks like you have low B6, maybe check yourself for pyroluria? I don't know for certain but the CBS pathway uses B6, so there could be an issue there as well.

    The best stool test IMO is the GI effects from Genova. Biohealth also do a good test for the parasites which some labs apparently miss (Biohealth 401H). Bioscreen is another stool test I would do, you can really see what your levels of good E.coli are with this (and also bad stuff like streptococcus)

    Your glutathione markers are a bit elevated which I think means you need to detox, the glutathione markers can also tie in with this CBS upregulation stuff.
     
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  17. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior Member

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    I was kind of hoping that my reply to AnxiousGuy's thread in the Gut forum would get the attention of someone clued up on both the Gut and the Organic Acids/Methylation side of things and it seems my ploy worked! .-)

    As you suggest, I decided against the breath test or feaces test after reading that even the feaces test often gives no result for many of the bacteria, even when they are known to be problematic... So I've just gone straight to the herbal antibiotics after reading that herbal antibiotics are equally if not more effective in treating SIBO than the prescription ones (which cost like $556/packet here in Oz.... and on that point let me know what you think of this protocol:
    https://sexysibo.blogspot.com.au/2015/04/treating-sibo-with-herbal-antibiotic.html

    I'm gonna try find time to read more of your posts but tell me how in a nutshell you 'messed up' your gut rebuilding programme... I'm thinking its something to do with your approach to chelation but thats just a guess at this point...

    You also mentioned the glutathione markers being elevated and I'm glad you did. I'm starting to form the impression that SIBO is resulting in toxicity (likely from both leaky gut but also the excess acid produced by hydrogen excess in the body) PS - how exactly does higher hydrogen in the body affect the body.... if anyone can explain how it works biochemically I think its safe to say many others would be keen to know too...

    I see you've also done a lot of posts on neurotransmitters and this is a key area of interest for me too because truth is I probably have as bad anxiety tendencies as Anxiousguy whose thread we both posted in recently.... and its probably not suprising that he has almost EXACTLY the same detox panel results as me... freaky...Though perhaps not so freaky now given what I've learned recently about the importance of the gut/brain axis connection and the examples of depressed vs normal rats poop exchange experiment whereby normal rats were found to suddenly exhibit anxiety etc. after only receiving the intestinal biome of the depressed rats...

    As for dopamine (DA) elevation you've got me wondering about this paradox. You say DA is elevated but your dr seems to think this is actually indicative of low DA.... Please fill us in on this.. sounds interesting... and potentially v. useful because theres a lot of anhedonia going on even amongst all the anxiety...

    Keen to get your thoughts...

    Journeyman
     
  18. renski

    renski Senior Member

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    @Journeyman

    On the dopamine, it really seems to be up to interpretation, HVA is just a byproduct of dopamine but it doesn't really tell us if dopamine is high or not.. but I think it's high on your test. Maybe get a Neuro-biogenic amines test to confirm.. could also just take some L-Dopa and see how you react, or try something like Seditol which I think will act as a dopamine antagonist. There is obviously other stuff going on though, your serotonin/glutamate/gaba etc.

    This is supposed to be one of the better stool tests for parasites and that: http://www.holisticheal.com/gi-pathogen.html

    I messed up my gut by taking herbal antibiotics without probiotics.. threw out of the balance and gave myself more dysbiosis which gave me chronic neurological problems (due to inflammation and other shit). Just take your herbal stuff with a probiotic and you should be safe.
     
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  19. renski

    renski Senior Member

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    Looks like an alright protocol, doesn't seem to include probiotics or prebiotics.. I'm not an expert but I think to be on the safe side you should take probiotics.. there are people saying no probiotics with SIBO and then others say yes..

    Not sure about the glutathione, I have seen some stuff online where the glutathione markers normalize after gut treatments.. but I believe the glutathione marker can be elevated just if your body is trying to detox heavy metals, plastics etc.
     
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  20. Journeyman

    Journeyman Senior Member

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    Yup don't worry I already take and will continue to take a combination of two probiotics available here in Australia:
    (1) Inner Health Plus (Dairy Free) per http://ethicalnutrients.com.au/Products/product?groupkey=IHCDF which admittedly has too much bifido bacterium but then I need the lacto acidophilus which it also provides plenty of
    (2) Life Space Broad Spectrum probiotic per http://www.healthy-lifespace.com/adult/broad-spectrum-probiotic-capsules/

    I also take an array of methylation supplements including Methyl B12, Methyl Folate, P5P, Acetyl L Carnitine, Co-Q10 etc. which should keep my glutathione levels sky high... and am doing Coffee Enemas' since last thursday now to boot..

    Now my concern is how I will get the much needed estrogen detoxifying benefits of the cruciferous vegetables that have for the last 5 years formed the backbone of my diet, and which I now avoid completely on the SIBO diet... Am thinking a DIM supplement will solve the problem - thoughts???? See this thread where I've also mentioned this concern: http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?threads/an-effective-sibo-treatment-a-biofilm-disruptor-is-needed.38960/#post-811950

    Cheers

    Journeyman
     

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